A couple of weeks ago, my brother needed to get himself a car. His credit is less than stellar, so the dealership wouldn’t finance him without a cosigner. Now, this is the same dealership where my brother currently works as a salesman. So my grandmother happened to be in town that weekend and agreed to cosign for him. Problem was, they said since no banks were open they couldn’t let her cosign. Well, she was leaving early Monday so she couldn’t stick around for a bank to open. That’s when my brother’s boss suggested this to him. They’d have my gramma sign all the papers as buyer and then on Monday, once the banks were open, they’d do all the paperwork to switch her over to cosigner. My gramma agreed and I went with her to sign the papers. During the visit there I distinctly heard the salesman say that come Monday, they’d finish all the paperwork to get her as the cosigner. Now, this really did sound fishy to me because I didn’t think such a thing could be done without my grandmother present, but I know nothing about buying cars and loans and such so I didn’t say anything. So she signs the papers, and my brother gets the car.
A week later, it turns out they never did as they said they would. And when confronted about it, they deny ever even SAYING they would do that. Needless to say, we are NOT happy. Both my brother and I heard two seperate people state they would do this yet now they’re blantantly denying it. We want them to take the car back and remove all records of it from my gramma’s credit. I mean, she’s 72 years old and makes $700 a month from Social Security. WHY would she buy a Mustang with payments of close to $300 a month?
So we have an ‘appointment’ this Friday to go talk to the people about this. Me, my brother and my father are going to go but we’ve already decided if they have a lawyer there, we’re leaving without talking to them. If that is the case, do we possibly have any sort of case against him since it comes down to a ‘he said she said’ situation? My friend told me we didn’t since my brother and I were biased parties and thus our statements wouldn’t count, to which I say bullshit. Oh and this is taking place in California. Any feedback or suggestions is welcomed.
If they couldn’t write a loan with a co-signer because “all the banks were closed”, how could they write any loan? It seems obvious, if your telling of the story is correct, that they were pulling a fast one on your brother and grandmother. They knew that your brother wouldn’t qualify for the loan, so they tricked your grandmother (who apparently could qualify for the loan) into getting the loan.
What can you do about it? First, find out whether your state has a “cooling off” period for consumer loans. Many states allow you to get out of a loan within a few days if you change your mind.
If that option isn’t available, you can resort to the old classic - a threatening letter from an attorney.
Realize that your brother will lose his job if he fights this. It’s probably for the best, since these guys don’t seem like the best people to work for anyway.
Your brother had better come up with $300 per month so that Gramma doesn’t get screwed. He got her into this and it’s his responsibility to make Gramma whole.
StinkPop, no there isn’t a ‘cooling off’ period. I know for sure because while my gramma was signing the papers, I saw a sign on the wall about the fact there is none in the state.
We’re going to try to talk to them first but if they refuse to take the car back and remove it from her credit, we will look into a lawyer.
And I just found out my brother doesn’t work there anymore. He quit over this whole ordeal in addition to the fact they wouldn’t pay him his commission on a car sale because he didn’t move a car in the lot or something. I’m not sure of the details.
You should contact the Arizona Attorney General’s Office as well. If things are as you say, the dealership commited fraud, and the AG may well pursue them for free.
I used to live in AZ but not anymore…this is all happening in CA, but good idea to contact the AG.
I’m a bit confused about one thing re this statement
What precisely was/is your brother’s understanding on what being a “co-signer” was supposed to entail? In most car loans (at least the ones that I’m familar with) the two credit applicants ie Granny Good Credit and Brother Suck Credit will be co-equally responsible on the loan, but if BSC’s credit is really terrible the only way the loan can be approved in many cases is with GGC in first position on the loan and BSC in 2nd postion as backup. BSC is more or less “along for the ride” from the lending instiution’s point of view and the loan is essentially being made to GGC.
When did anyone get the notion that by co-signing as the main credit strength for the loan that the debt would not be assigned to her? In a co-signer situation with a bad credit co-applicant, the “co-signer” is in essence taking all the load on themselves. Maybe the dealership did not explain it correctly, but the way the loan was made with GGC in first position was the only way it was going to be made if his credit stank.
Your understanding of what a co-signer’s responisbilities are does not seem to accord with the reality of how personal loans are made. Unless there was some explicit statement in writing confirming what you understood “co-signer” to mean, you may potentially wind up looking foolish and ignorant.
astro, I understand what being a cosigner entails. She would be responsible for the payments if my brother failed to make them. But he WOULD be the buyer and his name would be on the car’s title. That’s why I was initially suspicious that they were having her sign the ‘buyer’ lines on the contracts and not the ‘cosigner’. But they told her since the banks were closed they couldn’t have her be a cosigner (I have NO clue how that would work) and they’d fix everything that Monday. They never did. The car is not in my brother’s name, his name is nowhere. And now they’re claiming they never said what my brother and I clearly heard them say. That’s what the issue is.
I think where you are misunderstanding is that NO bank is going to let your brother be the FIRST buyer on the loan. Grandma will be on the loan first with brother second, or co-buyers if you will. If brother defaults they will go after grandma first, then brother. They don’t care who pays as long as its paid. However, once the loan is paid, it will look good for brother’s credit as well. Also, title and such will be in each of their names as co-buyers.
Now, why brother’s name is not even in second or co-buyers position I have no idea. Good luck.
Seamonkey’s answer is a lot more succinct than mine. I did not understand from your OP that his name was nowhere on the loan, not even “along for the ride” in second position. I thought your main issue was that the loan was showing up on grandma’s credit as an outstanding debt when you expected it to be his primary loan with her as backup (which would not happen).
You might have a case of some kind for mis-representation, but if it’s as you described it’s sounds like a case of we said/they said with the signed loan docs being the primary evidence of the agreement. It might be worthwhile to talk to an atty, but signing loan papers without reading them carefully, because he wanted the car and she had to leave edges into caveat emptor territory.
In the end though, what are his real world alternatives re getting a nice car? There is no way the car note would not be on her credit statement as a debt even if he was a co-signer. In effect the only thing he is losing is the “along for the ride” credit worthiness brownie points, assuming grandma is cool with him possessing “her” the car and paying the note.