The rapid departure of the US military ahead of the Taliban’s resurgence over the last 2-3 months has me convinced that they are cowards. I understand fear of being killed, I was in the military myself. With that said I don’t understand the mindset of the members of the US military who are literally handing Afghanistan over to Taliban, ensuring the people—men, women, and children—will have miserable lives. These aren’t just a bunch of civilian bakers and carpenters who were captured by some hostile force. These are men and women who hold arms and were trained to fight and just said “f**k it”. I honestly don’t know how these guys and gals can pack up ahead of the Taliban and then go look their families in the eye with a shrug. I keep hearing how the US needs to support its troops and all, and I generally agree, but only if they stand and fight. If your country sucks fight to fix your country. Don’t invade some other country, set it all afire, then pull out and watch it burn from the outside.
What possible justification could there be for turning and running away like this if it’s not cowardice?
The military is being pulled out of Afghanistan by the US government - which might or might not be the right call, I really could not tell you - they’ve been there for 20 years and as far as I can tell they haven’t made much progress. I’m inclined to think that’s just the nature of Afghanistan being a remote region that can’t be conquered. If the Soviets, who were far more brutal, couldn’t do it, then I don’t think the US can. It’s not a matter of being cowards.
Proper heroes would just keep fighting, right? I mean, since it goes without saying that Afghans should be able to fight on in the name of the system the US government sought to establish, it stands to reason that Americans should fight on too, no matter what. Right? I mean, sure, they might have to disobey orders to do so, but if one is prepared to die for a cause—as surely anyone who isn’t a coward ready to lay down their arms before the Taliban would be—then it seems like merely disobeying orders and risking imprisonment ought to be nothing by comparison.
If Afghans are cowards for not wanting to die, then what are we to think of those who have abandoned them to choose between the Taliban and death?
You are a weak and illogical parody of a sapient creature, thy foul dissembling rot’d custard! Flee to thine darkest crevice and hide thine deformity of rectitude and exiguity of wit, you carnival outcast!
The OP of that thread is a veteran of the war in Afghanistan and appears frustrated with the lack of progress in fighting off the Taliban there. And I can’t say I blame him. He’s just one of many people who was sent there to perform a mission that seems unattainable, to say nothing of the Afghan residents already there who have to deal with the fallout.
I’m 35, so I was in high school when 9/11 happened. As far as I have been able to discern, the only reason we ever invaded Afghanistan was in retaliation for 9/11. Osama Bin Laden was supposedly hiding there, and the Taliban was somehow affiliated with the people who attacked the World Trade Center, so we had to attack them. OK, I get that. “You hit me, I’ll hit you.” The concept of regime change did not and still does not make sense to me. If Russia could not impose its will on Afghanistan, I don’t think anyone can.
I empathize 100% with veterans of the war there who feel like the country has given up on their mission, just like I understand the way so many Vietnam veterans feel. But, as with Vietnam, I think we should have cut our losses a long time ago rather than continuing to dig in and get more people killed. I’m no expert on any of this, I’ve never served in the military, I don’t think any group of people can be categorically called cowards. The blame, as usual, seems to lie with the policy-makers at the top who never have to face the life-and-death consequences of their decisions.
You can change “supposedly” to “was hiding there”, there is little doubt that OBL was hiding in Afghanistan at the time of the invasion. There is even further evidence U.S. forces came tantalizingly close to actually capturing him in Afghanistan, and additional claims that the Bush Administration’s decision to then invade Iraq drained resources and attention from that conflict and OBL was able to slip into Pakistan into a house compatriots of his prepared for his protection.
Except that OP hasn’t questioned the US decision to withdrawal, but rather leapt to making some pretty broad and damning indictments of the people left behind to face what may in effect be a no win scenario. @Cubsfan can fuck right off with that nonsense as far as I’m concerned.
Whatever basis @Cubsfan may have to levy accusations against the people, or even just the men (a fine example of toxic masculinity that is, too) of Afghanistan, might just as well be held up to a mirror and reflected back at the US and its military.
I hope that Democrats don’t ‘brag’ about ending the war in Afghanistan. What they’re leaving behind is a nightmare.
Mind you, I don’t blame Biden or the Dems. If anyone is more accountable for ‘losing’ Afghanistan, it’s Bush’s neo-cons, but as we’ve said before, it was always a mighty long shot.
I don’t like this thread or the one you’re responding to. I personally know two Seals who were killed there and I’ve worked with international students from Kabul who thought we were offering them a better tomorrow.
Well, since the thread I am responding to is apparently 100% okay by board rules, it seems to me I am being downright magnanimous by opening this thread up here, as opposed to in IMHO.
The military is being pulled out of Afghanistan by the US government - which might or might not be the right call, I really could not tell you - they’ve been there for 20 years and as far as I can tell they haven’t made much progress. I’m inclined to think that’s just the nature of Afghanistan being a remote region that can’t be conquered. If the Soviets, who were far more brutal, couldn’t do it, then I don’t think the US can. It’s not a matter of being cowards.
