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Old 08-15-2007, 03:13 PM
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Phrogging - is this for real?


Surpised that this hasn't been asked here yet, but I searched and got no results.

The new ABC show iCaught is apparently going to do a piece next week on phrogging. Supposedly, this is a somewhat new activity where a person (or persons) sneak into someone's house and live there for a few days, without the owner's knowledge or consent.

Everything seems to point back to a series of videos featuring two girls phrogging for five days. The first couple of days are on youtube, and the rest are on some other site that's linked to from the last youtube video.

There are various reasons to think that that particular piece is faked, and it's pretty well discussed in a thread on snopes.

Still, there's no smoking gun or concrete proof either way, so I thought I'd ask here: Does anyone have a definitive answer as to whether phrogging in general, and the girls' "Living with Strangers" videos are real?
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Old 08-15-2007, 03:15 PM
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I always thought that was "squatting". If so, such has happened for centuries.
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Old 08-15-2007, 03:17 PM
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I always thought that was "squatting". If so, such has happened for centuries.
I think the point is that the owners are still around when you do it.
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Old 08-15-2007, 04:00 PM
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Other than to be an asshole, what could possibly be the point of doing this?
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Old 08-15-2007, 04:10 PM
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Other than to be an asshole, what could possibly be the point of doing this?
Well, according to the girls in the videos, they want to "live in luxury" but don't want to work. So they mooch off of others, using their air-conditioned houses, eating their food, and just being lazy at someone else's expense.
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Old 08-15-2007, 04:15 PM
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I get the feeling that if it's not 'real' now, people will probably attempt it after they air the special.
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Old 08-15-2007, 05:11 PM
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Just from a feasibility standpoint i can't see it being real. With squatting its usually an abandoned/under construction building. With this its an in-use home... how are you supposed to know when/who is leaving and coming back? You could maybe get one house for 2-3 days but thats it.
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Old 08-15-2007, 05:22 PM
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You know, as horrifying as it seems, I can kinda see the thrill of attempting to get away with this. Especially if it were a rather large, luxurious home. I can imagine a lot of "guest rooms" and other places you could hide. The basement even. Then, when the residents leave for a while, or go to sleep for the night, you can sneak around, watch tv, eat their food, etc. Always living on that edge of getting caught. If you did, I can only imagine most people would be in such shock to turn on the light and see you and your cronies chilling out in one of their rooms, that you could just make a loud noise to startle them and BOLT for the door... and just keep running.

Besides trespassing and petty theft, I wonder what else the state/government can slap you with criminally?
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Old 08-15-2007, 05:25 PM
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I live in a multi unit apartment building.

At the end of a month, one of my neighbors moved out. He was asked to leave by the management, because he didn't get along well with some of the other neighbors.

He must have passed his key around, because some lady and her teen son moved in for a couple dasys, and trashed the place. (Busted out a window, vandalised the cabinets and interior doors in their general angst, I guess.) I just assumed that these two were going to be my new neighbors, and tried to ignore them like I ignore everyone else.

Turns out that they were squatters... they didnt get caught as far as I know.

Last edited by mlees; 08-15-2007 at 05:25 PM.
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Old 08-15-2007, 05:29 PM
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I would recommend against trying it in North Carolina, where the old rule of thumb that if someone is in your house and you kill them the law won't prosecute on the assumption that you believed you were in jeopardy is taken to the next level. One recent shooting involved someone trying to break into a car parked in the driveway and the homeowner wasn't prosecuted.
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Old 08-15-2007, 05:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cmyk
Besides trespassing and petty theft, I wonder what else the state/government can slap you with criminally?
Breaking and entering and/or burglary come to mind. Burglary is a felony in nearly every jurisdiction, IIRC. That, and you might just get yourself shot. If I found somebody lurking around after breaking into my house, they would definitely be doing a lot of waiting on the floor at gunpoint until the police arrived.

Frankly, though, I have my doubts if any of this is real. I just have a hard time believing that anybody could fail to notice the presence of a couple extra people in their home.
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Old 08-15-2007, 06:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Stealth Potato
Breaking and entering and/or burglary come to mind. Burglary is a felony in nearly every jurisdiction, IIRC. That, and you might just get yourself shot. If I found somebody lurking around after breaking into my house, they would definitely be doing a lot of waiting on the floor at gunpoint until the police arrived.

