A lot of people I know believe that if you are involved in any auto accident, it is always at least a little bit your fault. For example, they think that even if you were in a crash that you had no way of avoiding, didn’t contribute to in any way, and you basically did everything right you could have, you’d still be somewhat responsible for simply “being there”.
This would be regarding either insurance companies and/or police departments determining who is at fault in an accident. Like saying driver A was X% at fault and driver B was Y% at fault. Basically most of my buddies think that you would basically get like 10% just for being involved in the crash, no matter what the circumstances are.
This doesn’t make sense to me, but a lot of people seem to believe it. Basically it seems like an urban legend in my opinion. Anyone know for sure?
About five years ago, my mom was driving down a local busy road. She stopped at a stoplight, and was the 3rd car in line. An SUV (Jeep Cherokee, I believe) came up behind my mom, and stopped. Someone going the opposite way (across the intersection) honked, and for some reason, the guy behind my mother slammed his foot down on the gas. My mom was not at any fault whatsoever, as she was being a law-abiding citizen, stopped at a red light, a safe distance from the car in front of her.
Second example, which is similar. A friend of mine was driving along a sidestreet, and stopped at a stop sign - again, being a law-abiding citizen and all that. A car behind him was speeding (doing about 40 on a 25mph road), and smashed into him, pushing him into the intersection (where there was an oncoming car.) My friend and the guy he hit were cleared of all charges, as there was no way that they could have prevented it.
And my li’l PSA: wear your seatbelt, because these things do happen, wearing a seatbelt very well may save your life.
But the OP complains that the fact that you were there to be hit can be construed as contrib.I find this a totally specious argument. A continuation of that thought puts murder victims partially at fault for being born, and rape victims at fault for being females without chastity belts. Basically, the dumbest line of reasoning I have ever heard.
Also, I note it is not the OP with this idea, but his friend. That is duly noted.
I can see that in many accidents, an alert, skilled driver could figure out how to avoid the crash, even one that isn’t legally his fault. But it’s easy to imagine a crash when it can’t be your fault at all. Such as if you’re sitting at a stop light and a car coming the other way crashes into you.
Twice in the last year I have been rear-ended while stopped at a light or sign. Both times the other parties insurance totally paid the claim and it was not even necessary to inform my insurance company. When I asked my insurance company about it, they said it could be recorded but wouldn’t be used against me because it was a simple rear-end collision where I was not at fault.
So, at least according to the insurance companies I have dealt with, I was not at all at fault just for being in the way of someone not paying attention.
I don’t think there’s a metaphysical aspect to the question. The OP. Blunt’s buddies appear to think “you would basically get like 10% just for being involved in the crash, no matter what the circumstances are.”
Blunt’s buddies are clearly wrong. I have two teenagers. I speak from experience.
It depends on the state. In Minnesota has a no-fault law (Personal Injury Protection) where if you had an injury, your own insurance company covers you, unless the amount exceeds (I think) 3 or 4 thousand dollars. IIRC, it’s not very common for court cases in Minnesota to go 100% either way, there is a certain penalty for just being there. Two cases I know of, one my mother, the other my wife, ended up in court. Both cases were clear cut, yet neither was awarded 100% of what they requested. I don’t think it is a law that is formerly on the books, but what is commonly practiced is the only thing that matters.
To the OP I would say, not in law, not in practice, and, not in general.
But, just playing Devil’s Advocate for one moment, if there was a rapidly approaching car behind your friend’s, maybe he could have noticed it, and in anticipation that he (your friend) was going to have to stop, and, that this might be problematic for the speeding car behind, flagged his intention to stop at the Stop sign (which may not have been observed by the speeding driver) by say pumping his brakes to flash his brake-lights.
Just in case this sounds too mad, as an inexperienced driver I was approaching a traffic-light controlled intersection when the lights turned from green to red, a car in front stopped, but I was too close to avoid hitting him (I seem to remember I even locked my brakes), the driver in front observed this and managed to pull forward into the junction (thankfully not into the line of cross-traffic) thus avoiding a rear-ender that would not have been his fault, but certainly would have been an inconvenience to both of us.
I try to drive with full knowledge of every vehicle on the road, in front and behind me, I would say it is just good practice.
What if a speeding car hits the one behind you, thus pushing it into your car? Even someone with the reflexes of a mountain lion couldn’t prevent that from happening to them.
Sorry for the unclear OP, but it looks like you all were able to answer it anyway.
Yeah, my question really was about either insurance companies and/or cops assigning blame or fault in an accident. I have heard that after an accident, fault will be assigned to the drivers involved.
For some reason, several people I know seem to beleive that you are at least somewhat at fault (leagally) in any accident you are involved in.
I disagreed with this, as it doesn’t make any sense, but I wasn’t completely sure of myself.
You guys have backed up my point, and I now have enough evidence to be sure that you can be 0% at fault for an accident you are involved in. Thanks.
I guess on a realted note: Has anyone else heard this UL repeated? Like I said, more than a few people I have talked to thought it was true. I doubted it all along, but I heard it from several sources. I wonder where this mistaken idea comes from. Any basis on some existing law or anything?
Several years ago while making a left turn on a green light I was T-boned at high speed by someone who ran a red light. Her insurance company tried to assign 10% of the responsibility to me because I “should have anticipated that someone might run the light.” I told them that was ridiculous and I would fight them in court rather than accept 1% of the fault. They ended up accepting 100% responsibility, so I’d say the answer to the OP depends in part on how willing to stick up for yourself (or how good of a bluffer) you are.
The police assign fault on a 100% basis. If they issue you a citation, then they are defining fault at 100%. Insurance companies will deal amoungst themselves and assign percentage fault based on the evidence they have and may assign you a percentage based on their personal guidlines. My wife was once in a 30 car pile-up during an episode of freezing rain. She was second in line. She came to a complete stop without hitting a car in front that had spun out and was at a complete standstill. The next car rear ended her at about 40 mph, pushing her into the car in front. The bottom line in all this was the insurance companies involved decided there was no way to figure out what really happened. Each paid for their own driver without assigning them any blame, except for the deductible, but when I bitched that she was at zero fault and wanted the deductible paid as well. I guess the fact that my wife had a vertebral compression fracture and I threatened to sue had something to do with it. You can sue your own insurance company.
Don’t misunderstand me, you are absolutely right, sometimes the best driving in the world is not good enough to avoid some lunatics, I just wanted to suggest that one could take a pro-active view, and anticipate that some of the time the lunatics will be avoidable – I gave an example where one pro-active driver saved me from my own idiocy, I have since done the same for others.