An Imaginary Pitting for Crafter Man

The BBQ Pit
41

While the word “disease” in your sentence makes this slightly less cut and dry, I have to point out that both ADD and alcoholism are in the DSM-IV - the diagnostic manual used by psychiatrists and psychologists throughout North America.

Both of these are considered to be readily accepted diagnoses by the medical community:

  • they both have a specific set of symptoms that are not neccessarily identical in ever patient presenting - bowel cancer doesn’t present identically in every patient either, but that doesn’t change the fact that it exists
  • they both respond favorably to a particular course of treatment - the treatment does not work for all patients - chemo-therapy doesn’t work for all patients
  • the course of both is fairly consistant among a diverse sample of the population - bowel cancer doesn’t resolve itself the same in every patient either

Your comment that neither are “diseases” could be argued if you want to get into a discussion of semantics; however, the suggestion that either are “made up” is totally and completely absurd.

42

I’m not getting something here, I think: Why the hell does ANYone have to prove anything to you about their headaches or sensitivities? Are you overly sensitive to other people having sensitivities to various ingredients or items? I just don’t get it.
For instance: I have a weird reaction to peppermint oil. Specifically, it makes me woozy. Thus, I can’t make peppermint soap, can’t work with peppermint flavorings, and can’t eat–alas!–more than three or four Thin Mints.
Can you imagine a life with limited Thin Mints? The horror.
And something else: Apples give me hiccups. Don’t ask me why; they just DO.
Why on earth would anyone demand a CITE about either of these? (I know you aren’t addressing my particular weird reactions, but how different are they, really, from MSG sensitivity?)
And does it matter if we identify that itchy-skin feeling when exposed to wool as an “allergy” versus a “sensitivity”?
Why the hubbub? Let folks avoid Chinese food if they like; let them wear cotton. No one’s asking you to sign a petition, for heaven’s sake.

43

I see that CM has since clarified that he did not intend the interpretation that I put forth, so I retract that part of my post. Nevertheless, the posts remain my personal opinion.

Agreed. My position is that calling it ADD is not substantively different than calling it “a fidgety kid”. You could call either term a disease or not. Neither are “made up”.

What I object to about calling “behavioural diseases” diseases is that it seems like a sly way to lump them in with physical diseases like diabetes, the effects of which can’t be overcome with willpower. While a behavioural disease itself (meaing the underlying condition) can’t be overcome, the manifestations frequently can.

44

Sorry Izzy, but that statement is pretty goofy too.

If I have type II diabetes I may have to go on medication; however, I can be particularly regimented about what I eat and exercise like crazy and not have to go on medication - or even come off medication.

That is, the effects of the disease can be overcome with willpower.

There is no difference, whatsoever, between a disease of the body or a disease of the brain. ADHD is an illness that needs treatment. Suggesting that the child “just should fidget” is exactly the same as suggesting that an asthma sufferer should just “breath normally”. I assure you - the child would love to have that option.

45

That should read “just shouldn’t fidget”, of course.

46

That should read “just shouldn’t fidget”, of course.

47

What you are saying is that willpower to adhere to the regimen can help. Even taking drugs might require a certain amount of willpower to stick to that regimen.

In the case of diabetes, the underlying illness is something in the body that causes some bodily process to go awry. That cannot be changed - you cannot will your body to process correctly. In the case of ADD, the underlying illness is something in the brain that causes difficulty paying attention and the like. In this case, while the brain cannot be changed, the attention can be mastered. It’s not just that you can control it through other measures that require willpower to adhere to - the willpower itself is directly influencing the symptom.

Of course I am NOT saying that people with ADD lack the normal amount of willpower, or that they should all just shape up etc. But what I am saying is that to one extent or another, the amount of willpower dedicated to attacking the symptom does have a direct effect, and in this respect it is different than medical diseases.

As I’ve mentioned earlier, calling it ADD does not make it different than calling it “fidgety kids”. By the same token, there is nothing fundamentally different about a predisposition to ADD than a predisposition to talking excessively, to eating a lot, to getting angry, or basically any other personality quirk that a person might have. The basic story is that people’s minds have certain inborn traits, and some of these are not helpful to the person. Labeling it a syndrome or disorder does not alter the fundamental facts.

48

Dood - Type II diabetes is a disease. There are very few people who will argue about this, and those that will wear tin-foil hats.

The amount of willpower a sufferer of Type II diabetes directs towards their illness has a direct effect on the course and outcome of the disease. A DIRECT EFFECT.

So - how is ADHD different than Type II diabetes? Both potentially require drugs. Both potentially can be treated without drug intervention. Both are the result of a physiological difference in the patient presenting with the illness. Drugs that treat ADHD will not work on a child without it. Ritalin does not help fidgity kids - it helps those with ADHD.