Frankly, though, I have my doubts if any of this is real. I just have a hard time believing that anybody could fail to notice the presence of a couple extra people in their home.
Not if you hide their bullets.

Also, could it be considered B&E, since they're not Breaking anything. Certainly Entering/trespassing. And Burglary? Perhaps... but mostly they're there for shelter, with no intention of violence or stealing. Except consumables, but in the YouTube videos they're talked of replacing anything the homeowner's might notice missing.

But, all that said, it might just be a farce. But it can be done. And usually if it can, there'll be someone around to exploit that.
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Old 08-15-2007, 06:26 PM
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Originally Posted by KneadToKnow
I would recommend against trying it in North Carolina, where the old rule of thumb that if someone is in your house and you kill them the law won't prosecute on the assumption that you believed you were in jeopardy is taken to the next level. One recent shooting involved someone trying to break into a car parked in the driveway and the homeowner wasn't prosecuted.
I was thinking along the same lines. In this part of the country, that's a damn good way to end up dead.
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Old 08-15-2007, 06:28 PM
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Originally Posted by KneadToKnow
One recent shooting involved someone trying to break into a car parked in the driveway and the homeowner wasn't prosecuted.
Wow, we just had a long drawn out case around here where a homeowner (in a crummy part of town) was getting his car broken into for like the third time. He shot (and I believe killed) the guy and he is now in jail for it.
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Old 08-15-2007, 07:00 PM
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Not if you hide their bullets.
Well, my carry piece is always loaded. It's locked in a safe when it's not on my person, which is seldom.

(Incidentally, it seems to me that Bond would have been royally screwed if Dryden had just been in the habit of carrying. Quite an oversight for a 00-hopeful, eh?)


Quote:
Also, could it be considered B&E, since they're not Breaking anything. Certainly Entering/trespassing. And Burglary? Perhaps... but mostly they're there for shelter, with no intention of violence or stealing. Except consumables, but in the YouTube videos they're talked of replacing anything the homeowner's might notice missing.
Unless the homeowner was stupid enough to leave their doors and windows unlocked, I don't know how anyone could enter a residence without dealing with the locks somehow.

Additionally, I read somewhere that typically the criteria for felony burglary is B&E with intent to commit a crime. Obviously this could be different depending on the jurisdiction, but if this is the case, it seems to me that breaking into someone's home with the intent to steal their food and live their without their knowledge or consent would be pretty clear-cut burglary.
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Old 08-15-2007, 07:04 PM
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It happened to my parents, when they went on vacation, it was called breaking and entering for the report.
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Old 08-15-2007, 07:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cmyk
Except consumables, but in the YouTube videos they're talked of replacing anything the homeowner's might notice missing.
So, they want to stay in people's homes to get by without working, but they believe they should replace anything the homeowner's might notice is missing. I would notice if there were 2 fewer bottles of water in my fridge, let alone if there was very much missing. This seems to make is sound extremely fake - "Well, we'll break and enter, and chill in people's houses while they are gone, but taking something they may notice is missing, that is a bit to far."

Does anyone have some more info on that part?

Brendon Small
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Old 08-15-2007, 07:44 PM
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I've known this to happen from time to time, but the intent wasn't quite so benign. In the cases that come to mind the (usually upscale) house was used as a drug & debauchery den for a few days. Homeowners come home from vacation or summer/winter home to a trashed house: condoms, paraphenalia, general abuse, etc. Quite shocking evidently.
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Old 08-15-2007, 07:55 PM
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Originally Posted by cmyk
Not if you hide their bullets.

Also, could it be considered B&E, since they're not Breaking anything. Certainly Entering/trespassing. And Burglary? Perhaps... but mostly they're there for shelter, with no intention of violence or stealing. Except consumables, but in the YouTube videos they're talked of replacing anything the homeowner's might notice missing.

