Any architect- or budding architect-types in here? Advice please

Factual Questions
1

My wife is going back to school in a year to get her Masters in Architecture…and needs to make a couple small decisions about it. Like, uh, what school(s) to apply to.

So, the question is, are there any great resources on the ‘Net to help us make this decision. Especially unbiased ones (i.e., not the schools’ sites themselves). Does anyone know if there are any good active message boards about this?

Anyone gone through this process? Any advice? Any school preferences/experiences?

The schools she’d consider would be on the east coast between N. Carolina and Conn.

Appreciate it!

2

I’m not an Architect, but try this site http://www.aiaonline.com/ for all of your Archit needs.

Do you get Architecture magazine sent to your home? Isn’t it weird how it says ARCHIT on the front and ECTURE on the inside flap?

3

Thanks for the link. Looking through my wife’s favorites folder, she’s already bookmarked that one, but I’m going to look at it.

Why, do you ask, is she not right here by my side pointing out her favorites before I ask this group? She’s actually in the middle of the six-week architecture “Career Discovery” program at Harvard University GSD. We reside, however, in a small-ish town in Oregon. This program has totally galvanized her to get her Masters, so we’re approaching this from two separate coasts, so to speak.
No, don’t get Architecture magazine - we used to get Architectural Digest, which should be retitled “Really rich people and their expensive remodeling jobs” Digest.

Again, appreciate the link, and any more (hopefully) advice people can provide here.

:slight_smile:

4

I’m about to go get a Masters in Architecture and Human Settlement from the Katholieke Universiteit in Leuven, Belgium. I found it quite by accident and it satisfied all the conditions I had for going back to school (I got my B.Arch from Tulane in 1996) - 1) Great location 2) Easy to apply (no G.R.E.) 3) Cheap ($600/semester for a 1 year program) and 4) Not a problem that I haven’t chosen a focus for study: their program will serve to broaden rather than narrow my academic perspective.

I don’t know a whole lot in particular about the many programs availiable in the Mid to North Atlantic. Generally there are multiple paths for getting an M.Arch. One is to go to graduate school with an undergraduate non-professional degree in Architecture (a 4-year B.A. or B.S. in Architecture) - This is usually a two-year program, sometimes with a summer studio as well. Another path is to go to graduate school holding a professional degree in Architecture such as a B.Arch (usually 5-years). This type of program is usually more flexible to accommodate a particular research interest. And of course, you can get an M.Arch with an undergraduate degree in another field, which might take as much as three years plus summers to accommodate the requisite number of design studio projects.

Here are some links that might be helpful:

The Association of Collegiate Schools of Architecture
The American Institute of Architecture Students
The National Architectural Accrediting Board

5

Is she shooting for something higher than U of O (architecture program isn’t bad, especially if you want to work in the NW)? Oh, East coast. She could probably ask someone at U of O about schools, or look at the material on schools at the library if you are ever in Eugene.
I think U Penn’s program is supposed to be good. Why not Harvard-- that is also supposed to be a good program.

6

Belgium. Hadn’t considered overseas. I’ll mention it to her. Of course, then we’ve got issues like me finding work and whatnot. :slight_smile:

I’ll throw that one at her too.

How about within living distance of central Conn.? Besides, say, RISD and Yale. Anyone?

:slight_smile:

7

This is a very subjective question, because each school has a different philosophy, and therefore will appeal to different people.

For starters, look at the NAAB site to find programs that are accredited.

Second, ask yourself what are you planning to do with this degree? Do you want to practice, teach, research, etc?

Third, how much time do you want to spend on it? Some Masters programs are short only if you have already studied Architecture. Others assume that you have no background at all. Don’t be fooled into thinking that you have to get a Master’s. What you will be getting is what’s known as the first professional degree. At Drexel University, where I am, its a Bachelor’s of Architecture. At Univ. of Penn, it’s a Master’s.

If you are planning to become licensed, expect it to take about 7-8 years. That’s school and the Intern Development Program, which is required for licensing. The IDP is a semi-structured (and semi-flawed, but that’s another debate) program that is intended to give new graduates practical skills to prepare them for practice. After completing the IDP (which can take 3 years if you are really fortunate) you are allowed to sit for your licensing exams. That can take another year if you stretch it out.

That’s general stuff, now for my personal bits. I am attending Drexel University in Philadelphia. It is a 7 year evening program mostly intended for people who are in the industry (say, as drafters) who work during the day and attend classes at night. They do have a day program that is 2 years of day classes followed by 4 years of evening classes and working. The advantage is that you can fulfill IDP requirements while still in school. If you are fortunate, you can graduate ready to take the exam.

University of Pennsylvania has a 3 year Master’s program. I do not know what the requirements are for addmittaance, but UPenn makes no bones about the fact that they are not training practitioners, they are training designers. IMO, Drexel graduates know how a building is made and UPenn graduates don’t care.

As I said, there are many schools with many philosophies. A good book to read is called “Architecture: A Guide to the Profession”. The author talks about the different philosophies, what school is like, what practice is like, lots of things that you don’t get from the school brochures.

Good luck.

8

epeepunk:

Thanks…excellent points. She has a 4-yr degree in something called “Growth and Structure of Cities”, which has many elements necessary for a BS in Arch. She has also done drafting at her previous job.

The question came down to spending another 2 years (her estimate) to get a BS in Arch., or 2 - 3 years to get a Masters in said subject.

So it seems the more obvious choice is to go straight for the Masters.

9

My spouse’s degree (both BA and Master’s) are from the University of Michigan. It’s an okay program rank-wise, but he felt it was very light on the history and appreciation side of things. Anything he can tell you about architecture from a sociological or historical perspective he learned on his own. At Michigan, however, he says he learned how to build a hell of a retaining wall.

I asked him the other day about good programs, (just coincidentally) and he was vague. Maybe he distrusts the rankings because MI gets up there. I do recall him saying Harvard was good.

10

I have a prejudice to share regarding the “how a building is made” and “design graduates don’t care” argument. I feel strongly that the design education provides a much better FOUNDATION for assimilating practical knowledge. Many design schools suffer from weak technology programs, some from weak history curricula – but these are weaknesses that are easily repaired outside of the university setting.

A good design education gives a student a disciplined approach to an open-ended process in which information and regulations from widely varying sources must be distilled while the opportunity for true achievement; artistic, civic, social, or technical - can not be ignored in the interest of doing business. Architects, as professionals, are considered to have a responsibility to the public as well as to the client and it is this responsibility that demands more than mere practical ability.

Design graduates may take longer to train into drafters and project managers, but smart ones will take to the requirements of business readily, while people without the advantage of a design discipline, either through schooling or by devotion to self-study while practicing, will tend to be slower to emerge from those roles to the practice of architecture as a discipline.

While I was at Tulane, there was a lot of griping about the lack of practical preparation for entry-level work, but from the perspective having a few years of internship behind me, I am thoroughly pleased with the education I received - one which was avowedly unconcerned with detailed application of the technical intricacies of real-world building.

I will not disdain practical training, because that knowledge is certainly required for success in the field - but I hope that the value of keeping the academic focus on larger issues more likely to be lost in the “real world” to the detriment of the building arts, is not forgotten.

(Tell her to go to Harvard.)

11

I’m not an architect. But I am an artist, and my dad is a construction worker, so if you put the two together…you do the math…anyway, I’m also from Arizona, and one of the colleges there has a decent architecture program. I think it’s either ASU or U of A, and if you like golfing there’s plenty of that down there as well as Gila Monsters. The possibilities are endless…

12

Shylock, let me reiterate one point: Bachelor’s or Master’s degree is dependent on the program. If your wife doesn’t have a degree in Architecture, she will be getting her first professional degree. A Bachelor’s from Drexel is equivalent to a Master’s from UPenn. Once she has that first degree, then she can get a second professional degree, what most people would call a Master’s. At this point it is just letters. The educational effect (roughly) is the same.

And Dystopos, I agree that a good education should prepare you for practice and should be focused on problem solving. But a large number of employers aren’t as interested in educating interns. They want productive people. Drexel mostly is taking knowedgable practical people and lifting them up to the design level. My generalizations were just that. The reality is much more comlicated.

13

I did my undergrad at Iowa State, which has a strong master’s program for people with a related undergrad degree, but has a theory focus (most people in this masters program go on to teach or work for very design/theory based firms). And then you are in Iowa for a year. :slight_smile: http://www.iastate.edu

I agree with the above posts. You have to determine where you are willing to live (there is a decent master’s program in Florence for a year), find accredited school and then visit the school’s web sites to check out the program focus, length, professors and such. I have found that teh school’s web sites are great for doing research on the different programs offered. Most have examples of student work, so she can get a glimpse of what she might be doing.

Your local AIA office is another good resource. Portland web site is:

Good luck with the hunt!

14

Life is a little more complicated than that. So as to avoid slighting anyone out of plain ignorance, I’ll recast the comparison as a B.Arch from Auburn and an M.Arch I from Harvard GSD. For the purposes of getting an entry level job at a large commercial firm, you’re looking at two very different candidates. The Harvard grad has a much more focussed, and much more rigorous academic background and is suited for very particular positions in practice while the AU grad has a solid general architectural education and should be ready to fit into a very standard intern position. As “first professional degrees” they are equivalent only as requirements for pursuing professional licensure. Outside of that they prepare you for very different paths, even if those paths converge into what could be called the “master architect” status.

Of course, it’s not as simple as that either. You can compare a B.Arch from Cooper Union to the Harvard M.Arch and not see much difference (perhaps) or you can compare a first professional M.Arch from Michigan to the same school’s B.Arch graduates and the main difference will be the other undergraduate degree held by the M.Arch.

Regarding the OP, It sounds like she’s got a pretty good understanding of what type of program she wants and whomever she is in touch with at this program at the GSD will undoubtedly have better advice than we have come up with here.

15

A little more riffing on the First Professional Degree theme:

Tulane will be awarding the class of 2002(?) M.Arch’s for the same curriculum as the previous classes’ B.Arch’s. This is apparently part of a movement to standardize the M.Arch as the first professional degree and recognize that five years of architecture school with a thesis project is, academically speaking, graduate level work. I suppose this also puts some pressure on the schools that adopted the 4+2 pattern of an undergrad B.S. or B.A. in Architecture followed by admission into a master’s program for the professional degree. Needless to say the class of 2001 isn’t overwhelmingly in favor of the timing of the change. I guess you could say I’m using this 1-year program in Belgium to “catch up” with the new status quo (and take a long delayed Junior Year Abroad), but really, I think most of the people who matter will see through the terminology and know what to expect from people holding either degree.

Perhaps this whole movement is mimicking the law schools which have gone from awarding Bachelors of Law to Juris Doctorates?

16

Actually, at Montana State last year’s class, 1999, graduated from a 5-year professional program with a M.Arch. Wish I had know about that option!

17

undergrad at NC State, Batchelors of Architecture at NC State…

my $.02

NC State - loved it, a great education, why? we were encouraged to think. We were taught enough structures so you could kinda figure out how gravity works, but beyond that? Great program, shaped in the Bauhaus image, your wife’s option would be a Trakc 3 program, which is a three year program, that would eventually lead to a masters.

If I had to do it over, I would have gone for a masters. Undergrad, Batchelors, doesn’t really matter in the real world, unless you are going to teach, but I feel cheated by the rushed, generalized glazing over a thesis one year can give you. I would have loved to had two years to really undertand and get into what I’m doing.

UPenn - a very good school, but very much rooted in the Ecole des Beaux Arts. Traditionally it’s a very historically based program, but you can make it what you want.

Never discount UVA…a great place to immerse yourself in academia.

Virginia Tech - a very progressive place.

Harvard - would have loved it if I could have afforded it.

Stay away from Clemson, UNC-Charlotte and other technically oriented schools. It’s not the program that’s lacking, it’s the mentallity of the students. “what do I care I know CADD, I have a job” They can CADD,can’t draw, can’t analyze or think things through. It’s a shame.

18

Dystopos, thanks for the clarification. They are different degrees academically. I didn’t think to bring up the unstandard degree structure and the efforts to resolve it. Glad to see that some schools are starting to.

I picked Drexel mostly by accident. I didn’t do much research. But I was extremely fortunate in that it was perfect for me. But not everyone gets so lucky. So Shylock, be sure to try to talk to graduates from the schools too, and current students if you can. The local chapter of the AIA for the cities the schools are in may be able to connect you with graduates. And practicing Architects have opinions about the schools as well. Visit the campus, especially during classes. Look at the facilities (like, is there a wood shop and a model shop). Check out the library. I use the library at University of Delaware because Drexel’s was rather weak. It’s just like picking a college (in fact, it is :slight_smile: )

19

nice, helpful imsight all around. semi-related question: How important is the networking you get while in school in relation to the ease in finding jobs? In other words, if you go to a school in City “X”, do the relationships you make there (and the reputation of the school in the locality) make it much easier to jumpstart your career? And conversely is it then harder if you move into an area from which you didn’t go to school?

20

yes and no…

if you excel in school, show great creativity and promise, you might get a tap from a professor or a guest juror, for a job or a lead.

If you work in a town w/ a lot of graduates from your class, and you are seen as somoeone competent, creative and reliable, you will be contacted. While in school you are working on building your reputation, once you get out, the first couple of years, you will pretty much be given tasks, the pay will not be good, but you will be building a reputation and networking.

The way the economy is right now, the attitude among employers is that the best people are already employed, that it’s up to the employees to find the competent people to bring contact and try to lure in.

Schooling might help you get your foot in the door, but right now employers are looking at everyone who meets the experience qualifications that they are looking for. Once you get the interview, some places just look for your CADD skills (stay away from those), but most will look at your portfolio, but base their decision on what promise you show, and your personality.