70s Chicago (Terry Kath Era) - Are You a Fan?

Cafe Society
1

Chicago is one of the first bands I knew about, mostly thanks to my next-door neighbor (they had all their records). At 11, me and him also started play in a band, and before the guitar player would come by, we’d always play “Colour My World” and it’s always been an important song, reminds me of the “Old Days” - in a rock and roll band hoping to make it big. I’ve always wondered more about Terry and Peter’s relationship. By all accounts, Robert was very encouraging. I’m still upset they broke their “blood oath” by firing Danny, the guy who also was sober, who found out about the millions of dollars skimmed.

About five years ago, I went through a lot of their songs, but a few months ago, I saw The Terry Kath Experience (btw, the Director’s Cut is on vimeo - twice as long!), and then the Chicago documentary, and then listened to their albums from the beginning, and would recommend people do this with everyone. Chicago I and II are very good, III not as much, V lesser, VI gets a little better, VII and VIII are my favorites. X isn’t a favorite, but it goes better with XI. I continued to listen even after Terry’s death (I sometimes think he’s a part of the reason I didn’t seek out the music so much) and liked a few songs, especially, “Love Was New” (but the awesome bass is low) and a few other decent ones, buy by 1982, I just couldn’t listen to that foster production. I tried. I’ve listened to songs individually randomly, even the new album, but it didn’t move me.

I did read Danny’s book, “Street Player”, “The Unauthorized Biography of James Pankow” (lots of great quotes, and a lot of non-Pankow stuff), and “Feelin’ Stronger Every Day” which is the only one I had to get on hardcover. I like e-books nowadays because it doesn’t hurt my neck or eyes to read on my big screen, and I also love to search for keywords. I also love googling quotes, and then finding the entire interview, and perhaps entire blogs with cool interviews.

I can’t stop listening to Chicago these days! I usually like random, but after a while, I just think,“Go with it… until you get sick of it”. My favorite part was finding favorite songs I never heard before, such as:

-Oh, Thank You Great Spirit (except the last 2 minutes, lol… TOO Hendrixy - and I know it’s a tribute song)… Only played live twice, and one time, the PA or something was off, and you only hear the last bit of singing.
-Something In This City Changes People – I wish that piano intro was a bit longer. I love it.
-Searchin’ – I’m sure I knew this song, but hadn’t heard it in a long time. I’m always moved by the line, “Now I know my life has meaning”… Nice outro, too. There’s a concert, Amsterdam 77 perhaps, but definitely 1977, where Peter sings “… I will understand” adding a “Yes I will…” and hearing Terry back up and sing, “Yes I wiiiiiill” and still have chills.
-Never Been In Love Before – I LOVE the ballads Cetera sings that were written by Lamm and Pankow
-Women Don’t Wanna Love Me – funky as hell! Peter belts the hell out of this.

Cetera’s voice used to annoy me; being kinda whiny. Reminds me a little of Henley. But if I had an epic song, I’d pick those guys to sing it, especially a song with oomph that needs power. His bass playing is remarkable. He’s obviously influenced by Paul, and even a few songs sound like his. Walter thought “If You Leave Me Now” was a McCartney song. “Baby What A Big Surprise” is very Beatles-like, and the bridge especially.

I’ve been talking to music friends about Chicago, and most seem to hate “If You Leave Me Now”. I don’t love it, but I like it, especially the bridge. It’s an eclectic band, and if that’s what he writes and feels… but it sounded (in the doc) very secretive. I think Guercio did a good job producing, gave them their chance, but I don’t trust that guy at all. Nothing he says. Besides the people I know, I’d check out YouTube comments. And the amount of disinformation is crazy. I’m an archive guy - I want the truth only. Anyway, some would say “Terry refused to play the song on stage and would quietly leave” - not true. I’ve heard and seen a handful, and Terry plays bass, but I think Guercio plays bass and one acoustic on the record.