But, all that said, it might just be a farce. But it can be done. And usually if it can, there'll be someone around to exploit that.
You're mistaken in your belief that breaking and entering involves the destruction of property.
Per a sitting judge I met in Orange County, NC, one who breaks and enters is "breaking an imaginary line in the middle of the entrance doorway to a building".
No, I've never been charged with B&E.
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Old 08-15-2007, 08:12 PM
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e considered B&E, since they're not Breaking anything. Certainly Entering/trespassing. And Burglary? Perhaps... but mostly they're there for shelter, with no intention of violence or stealing. Except consumables, but in the YouTube videos they're talked of replacing anything the homeowner's might notice missing.
I'd imagine that would still be considered stealing. You take something that isn't yours without consent. Doesn't really matter if you end up leaving something comparable. And therefore, it's burglary.

I doubt this will really result in a rash of people actually doing this. The risk/benefit is vanishingly small. I can see idiots talking up big plans, but I don't see them following through.
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Old 08-15-2007, 08:23 PM
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Ahh, ok, I've always assumed "breaking" meant to damage, not as to break a trespass line. Makes sense.

Anyway, most people leave the door unlocked from the house-proper that exits into the garage. Since most people have garage door openers, they rely on the garage door to keep out intruders. If the home owner is oblivious, you can count on them to leave their homes from their cars, hit the opener button to close, then drive off before it completely shuts. If you're lucky and stealthy enough, you can scramble out from hiding to trip the electronic eye with your foot or hand to force the garage door to open back up again.

They've driven off... you're in their garage, you quickly re-close the garage door from the inside, and now you're in their home without literally breaking anything... except the law.

I can see thrill-seeking punks doing this for benign enough reasons. It's dangerous, conniving, challenging, and the potential for voyeurism/eavesdropping. Stupid too, but that should be no surprise.

Last edited by cmyk; 08-15-2007 at 08:23 PM.
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Old 08-15-2007, 08:30 PM
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I'd imagine that would still be considered stealing. You take something that isn't yours without consent. Doesn't really matter if you end up leaving something comparable. And therefore, it's burglary.

I doubt this will really result in a rash of people actually doing this. The risk/benefit is vanishingly small. I can see idiots talking up big plans, but I don't see them following through.
Right, well since most people put a gradient on severity on stealing, I would think stealing 20-40 bucks in food pretty minor as opposed to breaking in to actually burglarize the home in the traditional sense, like stealing the HD TV, jewelry, irreplaceable valuables and sentimental items, etc. Whether fake or not, the intent seems to be relatively more humane than that, but still perverse, in a self-indulging and privacy crossing way.
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Old 08-15-2007, 08:31 PM
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So, they want to stay in people's homes to get by without working, but they believe they should replace anything the homeowner's might notice is missing. I would notice if there were 2 fewer bottles of water in my fridge, let alone if there was very much missing. This seems to make is sound extremely fake - "Well, we'll break and enter, and chill in people's houses while they are gone, but taking something they may notice is missing, that is a bit to far."
I don't know, but I can see this being a sort-of an extreme sport of not getting caught rather than trying to mooch.
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Old 08-15-2007, 09:05 PM
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Do you people thinking this is minor, realize how unsafe you feel for a long time after your house has been broken into. Jack shit in merchandise stolen, your peace of mind gone.
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Old 08-15-2007, 09:29 PM
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Do you people thinking this is minor, realize how unsafe you feel for a long time after your house has been broken into. Jack shit in merchandise stolen, your peace of mind gone.
Knowing that people have, and might still be for all you know, living secretly in your house is the stuff of nightmares. It is a potential symptom of a paranoid delusional disorder until you discover it is real and then what do you do?
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Old 08-15-2007, 10:17 PM
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The coffee maker is what makes me call bullshit on the girls. It's a CuisinArt Grind and Brew, the same sort of coffee maker that my parents have. They've mentioned hearing the noise of coffee being ground in the morning, so the residents of the house use that function of the coffee maker, but apparently routinely leave two mugs worth of coffee-about four cups in my experience-left each day. Whole beans aren't overly expensive, but they also aren't cheap enough that its reasonable to believe people would regularly throw out a third of a pot of coffee everyday.

