Are contractors supposed to be like this?

In My Humble Opinion
1

We’re in the process of remodeling our little townhouse, with the goal of increasing its value as muchas possible and then selling it as we upgrade to our next (minor) fixer-upper. We’ve got new paint, new carpet, new window coverings, a completely gutted and rebuilt bathroom, and a completely remodeled bathroom. All of this, sparing the carpet installation, we’ve done ourselves.

However, the BIG item is next (and last): the kitchen. We do not have the knowledge or skill to tackle that project in its entirety, so we will need to a contractor.

I already have a suspicion of them. Not that they’re crooks, necessarily–more that they’re flakes. For example…hubby’s coworker’s hubby (got it?) is a contractor. We thought hey, great! Would you help us with the new tile in the entry and bathroom? (We basically needed the help laying it out; we had it all before and after that.) Sure, he says. How about Tuesday. Tuesday: No, today’s not good. Call me Thursday. No answer Thursday. Friday: Well, it’s too late for me to come today. How about I come Tuesday. Tuesday: Can’t make it today (his wife, BTW, does nearly all the phone contacts). How about…?

This is where I saw eff this. Hubby laid out the tile himself, and did a damn fine job if I do say so myself.

I’ve chatted with three different people regarding their various experiences with contractors, and all three had similar experiences. People the hubby has chatted with echo similar difficulties in getting them to actually come out and DO THE WORK. One, in fact, was irked their customer wouldn’t pay them for the job–even though he hadn’t FINISHED it and hadn’t been exactly available TO finish it.

Remodeling the kitchen makes me a bit nervous considering this. I can’t stand flaky people, especially when it comes to performing their professional duties. If they say they’ll be there Tuesday, I expect to see them Tuesday. One rescheduling is understandable–but constantly needing to?? Come on…

Your experiences? Thoughts? Recommendations? Is this acceptable/accepted/expected behavior?

2

My Dad, brothers, uncles, etc. all are in the drywall/contracting business, and yeah, this is a lot of what it’s like. It’s like that for a few reasons.

1 - your job is a pretty small job. Contractors take on small jobs where they fit in their schedules, and they’re fairly low priority.

2 - Big jobs are hard to schedule, due to other contracters not getting done when they should, lack of manpower, lack of material, etc. If the wiring doesn’t get done when it should, then the drywallers can’t do their thing. If the drywallers aren’t done, then the painters can’t paint. Things get shuffled around quite a bit at times. When you’re waiting for them to have a day or two free to come do your small job, this can be a nightmare.

3 - Often, the workforce a contractor has to work with are less than ideal. Now, there’s some great, responsible painters/drywallers/tilers/etc out there. But for every great one, there’s three who are in the business because they can’t get any other work. They don’t show up on time, they take off when they should be working, etc. etc.

As for the guy wanting to be paid before he did the work, that’s crap. Don’t pay for ANYTHING until it’s done AND you’re happy with it. If it’s 95% good, but you just don’t like that one little thing, don’t pay until they come back and fix it. Contracting ain’t rocket science, and you should insist on quality work.

IMO, your experience is typical. Hell, we had a bunch of work done in our house last summer. I have a ton of connections in this town, my name is recognized as being “in the business”, and the guy we got to paint our house was both a family friend and a business relationship. Still, they didn’t show up to do our house until 3-4 weeks AFTER they were supposed to begin, and we had to bitch a little towards the end when the contractor wanted to pull all but one guy out of our house to go work on another, larger project.

3

It sounds like you needed a favor,did you actually discuss hiring him??I’m not a contractor but am a carpenter, every coupla months a friend, or a friend of a friend or family member"needs help with this or that" THAT means a favor

In builder speak “laying it out” means coming in taking measurements,snap a few chalk lines.marking for the first tiles,etc.something that’d take me an hour at most. I probably woulnt do it if I were a contractor,they usually have a helluva schedual. If I did take it I’d want to do the whole job to make it worth my time,in that case we’d sit and discuss payment first. then i’d send in one of my carpenters to do the work (depending on how big of business I ran I 'spose)

Now that sounds fllakey,unprofessional. I usually just say no.