I read all three Chicago books, and I looked up Danny’s again, just to search keywords. At one point he said, “Terry and Lee were usually doing their own thing” and on an interview not too long ago, I read Lee say he and Terry were as “thick as thieves”. One more thing about “Call On Me”. The book (Feelin’ Stronger Every Day) has both Peter and Lee’s quotes. If anyone wants it, I’ll go to my bookshelf and peruse for the exact quote, but Peter says how Lee showed the band the song, and was laughed out of the room. So later on (Carribou) Peter went up to Lee, and said he changed some words, and the melody, and voila. Lee says he didn’t remember it quite that way, saying, how Peter changed it so he could sing and play bass at the same time, but acknowledged that they both helped to make it a hit.

There’s the CNN documentary, which Cetera calls a “crockumentary” (and he did not participate)… Danny participated, but said they edited it to make him look bad a little too much (they do take Terry’s quote out of context), and it was directed by Lou Pardini’s nephew, who just released another Chicago documentary, “The Last Band” (about COVID, and recording their new album not together physically) which is pretty good, but I’d recommend this one the most. This Director’s Cut has an extra 40 minutes or so. Even a non-fan would like this (and know a few)

2

So…very, very early Chicago - Chicago Transit Authority + II - I do sorta like. I have this live show from 1970 on CD and I think parts of it holds up pretty well. After that it pretty much falls off a cliff for me, long before Kath’s death.

They were a collection of very good musicians, but ceased being of much interest to me pretty quickly. But I respect their success and don’t begrudge them it.

3

Got into when I was 10 (1972), up through VII. They sure went full bore with all of those early double albums. VIII is when they started to lose me, esp. with the cut “Old Days”, which confused me given that the liner notes for their early releases (as well as cuts like Dialogue) had them talking about “The Revolution.” I kept buying their stuff through the anomalously-titled Hot Streets, with more confusion as to why they couldn’t get back to where they were. I quickly moved on to prog and then post-punk and pretty much wrote them off, as one insubstantial Peter Cetera ballad after another would show up on the radio.

Got back into several years ago, and a fair amount of their stuff still holds up, tho some is horribly dated.

4

The debut album I think is one of the best ever (I think The Doors’ is THE best), but I like II more. III isn’t as good. V is a single-album, but feel VI is a little better, and I love VII and VIII, and think X might be the least best during that era.

I think their peak was when they brought in Laudir. Even a ballad as great as “Searchin’” had some congas! Really established the rhythm section, especially with so much “skin” – guitar, horn section, three vocalists.

When david foster came, I couldn’t even listen to that awful 15-minute production. But if you listen to Guercio’s produced albums, they’re timeless in comparison.

I think a big change was when they shortened their songs. Terry said (in a 76 interview I have) how radio cuts, and won’t play songs over a certain length, so they’re compacting the songs, which I thought was a mistake. Clive Davis cut the singles, but you heard the entire thing on albums.

I also think Pankow’s writing from “Liberation” and “Ballet” to “Searchin’” and “Just You N’ Me” changed things, but I’d also add that Lamm and Pankow started giving most of their songs to Cetera, not Kath, who is the only member of the group to NEVER write a charting (even Top 200 single - which means nothing to me), but it’s pretty cool. He told Lee (after “Call on Me”), “You can’t be my roommate on the road anymore!”

5

Check this song out

6

Chicago Transit Authority is one of the best LPs ever, showcasing the band’s incredible versatility. The second is pretty great too. I saw Chicago in concert when they were touring to promote the second album. They were simply fantastic! Later on they became a rather boring soft rock band headed by Peter Cetera and I lost my enthusiasm for them.

7

Like some others, I pretty much lost interest after III. To be exact, Saturday in the Park was just not the sound I was looking for at that point in my lifee.

8

I’m with the others saying that Chicago Transit Authority (which was 1969, not the 70s) is one of the best first albums ever and one of the best albums period. Nothing ever lived up to that for me. Their softer sound was completely skippable.

