Anzac Day

It’s April 25th here in Australasia, which is Anzac Day.

Here in New Zealand we recognise the sacrifices of our fellow New Zealanders and our cousin Australians in the First World War, and in other conflicts such as World War II and the Korean War.

There are still services at memorials all across my country.

To all Kiwi and Aussie members of the SDMB – I wish you a restful, peaceful Anzac Day.

Heartily endorsed from Up Over.

Here’s to y’all!

Any SDMB’ers in Gallipoli at the moment? Or is anyone going to participate in the dawn services/marches in Aus or NZ today?

In many ways it is Australia’s National day (and I personally think it should be installed as such)…much more so than Australia Day which few seem to understand the significance of. Nobody gives too much of a toss about Federation.

Everyone knows what ANZAC day is about, and for at least one day of the year there is an emotional sense of unity and national pride that tends to be lacking on Aus. Day.

Hear, hear, kambuckta. I feel much th’ same way about Waitangi Day. Nice and all, but – not with the same meaning as Anzac Day.

Peace, Aussies and Kiwis.

May your heroes lie in peace tonight and for hereafter.

Dunno what to post here… Anzac Day just aaaah… IS. To try to explain it to our friends across the lake, try to imagine something which moves you more than the Fourth of July. Then you might be on the way to understanding this. We have Australia Day, and our New Zealand brothers have Waitangi Day, and those national days are all well and good, but Anzac Day is the next level. To learn a bit more, there is a good thread from this time last year.

I hope you’ve had a thoughtful and happy Anzac Day, Kiwis and Aussies.
Lest we forget.

What is the official relationship between Ozzie-land and Kiwi-ville?

Don’t take offense - I like you guys. I’m just askin’.

Ringo, essentially, we make sheep jokes about each other.

Seriously, Anzac Day aside, we are independent nations. A federation of the two was briefly considered a century ago. There is talk of NZ adopting the Aussie Dollar as official currency, but I can’t see that happening.

We have obvious trade and cultural ties. Some minor things like a shared food standards authority exist.

See, they’re from New Zealand, these folks. Can’t trust 'em. They’d murder you in yer bed with a chcolate covered marshmallow fish, given half a chance…

There’s a CER (Closer Economic Relations) treaty between us. More and more of our economic life is actually based in Sydney, rather than Auckland or Wellington.

But we don’t mind 'em, on the whole. Some we actually quite like a lot. :slight_smile:

Fact is, Australia remains our biggest economic overseas market. Why, even in World War I, when our soldiers got enough of a breathing space in the fields of France to start up a wee economy of their own in beer – the Aussies were some o’ th’ best customers. :slight_smile:

Th’ beer was shite tho. :slight_smile:

Really? You were there? Heavens, TLD – you’re doing well for your years, cobber! :slight_smile:

Naah, it’s summat. I learned from school. I guess th’ beer poisoning was that generation’s version of collateral damage. :wink:
Gawd, a homemade Lion Red brewed in th’ trenches, and drained through a Kiwi digger’s jockstrap. We musta been desperate… :slight_smile:

See, that’s special. Part of a school curriculum given over to discussions over the whys and wherefores of homebrewing on the Western Front of the Great War.

Yup, Aussie is an interesting place, all right. :slight_smile:

I’ll put in a link here to an article I wrote about the New Zealand Tunnelling Company of 1915-1918.

At a city called Arras in France, Kiwis, Aussies and the British got together to carve out a tunnel system that saved lives during that war. The Kiwis whacked through tunnels at standing height, with swings of the pick, rather than edge forward, like a backwards mole, as had been done before. The Aussies were adept at setting up the electrics and the tracks through the tunnels, so that thousands of allied soldiers were safe for a cold winter, while the front fluctuated up above their heads.

And in the deserts across the Mediterranean, Aussies and Kiwis got together to put out a magazine for the troopps in 1918 called the Kia Ora Coo-ee, copies of which still survive today in facsimile form.

That’s part of Anzac, to me. Good on yer, mates. :slight_smile:

Not wanting to make this descend into the pit, but a respectful observation…

ANZAC day is held up to be a day of rememberence of the glory of two nations.

However, what really happened was: a bunch of soldiers tried to invade a well fortified beach (Gallipoli) of a foreign sovereign country (Turkey), and were roundly defeated.

A spurt of nationalistic sentiment resulted, which has led to ANZAC day being used to honour soldiers who died/served in any war.

Is this really a day of national pride? IMHO I think it’s a day to reflect on 1. The fact that war causes many deaths and 2. That, despite the fact that it’s over 50 years since the invasion at Gallipoli (which politicians prefer to call a landing, as invasion sounds so violent), this country is still sending soldiers to invade other countries, causing much death.

I think that instead of glorifying the so-called ANZAC legend, and teaching it, with much nationalistic sentiment, to schoolchildren, that we should remember the dead and learn from the experience.

My $0.02

I don’t think there’s a lot of glory as part of the services. Respect, yes, but glory? Not so much.

But we can’t learn from the experience if we don’t tell it to our kids, if we don’t have an occasion to mark the losses and sacrifices.

I dunno, I guess I’ve always thought that it was particularly Australian (and Kiwi, too!) to celebrate, not a victory, but a loss. Humble, if you will. I don’t think many other countries would think to do that.

PS - even though I sent you a reply to your thread just a little while ago, I promise I’m not stalking you around the boards!

You are obviously either a child, or a simpleton. I will not argue with you.

There has been some debate among historians, and in the local media of late, on this very subject, phraser.

Uh, no, not exactly. Anzac Day is a remembrance of those Australian and Kiwi soldiers who have fought in other wars and battles, not just Gallipoli: the fallen, the passed away, and those who are still with us. There is nothing “glorious” in Anzac Day – it’s a sombre memorial.

No, the First World War was “The War To End All Wars”, too terrible to imagine happening again. The feeling of the time, in setting up memorials and having two days for remembrance, was “Lest We Forget”, and, very much, “Never Again.”

Unfortunately, times change, and the world moves on.

Remembrance Day, 11 November, and Anzac Day share a common thread, along with the memorial to the fallen – they were instigated as reminders of how terrible war was. That we still fight wars is another topic, for another forum – Great Debates, perhaps?

Apart from the “glorifying” bit, I couldn’t agree with you more, phraser. We should continue to show our children the lessons of history – but try, very hard, not to colour those lessons with the attitudes of today.

As I say, this is a GD topic you’ve opened up, rather than a Pit one. You could have quite an enlightening discussion in the former forum.

Yes. Why shouldn’t we have a day of national pride such as Anzac Day? Anzac Day is not solely about glorifying the war dead; Anzac Day is the sombre celebration and a homage to a campaign which was a defining moment for Australia as a new nation. And it defined what it is to be Australian - courage under fire, grace under pressure, giving a hand to a mate - by the efforts of men from all backgrounds and classes from the newly federated Australia. (For more info on Anzac Day.)