I hope you had the right underlayment and/or used fixall. Or the now nice tile job could start cracking 6mo from now

You can usually check them out first. Not exactly sure how as I have never had to hire one.I think its through either the BBB or the govt bureaucracy responsible for issuing their contractor license. Make sure they have a license and are bonded/insured. Usually they have their cont lic# pasted to their plaque on their company vehicle or in their ad in the paper, at any rate if asked their supposed to produce it.

A good contractor will always have a payment schedual in the contract. EX: I will do this much of the job, at that point you pay this much,and if you dont pay I stop at that point,etc. Also a good cotract will cover both parties. contracts can get real complex I dont get into that end of things tho.

No not acceptable in my book. also do some research before hiring a contractor. This is usually the biggest investment people make in their lifetime,dont just go with the first contractor that comes along just cause its convenient…

4

I suggest looking on www.troubleshooter.com and checking BOTH the “referral list” AND the “sleaze brigade”, in order to stay on the referral list, you MUST be customer friendly and contractor complaints are regularly discussed by Tom Martino “the troubleshooter”, in short CYA, it’s a jungle out there.

unclviny

5

As a former contractor and current kitchen designer/technical editor for a cabinet manufacturer, I have to say I have come across this quite a lot.

My take on it is that there are a lot of flakes out there, but there are also a ton of competent, trustworthy contractors, if you screen them carefully.

Tell me where in S Cal you are and I’ll check with my local dealer there and get some referrals for you if you wish.

As for the layout help, I’d be happy to look at whatever floorplan you have and make some suggestions. email me for more info.

You say you have gutted and rebuilt a bathroom and done tile work. I’d say you have most of the skill needed to do a large portion of a kitchen remodel yourselves. Certainly the gut, walls, finiish plumbing and electric, and maybe most of the cabinet install (less trim). You should think about doing that and hiring a contractor to come in and do your rough plumbiong elec (if any), your moulding install if you dont have a mitre saw and some experience doing that, and the counter top. You should be able to save a ton of money.

Are you doing the floor? Hmm, I could ask about another page of questions but to get back to the OP;

  1. Check references that are at least 18 months old as well as see current jobs. You want to see how they manage a jobsite and also see how their work holds up over the long term. Get business refs as well, if they wont tell you where they buy their materials, chances are their suppliers have not nice things to say about them (Bad Sign)

1A) The main reason for getting the older references is you want someone who has been doing it a while and more importantly stayed in business. YOu do NOT want to be some guys first or even tenth job. You are not a training facility!

  1. Educate yourself thoroughly on the products you are buying so you can answer questions and analyze bids with some assurance what the contractor tells you they are giving you is what you want.

  2. Written contract. seems silly but Ive seen way too many jobs go south and with no written contract, getting satisfaction is near impossible. If a contractor doesnt have readily available contracts, change orders, etc, be wary.

6

You might also have better luck with a contractor who specializes in kitchen and bath remodeling, rather than a general contractor. You might find a general contractor who’s great at framing and roofing, but isn’t really adept at getting cabinets installed, or at making a template from which to fabricate your countertops. Better to have someone who does that kind of work all the time.

7

A little clarification (thanks for bringing it to my attention, Tony Montana, didn’t realize how it could sound)–we had indeed hired the friend’s hubby to do the layout. It was a favor of sorts, certainly, but it was a paid gig. BTW, hubby and I both did a ton of research–bought and read a few books, researched and printed a few things online–before laying out the tile. (It’s actually natural stone.) The contractor hubby-of-friend did give us tips on what products to use. BTW–this contractor hubby-of-friend is the same one that got irked over not being paid before the work was done.

MikeG, we’re in the San Gabriel valley–Pasadena, Monrovia, Azusa, Glendora are all nearby. :slight_smile: We’d LOVE any tips!

BTW–another opinion sought. What about the contractors hired by the large home improvement stores, like Lowe’s and Home Depot? Installation is included for their cabinets. I understand we’ll pay a premium for this, but my main interest is quality of work (and materials) and getting it done without some sort of major scheduling hassle. Obviously, we want to save as much $$ as possible.

So how do those folks fare?