A 75 year old Seattle man was just convicted for the 17th time for an alcohol related driving offense. He is now looking at a sentence of life in prison. The prosecution feels this is the only way to keep this guy from driving drunk again. One of the defenses raised was he has a fear of the police. To me, if you have a fear of the police, you don’t do things that could result in a meeting with a police officer. Is life in prison to stiff a penalty for this guy or does if fit the crime?
If the person in question has not been able to figure out how to behave in 75 years I don’t hold out much hope for the next 75. His actions put others at risk and he shows no signs of stopping. Sure, lock him up to protect the rest of us. I don’t think he deserves solitary or a SuperMax or “hard time”, but for the safety of others it’s time to confine him.
The guy drove without an interlock device (and since he also drove with one, this suggests he either bypassed the device or used someone else’s car).
By refusing to use that technology, he has made it clear that he must be locked up for life.
The fear of police seems to have been the defense for his behavior after getting stopped. I don’t know what the defense was against his many, many DUI’s and driving without a valid license for the past 22 years. I don’t see how there could be one.
I don’t know how many chances one should get over how many years, but 17 is surely too many. Was he court-ordered to get treatment after any one of the first 16 times? If so, did he follow through? If the only way to keep him off the road while drunk is jail, then life in prison seems like the only option.
I don’t know if he needs to be in a hardcore prison for life but he needs to be in the system for life. Home confinement with ankle bracelets. Fuck up, and in the clink he goes for a year or so until he can fly straight. But I have to ask: has he received mental health counseling? I’m assuming it’s been offered, but you never know.
I need more information. I wasn’t alive for most of his life time.
Today dwi’s are a really big deal. How were dwi’s viewed when he got his first 10 or 15? Should we hold a static record against a dynamic public and legal opinion? What other interventions have failed?
My opinion would turn on whether he was afforded proper alcohol abuse treatment. For that matter proper treatment for anything considering the article mentions he is a combat veteran, Vietnam or Vietnam era. I’m not sure why they added “era” to combat veteran.
At 75 you might as well sentence him to life in an assisted care facility.
Here’s an article from 2011 when he got his 12th DUI, while on bond for his 11th. And note, he pleaded not guilty. He’s not accepting responsibility. Those are just the times he was caught - the man will definitely drink and drive again if he isn’t stopped. Prison seems so extreme, but I don’t know what else can be done to keep him off the roads.
This article says he was driving “his” Corvette. How can he even be allowed to own a car?
StG
What else could they do with him? Continue to let him drive drunk until he kills someone? Lock him up, either in prison or at home with an ankle bracelet.
Lock him up. He’s a threat to the public and he won’t stop unless he’s made to do so.
Clearly he’s a failed human, but I also think we’re a failed society if we’re allowing someone with obvious substance abuse problems to get clink time but no professional help. We could learn lessons from European countries – don’t just punish, offer a way out with taxpayer funded professional help. And yes, keep him institutionalized until we can be sure he’s safe for release. But institutionalization here in the US means throwing drunks into the same cell as a convicted murderer or rapist.
I would be shocked if treatment programs were not part of his earlier convictions. It’s routine to require that.
Especially not likely to be effective when it’s done by court order rather than by self-motivation.
Indeed. My wife’s stepfather was an addictions counselor for about 15 years; he spent most of that time working with people who were in the program where he worked due to court orders. He had lots of stories about some of the strange things that his patients did, and the elaborate schemes they had to get around the restrictions that had been placed on them; he also often noted how many times people failed to complete the program, or wound up relapsing.
He was surely given therapy, and it surely didn’t work. I mean, it’d be nice if we had better therapy that would work for him, but the fact that we’ve tried and failed to discover it doesn’t mean we’re a failure as a society.
But even if we can’t help him, we can (and must) still protect the rest of society. And putting him in prison appears to be the only way to do that. Even house arrest with an anklet wouldn’t work, because that’d just alert the authorities when he violated; it wouldn’t actually stop him.
I don’t view this as a serious post. Court ordered alcohol treatment has been standard nationwide as part of the sentencing process in DUI convictions since at least the 1980s, before that it would have been more state by state, but I don’t think literally a single state hasn’t had some form of treatment requirement for even a first offense. It is also a prerequisite to getting a driver’s license reinstated after suspension for DUI. Most likely this guy had his license reinstated several times–most states have an increasing matrix of license suspension for each subsequent DUI offense, usually the penultimate one will be a 10-year license suspension, and an offense after that is a lifetime prohibition on driving. At 17 DUIs he probably hit that 10ish DUIs ago.
Tons of people who genuinely want to stop drinking fight their whole lives at it and fail, the fact someone keeps drinking is hardly even suggestive that they’ve never received treatment. Ignorance of the fact DUI convictions have carried mandatory treatment as part of sentencing for 30ish years is kind of astonishing to be frank.
It’s a serious post. There are ways to fight substance abuse besides jailing them or even 12 steps. We could invest a lot more in detox centers, mental health counseling, and drugs that actually stop cravings.
To be real, I don’t have a lot of sympathy for this guy. It’s true that most people would have course corrected after the first DUI conviction - no argument there. But drug/substance abuse in this society is often treated with witchcraft and revenge. We need to modernize.
The problem isn’t just that he’s addicted; it’s that he persists in driving drunk. This isn’t a question of what he deserves or doesn’t deserve. It’s a question of how to keep him off the roads. It seems extremely likely that if he’s not imprisoned he’s going to drive drunk again. Next time he might kill somebody.
I’d be fine with his being imprisoned comfortably. But he’s got to be stopped from driving somehow.
But we do that already. In my state, after the 1st DUI, there is an evaluation. Are you just a young stupid kid who made a mistake or do you have a problem? Fairly modest penalty, treatment if you need it. A carrot and not a stick. After the 2nd (within 10 years) you clearly have a problem, and even more intensive therapy to help. After the 3rd? Then fuck you, we tried, now it is a felony and you are doing prison time.
I think that is a fair and reasoned response. We are compassionate and try to help, but if help isn’t working for you, we need to protect everyone else.
Fair point - I’d only point out that public transportation in this country sucks. There are people in other countries who are just as middle finger flinging drunk as this guy but don’t get behind the wheel because they don’t have to – they can get from point A to point B because there are buses, affordable taxis, and trains. That said, he does seem to be a uniquely dysfunctional fucker.
The article in the OP notes that the man in question has not had a valid driver’s license since 1999. He clearly has a problem with alcohol addiction, but he also clearly has a problem with being unwilling to obey the law about not driving without a license.