Well, trans and cis have the same origin and are exact opposites: “trans” means “across”, “cis” means “on the same side”. We use them in chemistry to describe the geometry around double bonds.
A trans person is someone whose internal gender and official label at birth are on opposite sides; a cis person is one whose sides match. That’s all.
There’s lots of things which are strange when you first run into them; heck, I’ve been having to answer if I want to be addressed as Miss, Ms. or Mrs. for years and I still find it strange. Translations to Spanish are even worse; some pages make you choose between Srta., Sra. or Sra., while never differentiating between Dr. and Dra.
Yes, the first time I saw the word “cis” being used to describe gender, I thought back to my college biochemistry class, and worked out what it had to mean based on what the prefixes mean in chemistry.
But to those who think that “cis” is derogatory description of their own condition: what would you prefer to be called?
Maybe. But that was because I thought it was common knowledge that a man dating a woman would expect that woman to conform with 99.4% of the female population.
But somehow, the assumption that the woman you are dating is a cisgender woman is a faulty assumption, even though it applies to 99.4% of the population.
In any event, the knowledge is going to come out eventually. I am just trying understand why sooner wouldn’t be better than later from the point of view of a transgender person.
The difference is that when a person says “I don’t want to date or have sex with a transwoman” it implies that such a person wouldn’t date or have sex with her regardless of whether she is pre or post-op.
If you are willing to consider a post-op transwoman with a constructed vagina as a potential date or lover then, in fact, you do not automatically exclude ALL transwomen. That actually is a significant distinction.
Maybe its just the women I know but they generally use dating apps to try to find someone compatible. If they are looking for a Jewish man, they are usually pretty up front about that rather than date total strangers in the hopes that if the guy isn’t Jewish, they might convert to Judaism. If they are looking for a college educated man, they seem to select for that rather than date total strangers and hope that if they hook up with a non-college educated guy, he goes on to become a college graduate. If I was deaf, I would want people to know up front so I don’t waste my time going on dates with men who are not interested in dating a deaf woman. None of these are perfect analogies but until someone comes up with a better one…
ISTM that if I am using a dating app as a transgender woman, I would want to filter out anyone that wasn’t interested in dating a transgender woman.
I don’t doubt that there is a population of people who are genuinely interested in dating a transgender person. I am pretty sure that the 20% of people whoa re open to dating transgender are not all trying to satisfy their bucket list.
Clearly? Transgenderism reduces the likelihood of procreation. Things that reduce the chances of having children that survive into adulthood are NOT generally considered evolutionary advantages. It is not even clear that transgenderism is a heritable trait.
They can. Its just inefficient to have 80% of the population make contingencies for something that happens far less than 1% of the time. Better to have the <1% of the population prepare for the contingency that will happen to them 80%+ of the time.
No, that’s not victim blaming. Its engaging in known risky behavior. I think there ought to be a la against beating up someone because they are transgender, what’s that? There IS a law and it is almost universally supported?
What demands? You don’t have to disclose your transgenderism. I think its dishonest to keep that to yourself but YMMV.
I would like to hear the utilitarian argument that supports your conclusion.
No, utilitarian principle means more than “whatever the fuck I feel like”
Your opinions are in fact your opinions. My opinions are buttressed by a utilitarian argument that I have made right here in this thread. Utilitarian arguments frequently fail in the face of equity and justice arguments (See, Americans with Disabilities Act) but there is no greater justice in making 80% of the people disclose than making 1% of the people disclose.
Well, don’t you know people from school and through friends? Some avenue of meeting men that gives you some opportunity to exchange material facts BEFORE you start dating?
Since being trans isn’t as socially acceptable as being Jewish or college educated, someone might be shy about blurting it out to the world over the internet, even though it does have to come up sometime between the first date and the wedding.
OK so I created a dummy account on a dating site and the ask just about everything. One thing they do not ask is whether a open to dating transgender. It also doesn’t ask if I am transgende. Why is that?
Even tho I am not happy with “cis” I agree, it is not almost always used as a perjoritive, while those terms usually are.
If I had to make a comparison, I would say “cis” is about even with “Negroid”, that is a correct scientific term that should be used with caution outside a scientific paper.
I am not saying we should ban "cis’ or that it is hate speech, but one should just realize that some find it offensive and some use it as a perjoritive. My post was a attempt to educate, not castigate.
Likely this is going off the tracks here, perhaps back to the main subject?
It seems very similar to telling a woman she can’t wear certain clothes, go to certain places, talk to certain people, or else she bring any assault or rape on herself. Which is victim-blaming.
Because you can’t apply any basis for the exact break-point of where it becomes more “utilitarian” to go ahead and have cisgender men be forthright about their preferences, it certainly seems like that.
Honestly, I don’t know why you aren’t seeing why it’s simply in your opinion - because you cannot give a concrete reason for why you chose the breakpoints you did. I asked earlier, how many transgender persons would there need to be on dating sites before your argument no longer holds for you, and you couldn’t say. That makes it entirely your opinion. You could easily claim so long as less than 49.5% of the women on a site were transgender, that the majority should rule - due to “utilitarian” principles.
Here’s my utilitarian principle: because the “burden” on poor, oppressed cisgender males is merely to have to type “no trans” (I timed it, it took 2 seconds to type. Two miserable measly seconds) or whatever else they feel into their profile, that pales compared to the burden of proactively giving out personal medical history and information to the entire general public on the dating site. Thus they should be doing it if there is any chance they might hook up with a transgender person. That’s my “utilitarian principle.”
AGAIN, I can’t read minds but it really seems like it’s just that people don’t want their bias exposed to the light of day. Kinda like all the Trump voters who were ashamed to answer honestly in polls and interviews.
Dress it up with whatever PHIL 101 words you want, it’s still just your opinion. Just as mine is mine.
Your argument is what, at that point? “Why can’t kids today just meet their sweethearts at the sock hop or for a chocolate phosphate at Elmer’s diner?”
Indeed, the OED recognizes somewhat different definitions for sex and gender since before Shakespeare. Perhaps duckofdeath is like Encino Man or Donald Trump, awakened suddenly in a post-hunter-gatherer world of scary new things?
I’m curious on your thoughts regarding OK Cupid that was shown upthread. There are personal choices for different genders of the profile maker. Do you advise against transgender people selecting “transgender” when creating a profile on that dating site?
Well, s/he’s white-knighting for Clothathup over in that esteemed boardmember’s current “Will the Left & Right Ever Agree On Anything?” well-poisoning fest in the Pit, so that invites some speculation, given the late join date…
