A VERY Polite Objection To Something Said

Anth, cartoon’s OP was based on the assumption that it was, indeed, an intended dig regarding Rosie’s adopted children. Having not heard your explanation, I read the same thing into it, but said nothing because of our past history. So I commend you on your first post in this thread because it adequately apologizes for the misunderstanding and explains why you used quotation marks. At that point, you should have just ignored the rest of cartoon’s post because there was an assumption made, in the OP, as to your intentions. Once you explained yourself in detail, methinks it would have been wise to wait for cartoon to respond and have the opportunity to withdraw the remainder of the OP. Your second post, therefore, I found to be less than stellar, and IMHO, if cartoon withdraws the latter statements of the OP, you owe him/her an apology.

You both jumped the gun, IMHO - YMMV, of course. And I, for one, am glad to hear you intended no ill slight against adoptees or adopters.


Esprix, Esprix, why? You knew I was going to respond.

I hope I more than adequately apologized:

Is there anything else I can say to more than adequately show my feelings here? Does anyone else really need more?

Thanks, Dad.

This coming from the King of Flaming himself, the “Pit” Bull Esprix who sinks his teeth in and never relents? Who, like satan, has a widespread reputation for picking apart people on every single sentence and word, and never letting up until the thread is closed?

I will submit that perhaps if you knew more of the background here you would not have posted this, so it’s not your fault. This is a recurring theme, and I am tired of it. No, I will not apologize with just a simple “withdrawal”. I think an apology is in order all around.

I didn’t jump the gun - I fully intended to flame when I made the second post, after I re-read the OP. I’m tired of the dramatics here. And do I need to repeat again what my feelings are on the issue? Is anyone unclear? Not only did I not intend any “ill slight against adoptees or adopters”, I feel entirely the opposite. I feel that adoption is one of the most incredible acts of human kindness there is.

Please don’t sell my feelings short with language like that.

This whole thread is a non-issue. Think about it - this whole thread is over “”. How sad.

Sigh. But the fault is mine, at heart. I should not have posted something so ambiguous to begin with. And, like I said - I thought toon and I were OK - like I thought you and I were. Especially after he sent a nice e-mail when we had an HIV scare here. He could also have sent an e-mail asking me what I meant, and explaining his position.

As could anyone else. I defy anyone to come forth and say that I have been anything less than perfectly courteous via e-mail, with anyone, on any topic. And you have my permission to post my e-mail, if you think I have ever been discourteous or rude in mail. Anyone?

Instead, we have a whole thread devoted to “”. And now you and I are squabbling again - and just when I was starting to really enjoy reading your witty, informative posts. I really don’t need this - I’ve been working motherfucking 60-hour weeks (for 40-hours pay) for I don’t know how long, and I’m tired. Thus, I’m not going to be in a good mood as this thread - if this thread - continues to twist in the wind.

I’m not going to post here again unless someone else wants to keep poking the Anthracite Hornet’s Nest with a stick. And I really will consider this matter closed - and I will even forgive Cartooniverse and pretend like this didn’t happen - unless I have to come back here again to this thread for any reason.

I hope you read my whole post here before responding, and think about what I’ve said, Esprix. You’re a great guy, and I don’t want to fight with you - especially tonight. You had your say, I had mine, let’s let Cartooniverse have his say again, and hope that this atrocity of a thread is closed by 8:00 pm CDT.

Christ on a pony, Anth, but I hope I can remember never to try to offer you any advice when you’re pissed. I value my head–I really don’t want it torn off like Esprix’s just was.

I stand corrected. Thank you for setting me straight on this issue.

This explains your feelings much better than any uninformed guessing by myself or any other SDMB members could. Please forgive me for jumping to the wrong conclusion.


Now, I didn’t read all of the responses here and I am a little late in the game…however…

Una’s Rosie comment didn’t offend me and I am adopted!

I suspect (again not reading all of Una’s comments along with others) that it has more to do with Rosie O’Donnell and her about face when it comes to political things. Ummm, Ms. O’Donnell worked with the “Million Mom March” (against guns)which it was later reported that Ms. O’Donnell had her “body guards” apply for concealed weapons permits. Quite the bullshitter if you ask me.

That’s what I saw and I think Una’s comment was pretty funny considering O’Donnell’s about face when it comes to everyone else’s in ability to protect themselves except hers because she’s a “celebrity.” The same applies for algebra I am sure.

Well, I’ll apologize in advance to dear Esprix. andros - the insinuations of the OP made me very unhappy today - as if I had been asked if I was a racist, an anti-Semite, or a fan of solar energy.

OK, that last one was gratuitous. :wink: But it really just rubbed me the wrong way, especially considering how I feel about adoption, and how much I value it as a true source of Good in the World.

I could add that “besides, it’s the Pit” but I know that to be a poor excuse.

