Could I declare myself as a moral supporter of Al-Queda or Hamas or the IRA (insert freedom fighter/terrorist group of choice here) and set up a shop on the downtown plaza to distribute literature on their behalf so long as I did not collect funds for them?
What (if any) are the legal or constitutional limits on my freedom of expression with respect to my political beliefs in this regard.
In theory, you are free to declare your support for anyone. You can’t send money to terrorist groups, but you can express your admiration for them and hand out leaflets.
There are issues with shopping malls, since they are often considered places of business and not a public forum. But you could set up something on Main Street as long as it wasn’t blocking things.
In practice, distributing literature on Al-Queda in a public place would probably get you threats or worse. The police wouldn’t be too quick to protect you, either, and might try to arrest you for some technical violation to defuse the situation, at least. You may also have the FBI asking a few questions.
Any political group that suggests killing the President would be illegal.
If you advocate commiting criminal acts then you could be guilty of a crime yourself. But if you worded things carefully you would probably be in the clear legally. You couldn’t encourage people to commit crimes, or indicate that you were going to engage in a criminal act yourself, or make threats against specific people. You could also be arrested for disturbing the peace if your actions created a scene. And of course you can’t give a criminal organization money or material aid.
But if all you did was stand on a corner and state that you support Al Qaida and Saddam Hussein there’s nothing illegal about that.
I thought it was illegal (under treason) to associate with groups that advocate the violent overthrow of the United States government.
You would need to be careful exactly what the printed materials said.
If they advised people to vote for representatives sympathetic to the “cause” (whatever that might be), then you should be OK.
If they said it was the duty of the people to rise up and throw off the chains of oppression of our current government, you could be in substantial trouble. Up to 20 years worth in prison.
From 18 U.S.C. §2385 (as of Jan. 2, 2001)
Whoever, with intent to cause the overthrow or destruction of any such government, prints, publishes, edits, issues, circulates, sells, distributes, or publicly displays any written or printed matter advocating, advising, or teaching the duty, necessity, desirability, or propriety of overthrowing or destroying any government in the United States by force or violence, or attempts to do so;
Etc, etc.
Under the Smith act of 1940, you could be tossed in the can for just belonging to an organization that said it would be a good thing if SOMEONE (not necessarily you) overthrew the government.
54 Stat. 670, 671, title I, §§2-3 (June 28, 1940)
Sec. 2. (a) It shall be unlawful for any person–
(1) to knowingly or willfully advocate, abet, advise, or teach the duty, necessity, desirability, or propriety of overthrowing or destroying any government in the United States by force or violence, or by the assassination of any officer of any such government;
That “desirability” clause is a crusher.
I have found mention on the web that that Supreme Court modified this standard in 1957 to require active participation in or encouragement of acts to overthrow the government to invoke the Smith act, but this contradicts their actions in 1961 on the Scales case, so I’m going to ask if one of our more knowledgeable posters can clear this up for us.
Scales was sent to prison because he was a member of the Communist Party, and the Supreme Court upheld the conviction 5-4. Kennedy had to pardon the man to get him out of prison.
It is illegal to advocate the violent overthrow of the us government, and it can be illegal to advocate commiting a crime, depending on exactly how you word it.
I don’t think it is illegal to be a member of any group. But what exactly does group membership mean? If you pay membership dues to Al Qaida, you are giving money to a terrorist group and that would be illegal. But Al Qaida doesn’t work that way typically. If you just stop on a street corner and proclaimed, “I’m a member of Al Qaida and I think what they’re doing is great” then you haven’t broken any law as far as I can tell. If you keep it general, don’t advocate any actions that are crimes, and make no threats, then you would be legally safe.
Proclaiming yourself a member of Al Qaida or publicly supporting their actions would probably give the FBI probable cause to investigate you, although it wouldn’t be a crime itself.
Whoops, quoted wrong paragraph of the 1940 Smith act.
I meant to quote this one:
(3) to organize or help to organize any society, group, or assembly of persons who teach, advocate, or encourage the overthrow or destruction of any government in the United States by force or violence; or to be or become a member of, or affiliate with, any such society, group, or assembly of persons, knowing the purposes thereof.
Preview is a much better friend when you actually read it for content…
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.
So it would seems you have an open forum. But do you? Only one way to find out…and that is present yourself in the public square (nice control experiment) and see. My guess is if the you survive stoning from the general public…you would come under the watchful eye of the FBI and in the name of national security your life will be a living hell…unless you are deemed so small a fish as not to be bothered with…on the other hand the American Civil Liberties Union might come to your rescue and transform you into a media darling…it could go 50-50.
Treason has a very specific definition in the USA, one that is far more narrow than in any other country in the world.
Ah, it’s time for the pre-freshman lecture.
Here it is in a nutshell:
“Freedom of speech does not include the ‘freedom’ to frivolously yell ‘Fire!’ in a crowded theater.”
Once, when applying to work at Honeywell Defense Systems (working on programming for ‘smart’ torpedos), I had to fill out a detailed security clearance form.
In it they asked the names, descriptions, purpose of organization, leaders of organization, and dates of membership for every organization I belonged to or had ever belonged to. And then there was a note that per US law, ‘political parties’ were exempted.
So I asked them: “This seems to mean I have to list all my 4-H Project teams from my pre-teen years. But if I was an active member in the Communist Party of the USA, I wouldn’t have to list that?”
He said: “Yes, that’s right. But frankly, if you were a member of the CP-USA, the govt people who do these clearances would probably already know about you.”