The other option is that they're making their own coffee after the residents leave. I don't buy that either. That model has two different parts for the grinding mechanism, three different parts for the filter, a hidden button on the side that gives you access to the filter, a carafe, and a lid to said carafe. It has seven pieces that need to be cleaned and reassembled to make a pot of coffee. The grinding mechanism and the filter parts are not intuitive to get to either. If you're unfamiliar with the coffee maker, it's tricky to use. If they were making their own coffee in the morning, I would imagine them mentioning that it's lucky they already knew how to use the damn thing, or would have taped them find the manual/figuring out how to use it. Seriously, I'm fairly technologically adept, but that model of coffee maker is overly complicated.

So, yeah, there are a couple of things that put off my BS meter, but as soon as I noticed the coffee maker, I realized that this case couldn't be real.
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Old 08-15-2007, 10:39 PM
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Okay – so far i'm into early day 3.

There's been 2 times where I felt my BS meter red-line. One was the first time the homeowners woke up in the morning, the dude came down fully clothed before 9am, and put on the tv, then the woman upstairs asked if the coffee was ready and could he get her a cup. He responded, Why don't you get it yourself?. Just felt really staged and stilted.

Another time was when they were on the roof, day 2, and they forgot they left the projector out. Ugly Chick #2, I think Rene, was clearly bummed, but it didn't seem all that believable.

That said, most of the time, it seems pretty damn genuine more times than not. And there's been a couple freaky moments so far. If it is real, the argument could be made that they know they're on camera, and this changes their candid behavior somewhat. During times where they almost get caught, I have to say, their actions, words and behavior seem pretty damn realistic.

Here's a better place to watch them all. I think there are 5 or so days? Maybe more?

And believe you me, My car's been robbed several times, and stolen once. It's an overwhelming sense of violation. I can only imagine it happening to my home/family. God forbid. The point with these creeps is to NOT get caught, and not leave a trace... then disappearing into the night. If this IS real, i feel horrible for the couple when they eventually see it's their house being raped like this. Huge blowing of the mind and the peace inside it.
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Old 08-15-2007, 11:14 PM
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Y'know... now that I think about it, it's more akin to stowing-away, than squatting.
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Old 08-15-2007, 11:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MissMossie
So, yeah, there are a couple of things that put off my BS meter, but as soon as I noticed the coffee maker, I realized that this case couldn't be real.
I don't know about that. I don't have enough of a routine to know how much coffee to make so when I used to make drip I'd make the full pot every time. Half or more of that would go to waste. Part of the reason I stopped making drip.
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Old 08-15-2007, 11:59 PM
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End of day 1:
One couple who work long hours and at least 3 bedrooms. It seems plausable that they can hide out for a while. I fear the cigarettes will give them away since the smell is insidious to non-smokers. Only BS trigger so far - waiting so long to get food.



On to day two
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Old 08-16-2007, 12:04 AM
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I don't know about that. I don't have enough of a routine to know how much coffee to make so when I used to make drip I'd make the full pot every time. Half or more of that would go to waste. Part of the reason I stopped making drip.
Yeh. I always make more than enough, in case I want that extra cup (or two), or my wife. Most of the time we go thru 4-6 cups in a morning.

I'm gonnat start to keep a closer eye on that pot though.

[to no one in particular] "DON'T YOU THINK I DON'T KNOW YOU'RE NOT IN HERE!"

Last edited by cmyk; 08-16-2007 at 12:05 AM.
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Old 08-16-2007, 01:03 AM
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I've watched it all the way through, without reading ahead here or on the Snopes boards beforehand, and I'm completely unconvinced. There were several things that made my BS meter peg, and I think the guys at Snopes (who've had longer than us) have pretty much nailed them all.

The first and most obvious one to me was the under-the-dining-table hiding place. That's just plain silly. And the rooftop hideout, with a neighbour's window in plain view? And the hastily-shoved-under-the-fridge pickle-jar glass that somehow no-one noticed? And the contrast between the "cover my back while I have a shower" attitude and them getting the paints and drinks out? And never mind the smell of cigarette smoke on the sofa, what about the smell of all that booze? Etc, etc.

Having said that, though, it worked tremendously well for me as a piece of fiction, and the faux realism was good enough for me to suspend disbelief and compulsively enjoy the whole thing from beginning to end for what it was.

Maybe I should rent The Blair Witch Project and see what that was about.
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Old 08-16-2007, 01:35 AM
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End of day 1:
One couple who work long hours and at least 3 bedrooms. It seems plausable that they can hide out for a while. I fear the cigarettes will give them away since the smell is insidious to non-smokers. Only BS trigger so far - waiting so long to get food.