Why is this so hard to get?

49

I have a 9 year old nephew that was diagnosed with ADD. He’s on Ritalin, etc. Last year I asked his mother about it. “He had a problem paying attention in school.” Um, O.K… But guess what he does all day? He plays games on his Play Station!

So my question is this: How is it he can pay attention to a video game for over an hour, yet fail to pay attention in class? Is selective attentiveness also a symptom of ADD??

50

No, there’s what’s known as “hyper focus”-it’s where you lose yourself in something so much that you’re almost in a trance.

Crafter_Man, I REALLY suggest you do some reading about ADHD by credible sources-doctors, psychologists, etc.

51

It’s because the video game is interesting to him, he doesn’t need any instructions or help for a video game, or if he does, the presentation of the help is one on one(characther telling him where to go, etc.). He gets distracted during class because people are shuffling papers, sneezing, and moving around. Those things are distracting to him. He can’t hold attention to something when they’re are plenty of distractions to him, he needs one on one in a quiter enviroment. This is caused by a “busy brain”, where he can’t hold atention for long in a busy enviroment.

The ritalin slows his brain down, makes him able to pick away all those noises and distractions and focus on the teacher.

52

Guinastasia, if you are so intent on proving him wrong, why don’t you provide something for him to read? Like a website, a magazine article, or a book?

53

The thing is, I don’t KNOW of any specific sources. Sadly.

I only know about ADHD because I myself have it. And I know what it’s like.

If that’s not enough, I’ll happily bow out.

54

Crafter_Man, I think you are trying to simplify some very complex matters, and force them into a “black or white” division that is inaccurate. Perhaps you should refrain from making judgements in areas where you lack sufficient knowledge to do so?

Your friend with the “Chinese Food allergy”, for example - you are failing to take into consideration the ‘many shades of gray’ that may apply to that situation.

Point 1) You said that your friend avoids Chinese food because of the MSG, yet eats other foods that contain it and appears to suffer no ill affects. Has it occurred to you that your friend may have a threshold of tolerance for MSG? Perhaps the small amounts present in most prepared foods doesn’t trigger a reaction, but the amount found in a typical restaurant-prepared or supermarket-packaged Chinese dish exceeds her tolerance.

Point 2) Perhaps your friend is sensitive to some other ingredient in Chinese dishes, but wrongly assumes it is the MSG because MSG is commonly blamed for unpleasant reactions.

Point 3) Even if your friend imagines that she has this sensitivity, if she is experiencing some sort of symptoms after eating Chinese food then the distress/discomfort is real, whether it originates in her mind or her digestive tract. She could spend time and money undergoing whatever medical tests are necessary to ascertain whether or not her condition is “real”, and if it is not she can then enter psychotherapy and learn to change her attitude toward Chinese food. But, if she seems to be functioning well otherwise, this seems, to me, to be a little excessive when she can easily deal with the problem by avoiding Chinese food.

Of course, I would recommend therapy anyway, because she might want to learn why she tolerates ‘friends’ such as you, who chose to go behind her back and deride her mental health in front of strangers on a public message board.

You might consider therapy yourself, as your display of know-it-all arrogance, black-or-white thinking, and desire to degrade others for their supposed ‘inferiority’ is indicative of some less-than-healthy mental attitudes on your part. I suspect that these attitudes cause you many more problems in your life than your friend’s aversion to Chinese food does in hers.

55

Russell Barkley’s books on ADHD are a useful resource for those who really want to learn about ADHD. The CHADD web site’s got good stuff too.

True ADHD or ADD is not conquerable by simple will power. Behavioural mods will help but it’s not usually the full answer.

56

Of course Chinese Restaurant Syndrome is fake…well that’s why if my fiancee eats food with even a whiff of MSG in it it provides a sudden and instant signal to her bowels…I’ve seen it in action enough times to know that it isn’t psychosomatic, after all how would her brain know that she had ingested MSG.

I have to agree with Green Bean…asshat…

57

Whoops…I better finish the thought…her brain know that it has ingested MSG when she was unaware of it being in the food at the time that she ingested it…

58

Hmm, that’s exactly what I was wondering. I am aware that ADD shares certain similarities with illnesses such as diabetes. However, as you may know, two things may shares similarities but yet be dissimilar in crucial ways. I pointed out a crucial distinction between the two, and you’ve responded by simply repeating the similarities. Along with the term “dood”. Not adding much, I’m afraid.

Again, there is a difference between the mind acting directly on the symptoms of the disease, and the disease being controlled by physical action, with the mind being merely required to bring about the physical action. Very simple, really.

I’m sure it’s not “conquerable” in that you cannot make the underlying condition go away. But surely it is subsceptable to being influenced one way or the other.

A tendency to anger is not “conquerable” by simple will power. But a person can affect himself in this area as well.