It has been brought to my attention by a certain Someone off-Board that my second post here was out of line, and unneeded. I would edit it, or retract it, were it possible, and just leave my first post. Since I cannot do that, I apologize for being so angry. This thread just really made me feel like I was really being looked down upon and despised for being some sort of sick person who would be making a snide remark about adoption, of all things.

I also did not say exactly what I meant in point 3, in my first post. What I meant to say was:

just so we are clear, for the record here.

Aw, hell, this happens all the time.

Believe me, I’d be mighty unhappy too, to know that my words had been so misconstrued. Actually, I’ve been in your shoes, Una–I said something on a grad school listserv, someone took it the wrong way and replied with considerable huffiness. Twenty other people took that lead and chimed in on what a horrible thing Cranky said. Meanwhile I was blissfully flying off on vacation, unaware that I was being made out to be Asshole #1 thanks to a blatant misinterpretation. It’s galling. It’s happened here on the SDMB, too, for that matter. So I feel your pain.

That said, though, methinks your hackles might be overextended on this one. Cartooniverse’s complaint wasn’t as polite as it was billed in the Title. But do you want to pay the huffiness back in kind? I mean, it sucks to be accused of something that you didn’t do (especially when it’s completely opposite of your true feelings), but it’s a somewhat understandable mixup. I thought everyone knew her kids were adopted, for example (this thread has shown me otherwise–nice to know more of you guys are subscribing to the Utne Reader than People). One quick conciliatory statement or two corrects the error, and then the thread dies a quick death. People who jumped the gun before you had a chance to answer can be quietly and deservedly embarrassed about their overreaction. End o’ story.

BUT–If yer gonna pick a fight over the slander, say so. Then I can go get the popcorn popped and dig the lawnchair outta the basement so I can enjoy the ensuing brawl.

I haven’t been back since I read the first two replies to the O.P. I just read the entire thread. ( It’s taken me about 25 minutes to compose this, so if I have missed a post in the last half hour, apologies now) So, let’s get the important stuff out first, shall we?

  • Originally Posted by Anthracite *

Um, actually quite the opposite. I’m not interested in calling names, and I truly doubt you’d lie here. You’ve always been very straightforward and honest here. Don’t put words, especially incendiary ones, into my mouth, please.

As I did mention in the O.P., I’d always felt your opinions on personal freedoms of choice to be eloquently stated here in the SDMB. That’s why this posting of yours surprised me. I call you NO SUCH THING. And, I’ll join you in asking a Moderator to lock this thread.

I must say, reading this was a surprise:

I’m more than familiar with the concept of the inside joke. I didn’t know the reference, and so responded solely to what I’d read. I do indeed apologize for the latter half of the Original Posting.

However, as you can see, other Members also took umbrage. I appreciate your apologies to those of us who did so. Case closed.

Those in a position to do so, please lock this one up? It got Pitty enough for all involved and ** Anthracite** explained my misunderstanding of what the quotation markds meant MORE than adequately.

Originally Posted by MamaHen

MamaHen, that’s beyond atrocious. My Grandmother, upon seeing my son for the first time ( he was 7 months old ) immediately remarked, " Well, he’s not too dark skinned is he??" That pretty much iced it for her as far as I was concerned. I’m so sorry that you are made to suffer for the ignorance and narrowmindedness of your family members. Boy, do I feel that pain.

Originally Posted by CrankyAsAnOldMan


You’re right here, Cranky. I apologize to Anthracite here for all to see, I literally had no idea ( how COULD I?) that it was a reference to something relatively unknown to most Members.


There is sooooooo much I want to say, but I’m going to leave it at I’m glad you realized your second post was uncalled for (although why someone off-board told you the same thing I did and you listened to them is beyond me). After cartoon’s post above, my point is made.


I’m only posting this because I don’t want to look “snitty”, like I was abusing you.

They did not tell me the same thing, but a similar thing in a different way. It was not what you said versus what someone else said, it was what you said plus what someone else said.

If you really feel like this thread was so crucially important in your life and you must get further involved and escalate a closed situation, then you better post. FTR, I still think you sold my response short on the subject of adoption, and wonder why you chose the words you did. I see no apology here, so I’ll just have to assume you either don’t care, or don’t realize still that your tone was mocking of me.

Define irony.

Look Toons. I’ll reverse and rescind my previous position. Mail me next time to ask, I’ll respond nicely. There is no need to start an entire Pit thread over something like this. And if my answer via mail is not sufficient, then start a thread. Starting a Pit thread over something like this is not a simple “asking for clarification” - it is an attempt to hold the Crimes of Anthracite out for all the world to see. Even the language of your OP showed that you had that in mind somewhat.

And not that I am posting very hypocritcally here. A little bit ago, I started a thread about Booker57 that did not belong here, and could have been handled by e-mail more appropriately. And I started the thread to hold his crimes out for all to see. But I’ll try not to do this ever again myself, and try not to be bad person.