On to day two
Huh. It's not only touches like this video ... but even the snooping one, that makes it really seem real. I agree, there are BS flags... but those can be written off as circumstantial. It's fascinating, regardless.

And this is much better than Blair Witch.
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Old 08-16-2007, 03:51 AM
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I hope this turns into some kind of horror flick. They could totally go that direction with it. The homeowners should turn out to be demented.

-FrL-
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Old 08-16-2007, 04:26 AM
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I was thinking the exact same thing. The pfroggers turn witness to some twisted shit, or crime. But cast some hotter chicks next time.
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Old 08-16-2007, 05:00 AM
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Just finished Day 2 and I'm definately getting that "Blair Witch" feeling (but more realistic). It's probably the home of one of the girls and they took time out on their summer vacation to make this mockumentary.

More BS-meter alarms:
I definately would miss a couple cups of coffee out of the pot over a couple of days.
The couple works some strange-ass hours.
I would be half sprawled in the open if I slept under that table
No one noticed paper plates and cups in the trash?

On to day 3
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Old 08-16-2007, 08:14 AM
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Can't say i've ever heard of phrogging but i am somewhat familiar with an activity that is real called urban exploration . Urban Explorers most likely wouldn't in any way want to be associated with "phroggers" (if they exist) but there is a large network of people that do "gain access" to off limits places for the sake of exploring and taking pictures. One place that might be somewhat relevant to this thread is Steve Jobs' old house in Woodside, CA. His house has been abandoned for a while but a few people have found a way in and taken some really cool pictures. They didn't get in to live his life for a few days, but you can definitely get a unique perspective on his lifestyle by having gone in or by seeing some of the pictures.
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Old 08-16-2007, 09:04 AM
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Well, I, personally have encountered one case of what might be called "accidental phrogging". We own both halves of a duplex, but only live in one half. The other half is used as storage/extra space for when the in-laws come to visit, etc. It's semi-furnished.

One morning, I went to the other side of the house to get some stuff I had stored over there, and there was a person sound asleep on the sofa. I couldn't tell the gender of the person, all I could see was a head. I assumed my oldest daughter had told a friend they could crash there for the night or something. When my daughter got up, I asked her about it, and she said "No, I didn't let anyone sleep there". I consulted with my hubby, and we figured out that this was a person who was not supposed to be there. We called the police. When the police arrived, the person was still sound asleep. The police woke him up (turned out to be a guy). Well, he had been drunk/stoned the previous night, and said his friend "so and so" told him he could crash in his living room any time. But he had the wrong house. Heh.

I don't know quite how he got in, but the lock wasn't broken or jimmied. It could be that whoever closed the door last prior to the squatter's entry hadn't latched it tightly or something.

Anyway, we decided it was an honest mistake, the guy seemed genuinely confused and apologetic. We didn't press charges or anything.
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Old 08-16-2007, 11:07 AM
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Yes, it's very real.
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Old 08-16-2007, 01:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Inigo Montoya
I've known this to happen from time to time, but the intent wasn't quite so benign. In the cases that come to mind the (usually upscale) house was used as a drug & debauchery den for a few days. Homeowners come home from vacation or summer/winter home to a trashed house: condoms, paraphenalia, general abuse, etc. Quite shocking evidently.
Yeah, but that's quite different. You're refering to a situation where the miscreants use someone's house while the owners are not there. I have no trouble believing that that happens all the time. The thing about this phrogging is that they're living in the house while the owners are coming and going and sleeping and living.

So far, both here and on Snopes, there are lots of reasons brought up as to why this is unlikely to be true, but no one has yet found the smoking gun that proves it, one way or the other.

