I’m trying to figure out how this lighting circuit is wired behind the drywall. Power comes into the big switch box from the breaker through wire 3 (14/2). This hot wire is spliced to supply power to switch 1, which goes elsewhere. The power is also sent into the white line from wire 5 (14/3). The black & red line from wire 5 are connected to the 3-way switch 2 as shown, and another 14/2 is also connected to it (wire 4). The 4 white lines from wires 1,2,3,4 (not shown) are spliced together in that big box.
There is another switch box with a 4-way switch wired as shown. This switch 3 and switch 2 control the lights shown at the bottom. 2 of the light fixtures have14/2 lines coming in and leaving, and the third light just has one such line coming in; the white lines are connecting the lights are wired same as the black and not shown. There are no more switches on this circuit. I can’t figure out how wires 4,5,6 and 7 connect to each other and the lights.
I’m mostly confused that I can’t see where one end of the 14/3 disappears… I can only see 3 ends with a red wire when I open up all the grey boxes. Power travels from wire 3 out through wire 5 and into one of the black lines (either 6 or 7) going to switch 3. How do the lines in the diagram connect?
The circuit works, but I’m trying to understand HOW, so I can put the bottom left light on it’s own switch separate from the other 2.
This is confusing, but a couple of things stand out:
As drawn, there is no Hot supplying power to the light circuit. Switch 1 is irrelevant. This means that you have missed something, and it’s probably a Hot line connected to the 3 light fixtures in parallel.
You need to find out where power is being supplied to the 3-way circuit.
That said, if the three fixtures are all in parallel, breaking one out is going to be difficult. You will need to run a separate Hot line to it.
Wikipedia has a good summary of the various systems:
Yes I agree it’s confusing… it makes sense when you look at it in person, but trying to draw it and decide what to omit, then explain the same gets muddy.
I wanted to exclude switch 1 as it doesn’t matter, but didn’t want to oversimplify the diagram. But the diagram is missing the power to the lights (and connections of switches 2 & 3) on purpose: this is the part I don’t know.
I know power comes in through wire 3, leaves through wire 5, and then somehow runs through switch 2,3, and the lights.
I’ve spent a lot of time looking up dead-end/California 3-ways, but can’t find any examples of why there would be a 4-way switch when there are only 2 switches in the circuit, and how you can have 2 lengths of 14/3 wire but only 3 ends. Should I be unhooking all wires and tracing where the power goes that way?
Here’s an update after some testing… extra wire lines I drew are thin, and I had one set of red/black of the wires going to switch 3 backwards which is fixed now. I erased the irrelevant switch 1.
Power comes in through the black line of wire 3, bypasses switch 2 and leaves through the white line of wire 5. HERE’S THE MYSTERY: The hot white line in wire 5 somehow supplies power to the black line of wire 7 (see yellow star), which comes into switch 3.
Red 6 and black 5 are travelers between the two switches, and the black line of wire 4 carries the load to the lights. SO,
The red line of wire 7 doesn’t seem to get power at all…
How does the hot wire change from white 5 to black 7…
Why is a 4-way switch used in a 2-switch 3-way circuit?
IANAE (I am not an electrician), but I can tell you that the wire colours in multi-way switch groups mean nothing. They use whichever colour comes to hand.
I am not an electrician either, but have had some electrical training as well as a lifetime of practical experience doing my own repairs (and those of others as well). It may well be that someone used a four-way switch in lieu of a three-way simply because they had one handy. If you have a continuity tester, identify which wires are present at both switch locations (there should only be two), and use the tester to identify which positions on which switch perform as the “common” lead.
I figured it out… there WAS a third switch (a 3-way) on the other side of the 4-way. I used a cable tracer to follow the power and thought I was using it wrong as it took me 20 feet down a hall into a different part of the house.
The white lines in the 4-way actually carried the power through that box and onto the hidden 3-way switch. They weren’t labeled hot as they should be, so I thought they were neutrals and never tested them for current. Power came back through to the 4-way through that one black line in my diagram because that’s how the hidden 3-way was toggled. When I figured it out I flicked the hidden 3-way and sure enough now the power enters the 4-way through the red line.
Here is what I actually have, with my #3 being the power source in the bottom right of the diagram on this page:
