Anyone else's BS-o-meter going off?

Great Debates
41

My BS meter was going off earlier today but has kinda settled in the ‘actual threat’ zone now.

The reasons why my BS meter initially went to the BS zones where in no particular order:

[ul][li]I’m Irish. Re: Fast arrests: I can remember people arrested and convicted of terrorist acts who were innocent. People in power knew their convictions were unsafe but let innocent people rot in jail for political expedience. This knowledge can make one very cynical when terrorist claims are made.[/li][li] Initially (and to a large extent even now) we weren’t given any details other than the bare bones of the story. Understandable security precautions mandate that the public will not know the details but you have to have trust in the intelligence for this to work. In the UK that intelligence has been lacking.[/li]
-They knew there were WMD’s. Unlike the US the UK went to war on the mandate of WMD and nothing more. Blair stated clearly that Saddam could remain in power if the WMD issue was sorted.

-They knew that there was a suspected suicide bomber in a house after 7/7. Because of this knowledge they shot a innocent Brazilian in the head six times. No person was ever arrested from that house BTW.

  • They knew that there was a chemical bomb being made in a house. When they raided that house they found nothing. They did shot an innocent man who lived in that house in the chest seriously injuring them.

  • They knew there was a threat of surface to air missiles taking out planes around Heathrow. Government members said on TV that they knew that launchers were in the country and were to be used. They put troops around Heathrow and brought some people in for questioning. After a week of disruption the troops went away and everything went back to normal. No missiles have ever been found and no arrests were ever made.

  • They’ve told their people they’ve known a lot.

[li]Only yesterday the Defence Minister made a speech saying that the public would have to accept loss of some liberties in order for the State to combat terrorism effectively. Good timing, don’t ya think?[/ul][/li]All that being said I do think this was a real threat. However statements like this

BBC NEWS | UK | Police probe flights terror plot

Just annoy me. I’d rather know nothing than that shite. ‘accumulated and assembled the capabilities” WTF does that mean? Seriously that’s a statement that could mean anything in reality. Many common items when combined in the correct quantities can be explosive or dangerous. I have in my box of cigarettes the raw material to make a very lethal poison. Nicotine is one of the deadliest poisons in the world in high levels. If I knew how, I could filter that out and use it as a weapon.

The above statement just leads to ‘experts’ on TV News shows talking about the dangers of high explosive liquids. They know about as much as we do as to the actual nature of the evidence found but they will talk non-stop about the carnage these unknown bombs could cause.

We will hopefully get more information shortly or if there are to be trials we will find out all the details after the conviction/finding of innocence. Till then my BS meter will be ready to go to the sceptical zone. It’s currently in the ‘Actual Threat’ zone as I’ve already said.

42

This is the kinda shit I’m talking about.

bolding mine

We then get a page of descriptions of explosives. None of which has actual been confirmed as found. I do not see police officials or government members telling the press to stop speculating and to wait on the official report to be released. They are happy with this spin.

When they(any government of any colour) are happy, I’m generally worried :wink:

I really do think this threat was real though. <- not sarcasm

43

Acc to hubby, the stock broker, there were significant shorts (where you make money if the stock falls) placed on airlines last evening. Someone either knew that the arrests were coming OR knew that airlines would be bombed today and were trying to make a buck off of it.

The good news is that you can’t play the stock market sans a paper trail.

44

Where are you getting that from BTW?

The US Homeland Security Secretary Michael Chertoff* has said they were in the last stages of planning and since they were arrested today I doubt it was going to happen today.

  • I haven’t seen a British confirmation of this. Has anyone else?
45

That was the impression I got from the reports on NPR on my drive to work, which is why I framed it as a question and not a statement.

46

My BS-O-Meter is still going off.

When I turned the TV on this morning and saw Chertoff with that lying weasel Gonzales standing to his right I just shook my head, smiled, and said to myself “here we go again.”

How long has it been since the great and competent US government last saved the ungrateful US citizenry from all-but-certain doom? A few months? Of course in the last go-round the “terrorists” were just planning to have plans, which ultimately didn’t play as well as the administration would have liked. The public’s fear died down quickly once the details got out that the plotters were bumbling fools who didn’t even get along with each other. Even their entirely unprovoked and oh-so-obviously uncoerced statement of allegiance to Al-Qaeda didn’t help the administration. Awww. Sorry guys. Your Pavlovian tactic didn’t go over so well that time, did it?

Now we have a new plot and {gasp} it was foiled, and only a scant few months until the mid-term elections, and right after republicrat Lieberman’s loss in the Connecticut primary to virulently anti-war Lamont, and just when it’s become impossible to deny the Iraq quagmire, and just when it’s becoming evident that the US administration had a hand, perhaps a guiding hand, in the Lebanon debacle.

Coincidences all? Probably. But look at this…

Why is the US, through Chertoff, ambiguously taking credit for a role in foiling a plot it had not a damned thing to do with, other than the fact that Bush was advised of the investigation and imminent arrests a few days ago. Thaaaaaat’s right. A few days ago.

In the announcement this morning, FBI director Mueller, Michael Chertoff, and that lying weasel Alberto Gonzalez each mentioned Al-Qaeda. Oh, it’s “suggestive” of Al-Qaeda? It has the “earmarks” of Al-Qaeda? Really? Freakin’ weasel-words using freaks! “We used the Pavlovian word three times this morning boss, so maybe Al-Qaeda the brain-dead Al-Qaeda electorate Al-Qaeda will Al-Qaeda know that voting Al-Qaeda for conservative Al-Qaeda republicans Al-Qaeda is the only Al-Qaeda way Al-Qaeda they’ll be Al-Qaeda kept safe Al-Qaeda from terrorism Al-Qaeda Al-Qaeda Al-Qaeda.”

And I don’t buy for one bloody moment that Bush et al, and his poodle wouldn’t inconvenience the public to help the foundering (not to mention floundering) neocon agenda.

Do I believe there was a plot? Yes, yes I do. It just seems to me that the Bush administration has taken convenient advantage of it.

Oh, and the prohibition of liquids being brought onto flights in carry-on luggage? Pure genius. I’m willing to bet that once the midterms are history this prohibition will go bye-bye, especially if the republicans keep control of both houses. “We’ve taken adequate steps to ensure that bombers will never succeed in their insidious attempts to blow up patriotic Americans with their eeeevil bottles of Ivory Liquid Soap and Skin-So-Soft lotion. So now, thanks to God and the republicans, you are once again free to include liquids in carry-on luggage.”

So, are there liquid explosives or not? Has this been confirmed? …or were these simply plans to make liquid explosives? Hmmm.

47

I mostly feel this is BS because of the fact that Joe Lieberman lost his primary Tuesday to a guy who basically said that he was againt the war in Iraq and that Joe L was too close to Bush. All day Wednesday commentators went on and on about how Democrates are crazy to get rid of poor Joe and that Dems didn’t want to fight the war on terror and bla bla bla.

So now this is story comes out…

The fact that it was British police that did it, make me believe it though.

I do want to see the people arrested and see the trial to really believe it though.

48

Alternatively, it could mean that rolled-up terrorist plots are made public, or not, depending on whether the people in power feel a need for the political effect.

49

Inigo and Tabula, of course there’s money to be made in a tanking market. But to suggest that such ready money would be a motivation for a bogus announcement is hogwash; the grim headlines, election-opponent fodder, and subsequent lost votes would more than outweigh the benefits to a handful of savvy-and-connected investors.

If politicians were just interested in wealth, then instead of running for office, they’d cultivate friendships with the people who run for office.

50

Allegedly the same thing happened before 9/11, but news of where that paper trail led has gone totally quiet. Surely there are people shorting various stocks on a daily basis?

51

My supervisor, a seemingly non-political man who has become increasingly cynical the last few years, has started calling Chertoff “The Skull.”

Seriously. “Did you see what The Skull said last night?” he’ll start a conversation.

Sailboat

52

Moving thread from IMHO to Great Debates.

53

Onomatopoeia pretty much hit the high points for me. Oustanding post.

Now, I don’t personally think the UK plot was bogus. For one thing, banning all hand luggage from flights for months or years, followed by a huge investment in advanced screening technology, as some UK authorities are suggesting, is very likely to have a large impact on the airline and travel industries.

Nevertheless, it seems pretty clear that respective administrations of both the UK and US are playing the Terrorist Bogeyman card and milking this thing for political gain for all they are worth (although, IMO, that ain’t much). I’ve heard so much of this crap since 2001 that it’s really starting to make my teeth ache.

54

To those calling BS: why would Duhbya be involved in something that results in driving down the price of oil?

55

I don’t think oil, or the price thereof, has anything to do with this. I believe it’s simply the Bush administration gloming onto anything it can in an attempt to boost its credibility. Face it. Rome is burning and these maniacs are using gasoline on the fires. Terrorist plots are Heaven-sent nuggets of goodness to these lunatics.

56

Too soon. Listening to take from England right now. People are skeptical because of blunders of the Brittish police lately. There was a ricine scare that the trial was over with no evidence presented.All suspects released. A soccer game that was supposed to be blown up and found not true. There was a huge raid on a house lately in response to information . One person was shot and nothing was found.
The Brits I am listening to say they are cautionary about it.
TV show last nite showed that these kind of bombs would not likely bring down a plane. Therefore the 3000 potential deathe is at least a huge exaggeration.

57

Then you’re not thinking enough:[list=#]The latest drop in the price of oil was blamed on fewer people flying.[]Duhbya is an oil man and I’m sure still has friends in the business.[]Don’t forget the huge oil lobby.[/list]Do you really believe that Duhbya would turn his back on his friends and the oil lobby just to make points with the public?

58

I’d say this is much more likely to be BS than the Scotland Yard arrests.

59

Are you conveniently ignoring the fact or do you not really know that the president is still functioning as president when he’s “on vacation?”

60

In 1987, liquid explosives concealed in a drink bottle and detonated remotely are thought to have destroyed a South Korean passenger plane, killing all 115 on board.