For me, the BS meter went off big time when the girl was explaining about the green bracelets. Let's assume that this is true, and that there is some secret society of phroggers out there who recognize their fellows by the green bracelet. How stupid would that girl have to be to spill that big secret on a video that she has to know will end up on youtube? It would, from then on, make the green bracelets useless at best and potentially dangerous at worst. There are plenty of people (kids) out there who would watch that and think that phrogging is cool and decide to wear a green bracelet to show their coolness. To me, announcing that on the video just smacks of fakery, and an attempt to start a fake trend of kids wearing green bracelets.
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Old 08-16-2007, 02:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dorian Gray
Can't say i've ever heard of phrogging but i am somewhat familiar with an activity that is real called urban exploration . Urban Explorers most likely wouldn't in any way want to be associated with "phroggers" (if they exist) but there is a large network of people that do "gain access" to off limits places for the sake of exploring and taking pictures. One place that might be somewhat relevant to this thread is Steve Jobs' old house in Woodside, CA. His house has been abandoned for a while but a few people have found a way in and taken some really cool pictures. They didn't get in to live his life for a few days, but you can definitely get a unique perspective on his lifestyle by having gone in or by seeing some of the pictures.
Again, I have no trouble believing that urban exploration is done, but again the huge difference is that phrogging is done while people are living in the house.

Damn, I was really hoping that someone here would know something about this, recognize the girls, or have access to some investigative tool other than the internet. All the net searching done so far is inconclusive. As detailed on Snopes, the fact that all mentions of phrogging point back to these videos would seem to indicate that it's fake, but as before, that's not proof.

Somewhere out there there has to be some hard evidence to say whether this is real or faked.

The tease for "iCaught", not surprisingly, made it sound like they were going to report this as a totally real phenomenon, but that's just usual TV scare tactics. I'm still holding out hope that, just maybe, their report will include asking the question of whether the video is real, and then digging in to uncover the truth.
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Old 08-16-2007, 02:36 PM
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No opinion on the videos, which I have not watched.

I just want to comment on the concept that someone could be living in your house and you be unaware of it.

Sure, in some huge McMansion where the couple is seldom home, I can see it, maybe. But generally it's immediately obvious when someone else is living in your house.

I used to be in a group house-sharing situation. Rent was very cheap, but the landlord rented to more unrelated people than the law allows, and did so sort of under-the-table. We each had a room and a kitchen cabinet (with a padlock) and shared the common areas, bathrooms, and fridge.

The landlord was a Filipino Catholic, and he rented only to men, and had a "no girls living with you" policy. No idea if that was enforceable (not that it even matters) -- that's just what he told us.

The lanlord also picked our housemates for us, whenever someone left. That is to say, we had no input. Needless to add, this resulted in a lot of gold-plated losers living there. The police became frequent visitors.

There was one young man who was more trouble than most -- he was hauled off in squad cars several times. At one point he moved his girlfriend into the house.

An older gentleman who lived on the other (upstairs) floor complained, and this kid whined a lot about one of us bottom-floor-dwellers ratting him out. His stated premise was "there's no way the guy upstairs could have known a woman was living in the house" unless we'd told him.

Never mind the loud arguments they'd get into, the stockings hanging in the bathroom in an all-male household, the perfume, her car in the driveway, the extra cooking, or all the other signs she was living there.

Sailboat
  #43  
Old 08-16-2007, 03:24 PM
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Originally Posted by norinew
Well, I, personally have encountered one case of what might be called "accidental phrogging". We own both halves of a duplex, but only live in one half. The other half is used as storage/extra space for when the in-laws come to visit, etc. It's semi-furnished.

One morning, I went to the other side of the house to get some stuff I had stored over there, and there was a person sound asleep on the sofa. I couldn't tell the gender of the person, all I could see was a head. I assumed my oldest daughter had told a friend they could crash there for the night or something. When my daughter got up, I asked her about it, and she said "No, I didn't let anyone sleep there". I consulted with my hubby, and we figured out that this was a person who was not supposed to be there. We called the police. When the police arrived, the person was still sound asleep. The police woke him up (turned out to be a guy). Well, he had been drunk/stoned the previous night, and said his friend "so and so" told him he could crash in his living room any time. But he had the wrong house. Heh.

I don't know quite how he got in, but the lock wasn't broken or jimmied. It could be that whoever closed the door last prior to the squatter's entry hadn't latched it tightly or something.

Anyway, we decided it was an honest mistake, the guy seemed genuinely confused and apologetic. We didn't press charges or anything.
I had something similar happen to me last year that I hadn't thought about until now. I rented the Catholic Campus Ministries house at my university last year and during the fall semester, the house was having major renovations being done on it. At one point, the floors in the front room and the office were being refinished, so all of that furniture was moved into the kitchen and dining room. Stuffed into two smallish rooms were a couple of couches, a coffee table, a dining room table, a desk, and a bunch of chairs in varying styles.

