LOL at “punishment” - Ireland offered Apple a free ticket to the lottery. It didn’t cost Apple anything and the transient Irish gov of the day took a punt on Apple’s behalf.
Now everyone holds their hands to their face in mock surprise at the law being, you know, the law
It was a shot to nothing for Apple. Now they get to pay the same as everyone else, same as i pay what my neighbour pays.
It’s the absolute nature of capitalism to keep pushing, just keep pushing: all part of the game. Happy days.
Do you know why Apple, or any other company creates jobs? It isn’t to give thanks to the government for low taxes. It is because they need to do it to expand their business. A top-down approach is the wrong way to look at things. Apple would be nothing without their customers. Without people who want Iphones and Ipads, Apple would be out of business, even if they were exempt from taxes completely.
What’s the real cost to Apple of the EU’s decision? Doesn’t the US tax code provide a credit for foreign tax paid? In other words, won’t Apple just offset the higher tax paid in Ireland with lower tax paid in the US?
As long as the profits aren’t repatriated to the US, they don’t have to pay their share of taxes on that amount. Tim Cook recently said they would repatriate its profits to the US next year… presumably as a result of the EU ruling.
I’m arguing it is the state’s fault for offering an illegal tax aid. Irrland broke the law; not Apple. Ireland should recompense the EU for it is the entity at fault.
Ireland is the actor which must comply with the EU competition law. Why is Apple retroactively paying for Ireland’s illegal activity?
Anecdotally you can find one state with high taxes with shittier roads than one state with lower taxes. On average with all things being, more tax revenue means better services. You may not give a shit about some of those services (medicaid, welfare, schools, etc.) but those things all count don’t they?
Its only an injustice if you ignore the law in place. Ideally both apple and Ireland would pay. Apple would pay its taxes to Ireland and Ireland would pay some portion of those taxes to the EU.
Generally speaking, this is true if and when that income becomes taxable in the USA. So, lets say you earn $100 in Ireland and pay $12.50. You do not get a credit of $12.50 on your US taxes until you pay US taxes on that $100 of income. There are half a dozen ways to postpone (sometimes indefinitely) the moment when you must pay taxes on that $100 of income. Apple makes sure that the US income tax is postponed indefinitely on that income.
This is why people argue that lowering the tax rate on income earned abroad would increase tax receipts. People use those opportunities to bring their income back to the US (like when Bush lowered the corporate tax rate on this income to 5%, the corporate tax revenue went up because corporations were faced with a choice of paying 5% now or 35% later (or never repatriate that money). So corporations repatriated as much as they thought they would need for the forseeable future and only paid 1/7th of the taxes they would have had to pay in the normal course.
You have fallen to the zero sum economics trap. Apple doesn’t have to fire anyone to make jobs in ireland then can hire people there too and just grow. The fact that there is a tax incentive involved means that they can grow more and hire more than they could of elsewhere. If the incentive didn’t exist they would grow slower or possibly even shrink.
Who benefits? Everyone.
Corporations should pay zero tax. Any tax they pay is simply passed on to consumers with increased prices and thus is a hidden tax on people. It would be better to have the end user pay tax since then they would really know how much tax they are paying.
First, nobody is recompensing the EU. The back taxes that Apple has to pay will go to the Irish state.
Secondly, it’s misleadingly selective to say that Ireland has to comply with EU competition law, if that implies that Apple doesn’t have to. Of course Apple has to comply with EU competition law, if it wants to operate in the EU, just like it has to comply with US anti-trust law if it wants to operate in the US.
No crime has been committed here, and no fine is being imposed. The provision of an illegal state aid was, well, illegal. The tax ruling which Apple sought and obtained is inconsistent with EU competition law and, therefore, invalid. Apple’s tax liability on its Irish activities is now be recalculated on the basis of a correct understanding of the law. Since Apple has been booking substantial profits in Ireland for the past 27 years, the cumulative tax arrears are very large.
A tax expert with a very antilegal understanding of taxation. It can’t, by definition, be a tax dodge if it operates within the legal framework sanctioned by the state and is upheld in court.
The Commission finding does not suggest that Ireland (or Apple) was conscious of the illegality.
Also worth noting that this is disavantageous to Ireland, and they are considering an appeal. The ability to grant tax rulings of this kind, and have them effective and enforceable, is worth more that €13 billion to Ireland.
But don’t let facts get in the way of the chip on your shoulder!