I think that, as a general rule, one can’t expect other people on a message board to remember jack shit about you. We all like to think that we have made a strong impresion on the other 10k users, but the fact is, I doubt any of us has a really consisitant, coherant idea of the personlity of more than a dozen other dopers–and those are the ones that we have alot in common with and bump into in thread after thread. Furthermore, I think we all have to reconstrut those opinions all the time, because we are fitting people in a message board into schema and they are always subject to change (For example, when there is a poster whom you have noticed shares 3 or 4 strong opinions with your Uncle Albert, and then suddenly shows himself to be deeply against something Albert is all for–and you are a little suprised and have to readjust everything in your head).

One person’s SDMB is very different from another person’s SDMB, and it is always a good idea to assume that whoever is reading your post has never heard of you before and dosen’t know a thing about you. For example, some months back we had a poster start a thread ‘Eve is dead!’. She was talking about the “out of Africa” theory, and people were angry, appalled, shocked, calling for her head on a platter because she scared them. The fact was, she spent all her time in GD/GQ/IMHO and if she had read any of Eve’s posts, they had failed to make an impression. She simply had no idea that there was a popular poster with such a name. Her SDMB was a very different place than these other peoples.

This is true even for people you have interacted with on many occasions. Some of us are really slow with names, and we are not going to conect the PosterA of the Doglover’s thread with the PosterA of the Megan’s Law thread with the PosterA of the “Damned Idiots!” thread. This is especialy true if your posting style is “intelligent and clear”–all the well spoken posters blend together and the Brian Bunnyhurt’s stand out. Being an asshole also helps–people remember someone who insulted or offended them much longer than anyone else.

Furthermore, the fact is that we have seen all sorts of people here, and there is hardly any belief that dosen’t have its adherants. You could start a thread about the joys of stomping kittens and in 15 minutes you’d get one person flaming you becasue they thought you were serious and another from someone defending your right to stomp kittens.

Ultimitly, I think it is the responsibility of the writter to make themselves understood, not the reader to go back and discover enough background on the writter to figure out what they probably meant. That real-time response to ambigous writing is what makes message boards such good mediums for polishing your writting skills–your comp teacher knew what you “meant to say” and so gives you some credit for that–her own assumptions keep her from even seeing how ambigous your writting may be. On a message board, you know when you have been unclear, and you have the oppurtunity to immediatly correct it. You learn that what is obvious to you is not obvious to anyone.

I think that post should be mandatory reading for every member of this board.

Misunderstandings happen- hell, Spoofe called me a dipshit and pathetic in another thread. I just waited until he realized his error, for which he apologized. I knew I had not said what he thought, and there was no sense in making things worse. We kissed and made up, and that’s it. (For the record, I said something very rude to him, for which I also apologized).
Messageboards are a tough medium, and I’ve found that the more I sit back and let things go, the more I learn. I’ve had a few misunderstandings and misinterpretations along the way, but hopefully I’m wiser for them.


Jeeze, I really suck sometimes.

Manda Jo, that was excellent!

I was checking this thread out from afar and was first amazed, and then disheartened at how this very simple misunderstanding was beginning to burst into a three alarm fire. It is easy to be misconstrued and hard not to take it personally.

( Small side note here. I’ve been trying pretty hard to NOT quote an entire posting when responding, because that was requested by TubaDiva-amongst other Admin/Mod types- as a way of saving some space and bandwidth. Due to the delicacy of the feelings here, please don’t think I’m cutting up Anth’s words for any other reason. I just used the parts I wanted to respond to )

I’d love to. If you’re comfortable with that idea, then I would much rather do that. Thank you so much. ( I’m assuming your request up there early on in this thread that I never email you again is rescinded? ).

I’m done with this one, but it does seem to have brought out some excellent thoughts- especially the posting by MandJo. Kudos, that was well said.

Now, some nice deep breaths and I’m off to sliver carrots and spinach for my Chap Chae noodle dish for tonight.


OK, that’s fine - same thing’s happened to me.

The “children” comment offended me as well, and this thread was posted in a public forum. Furthermore, I saw you shredding cartoon over what was clearly a misunderstanding without having given him the opportunity to apologize for his own shredding. Ergo, the OP involved me on two fronts. This is, after all, a public message board.

Please point out where, exactly, you saw me selling you short, mocking you, or where an apology is in order. From where I stand, I gave you credit for your clarification in your first post and I took unfavorable notice of your not giving cartoon a chance to apologize for his mistake. Are you, perhaps, reading past history into what I wrote? I assure you that wasn’t my intention.


OK, Cartooniverse and I are happy and promise to e-mail each other first, Esprix and I really don’t have any quarrel worth anything, Rosie is still a drooling idiot, and my name has been dragged through the mud more than a Confederate flag at a Swamp Buggy rally. Are we done yet? I have to travel 5500 miles in 12 hours, and really don’t have time to continue.