The house was only a block away from campus and near where most of the Greek organizations had their houses, IOW, near where lots of parties happened. The morning after the floors were finally done, my roommate went downstairs to get breakfast and go to class only to find some girl asleep on a couch in the kitchen. She assumed it was a friend of mine and let the girl sleep, but did note that she reeked of alcohol. The Catholic Campus Minister came in, saw the girl asleep, and tried to find a blanket to cover her up with. She couldn't find a blanket, but she could find an old altar cloth, so she carefully covered the girl with the altar cloth, trying not to wake her up. She did, however, wake the girl up and said, "Don't worry, you're safe. You're at the Catholic house." The minister then left the girl to sleep and ran some errands. When she returned to the house, the girl was gone.

Now, I listened to descriptions of the girl from both the minister and my roommate. I asked around and I'm pretty positive she didn't know me. It was just a random drunk girl who came into our house and fell asleep. We weren't supposed to walk on the floors while the new finish was drying and had forgotten to lock the side door the night before. In this situation, I feel more sorry for the girl. Imagine waking up on a couch in a kitchen filled with furniture in a house that you don't recognize to a middle aged lady covering you with an alter cloth saying, "Don't worry, you're safe. You're at the Catholic house." Would that freak anyone else out?
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Old 08-16-2007, 03:30 PM
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Imagine waking up on a couch in a kitchen filled with furniture in a house that you don't recognize to a middle aged lady covering you with an alter cloth saying, "Don't worry, you're safe. You're at the Catholic house." Would that freak anyone else out?
Yes, I would probably have started screaming.
  #45  
Old 08-16-2007, 03:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Sailboat
No opinion on the videos, which I have not watched.
All that said, I respectfully think you're missing the point.

The idea is that someone sneaks into your home, and while you are there, they hush up and hide for as long as it takes. I don't think it could be done in a ranch, even a large one , for very long. But a 3-4,000 sq. ft. home with an upstairs... certainly. I agree, that there seems to be a sixth-sense that kicks in when someone else is in the house with you — but if they went ninja on you — would you really know? Also, they have an advantage: You're obliviousness and ignorance to even the idea of phrogging, let alone the chances that someone is actually sneaking around your house with you still in it. You'd dismiss the thought unless you had some real evidence to believe there was someone stowing-away.

I started a thread here, as to whether it could be pulled off. Not as to the veracity of it being a real counter-culture. But if you had to do it, how long could you get away with it.

Last edited by cmyk; 08-16-2007 at 03:46 PM.
  #46  
Old 08-16-2007, 04:56 PM
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I blame reading.
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Old 08-16-2007, 05:14 PM
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I finished all 5 days and as it went on, my BS-meter kept going up. E.g.
1) Renee does not look like she survives on the equivalent of one meal a day.
2) The do not want to leave evidence out in case the owners come home unexpectedly, so why leave the paintings out?
3) The blinds are down to the roof access yet they never lower them while on the roof or shut the window (wouldn't the smell infest the room?).
  #48  
Old 08-16-2007, 05:20 PM
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Originally Posted by SaintCad
I finished all 5 days and as it went on, my BS-meter kept going up. E.g.
1) Renee does not look like she survives on the equivalent of one meal a day.
2) The do not want to leave evidence out in case the owners come home unexpectedly, so why leave the paintings out?
3) The blinds are down to the roof access yet they never lower them while on the roof or shut the window (wouldn't the smell infest the room?).
Missed the edit window
4) There is one video (IIRC during the art session) where I swear I hear a door downstairs shutting about 2 seconds before the end of the clip.
  #49  
Old 08-16-2007, 07:52 PM
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It just seems fake, the whole style of it, their acting. It also seems like a really stupid idea.
  #50  
Old 08-16-2007, 08:14 PM
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Nashville had a twisted murder case where a man was living in a closet in his lover's home. She, of course, knew of his presence, but her husband didn't.

Freeman case article

Many people didn't buy her story. I'm not convinced either way.
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