9

When I was in high school, the singles from Chicago 16 and Chicago 17 were very popular and I went on a deep dive through Chicago’s back catalogue, eventually getting everything up to Chicago XIV on vinyl. I liked a lot of the stuff: I don’t think there was any album that didn’t have at least one track I liked. Of course, the Chicago’s Greatest Hits album had the best stuff.

In the early 1990s, I got the four CD box set Group Portrait. I quite liked that one.

These days, I rarely listen to Chicago, but if I hear something from the pre-synthesizer era, my ears perk up. The mid-1980s stuff sounds very, very dated now and is pretty unlistenable.

10

Always make sure there ain’t one in the pipe.

Yeah, the Kath era was the best.

11

Kath was an amazing and somewhat underrated (at the time) guitarist/writer/musician. The Chicago he led was brilliant. But the stupid bugger had to play with guns - never a good ending.
Sometime after his demise David Foster became involved with the band - vomit inspiring, as with everything Foster touched. Anyone who’s only heard their later drivel wouldn’t believe they were once one of the greatest rock bands (with jazz influences). Sad.

12

What’s even sadder is what they are now. A crowd of geriatric, bitter, squabbling children, cursed to keep on going, pretending they’re actually doing anything of value.

13

CTA and II are unquestionably great albums. The only use I have for III is to break out “Lowdown” after most elections (along with Steppenwolf’s “Monster”). IV I had but hardly listened to (generally not a live album fan) but did have the ginormous poster on my wall. V I really like (despite “Saturday in the Park”), particularly “Dialogue”. Things fall off from there, I did own VI through X but the decline got to be too much.

14

That’s a great one. I can’t see above, but here’s a Terry Kath demo. What could have been…

“Beyond All Our Sorrows”

15

This, I assume, is from the same concert as the one posted upthread. I always like the beginning when a couple of the guys are trying to get something with the drums straightened out and eventually Terry starts playing without them (even if he knew they only need a few more seconds to finish up).*

I remember being blown away when someone (here) pointed out the Terry Kath was white. Having grown up listening to them in the car with my dad and stealing a few of his CTA/Chicago records (which I think I still have somewhere), I had never seen them, he didn’t look how I pictured him in my head.

*but I’m a bit biased as I’ve always liked live songs that start out in a way where it takes the audience a minute to realize what it is.

16

I agree 100%… I think III was a disappointment, after the amazing debut, and then an even better album on II… I didn’t like “Lowdown” until recently. Also the first song Danny co-wrote (with Cetera, his second), but it’s bit of an “earworm” the last two days, and the lyrics describe my life way too closely. Terry was quoted by the co-writers that he said, “Don’t tell anyone I played on this record” - not sure if he’s criticizing his own playing, or the song itself. Cetera said, “Terry had a ‘don’t-give-a-fuck’ attitude, and that really took the life out of the song, but you have to start somewhere [songwriting]”… Cetera’s first song is also very relevant. “Where Do We Go From Here?” that has an intro very similar to “Maxwell’s Silver Hammer”, and he (and Terry) were huge Beatles fans. Nice musical bridge, with the following lyrics

“I know it’s hard for you to
Change your way of life
I know it’s hard for you to do
The world is full of people
Dying to be free
So if you don’t my friend
There’s no life for you, no world for me”

In the last 5-10 years, I stopped caring much about the lyrics (and instead, listen to vocal quality, vibrato, rhythm, everything else), but I’ve always liked the imagery, words (even the fake Italian) from Robert Lamm, but it’s just too happy of a song, and I wish they never played it live. Play a funky upbeat song that is a deep track. It’s so sad to actually read Lamm in an interview say, “We still haven’t done the concert we’ve wanted to do. Or the album we’ve always wanted to do”, when asked why not, he simply and lazily replied, “The suits”… C’mon man. 55 straight years playing? This could be it, right? Play whatever you want. Chicago fans were with you guys (and made your albums #1) when you were political and proggy, playing 14 minute pieces… give the audience a chance. He talks about the 1974 first leg of the tour, how “the music was great, we played everything we wanted” but how the audience wasn’t responsive. Well, when you play songs for the first time, the audience is trying to take it all in. It takes time to cultivate. And I have almost 100 concerts from that era, and need to re-listen for audience response, but I never remember thinking, “They’re not clapping enough”… I just listened now, and even in June, they play the singles from previous albums, and some new stuff. Maybe the acoustics were bad, and bad information gets spread around, “The audience didn’t like it” self-consciousness… In the doc, Robert says, I told Terry, “Let’s just play every fucking hit on our next tour” to only hear, “You fucking hypocrite” and then CLICK!

Give XI a chance, it is MUCH better than the previous album… I’m also not a big fans of live concert albums, at least being named along with the studio albums… I could quote the interview, but basically, XI was supposed to be “balls out” as Terry says. After the band’s first #1 hit, they thought they’d change directions, and only let Peter sing ONE song, his own. It was the first album no one wrote a song for him. If Terry hadn’t killed himself, I’m sure they would have been a rock/funk/jazz band, except the songs would be about 5 minutes long.

6-12-74… They do play “Something In This City Changes People”, which might not be the best song to play live (probably should have added drums), but it’s still great… I was just having this talk with my brother, about playing hits. Every song had to be played for the first time. I know the audiences usually cringe, buy beer when they hear, “We’re gonna play something from our new or next album”, but that included “25 or 6 to 4” and every other great song (that just happened to turn out to be a hit).

Here’s the show.

17

I was at the Rock 'n Roll Revival Festival in 1969. Chicago played—or more accurately, Chicago Transit Authority, as they had yet to be required to change the name.
I was pretty young and the festival was quite an experience. I would have better appreciated it even a couple years later as I got a bit older and further into music. But I remember CTA being very well received. They were relatively unknown at this time. ‘I’m A Man’ from the first album was just starting to get FM radio airplay. I recall them performing a great version of it - lots of percussion.
For those unaware, rock FM in those days was a pretty new thing and free form in that DJ’s could play what they wanted, with no commercials. It was better than Sirius is today. As we know, the suits gradually got hold of the format, started selling commercials and what FM is today is the result.
Noteworthy while I’m on the subject. The Alice Cooper Band made one of their first appearances. No one knew who they were and weren’t ready for the on stage antics (bite the head off chicken). There were drugs aplenty around and quite a few freaked out during the performance. However the number of bad trips exceeded all expectations when Yoko Ono hit the stage with her screeching. People were being carried out left and right. People chanting; ‘Give peace a chance - send Yoko home!’.
The Doors were amazing. The elder statesmen of rock put on their shows to an enthusiastic audience. There’s a film but it focuses way too much on the Lennon connection. Cool to say ‘yeah I was there’, but in reality that was far from the highlight and once Ono climbed out of her pillow (literally) it became an all time downer.

18

Wow, you went to THAT?! Wow! The Doors were my first favorite band (middle school), still up there with Pink Floyd… Chicago is right there, too.

I didn’t go to my first concert until 2000 (just became an adult a month before the show), which sucks, because my favorites were at their peaks in the 60/70s, but I did see some good ones. I turned 40 the day after Chicago would have made their 83rd appearance at Pine Knob, and I’ve stayed home during the entire pandemic, but knowing the few friends/family I have, I asked them all (knowing they’d flake out the last minute), but I didn’t know they would ALL flake out, so I still haven’t seen them, but my problem is that my vehicle finally died after 330k miles three years ago.

Jim Morrison, John Lennon, Chicago – I would have been happy just for that. Speaking of, I think recently departed Jerry Lee Lewis was there, right? I know Ray was a huge fan.

19

So how did they get revenue? It wasn’t all volunteer work, like local public radio, was it?

20

Practically. Early “underground” radio stations didn’t pay much. People worked there for love of the music. Often, the FM station was subsidized by a powerful, successful, and money-making AM station. Examples: WIP carried WMMR in Philadelphia for a long time. WNEW in New York did the same with WNEW-FM. Until the mid-1970s, advertisers couldn’t see the value of putting their money on that “weird hippy station the kids listen to.”