Are there other cultures that don't get hung up on punctuality for work?

Glad to share the wealth of my limited knowledge. I first heard it when I was in the Army and some good ol’ boy was griping about a black soldier who was always the last one to show up for formation. Real classy.

When I read the thread title and saw who the OP was I immediately put on my David Duke decoder ring and knew what he was referring to.

That one was fun, wasn’t it? That’s where one poster argued that being late is a mental disorder and that people who are chronically late should be looked upon as having a disability on the order of ADD or worse. :smiley:

When I was a barista, I was late to every single shift–usually by a minute or two, but sometimes by 10 or 30. I never heard a peep about it. Like everything else, there’s more variation in this facet of American culture than we give it credit for.

And FTR, Commonsense, I didn’t just decide to show up late to work (and class and everything else) every day. I really, really wanted to be on time to everything, and I beat myself up the entire time I was driving somewhere for leaving the house later than I wanted to. It took some behavioral therapy to work that out, although it didn’t take too long.

OTOH, sometimes advising someone to invest in a session or two of therapy is like wielding a pair of nail clippers at a gunfight. As for the question the OP actually asked, I hear that the concept of time is much more general in some African countries. I had a teacher who had been a missionary in Africa, and outlined the difference thusly:

American invitation:

P1: “Why don’t you come over tomorrow afternoon?”
P2: “What time?”
P1: “Oh, I dunno, about 12, 12:30.”

P2 is expected anywhere between 12 and 1, and the host will be at least mildly miffed and maybe pretty pissed off if she shows up at 3.

African invitation:
P1: “Why don’t you come over tomorrow afternoon?”
P2: “What time?”
P1: “Um…the afternoon.”

P2 can show up at 3:30 and P1 will say “I’m so happy you came!” and mean it.

Here is a piece about how Mexico has been slowly abandoning the siesta and the concept of “general time” over the last few years, and here’s one about how support is growing for the abolition of Spain’s version. IMO, it’s a tragedy that the world is wrapping itself around the American concept of time, especially since modern medicine is proving that the classical Spanish concept of time is healthier.

This was part of the problem. Nobody called me on my shit. Which was part of a general pattern of letting everyone get away with whatever they wanted at my last job, really, and you can imagine how well it worked for all of the other problems they had…

No, it’s a gambit from over hear.

Just so you know that Slypork isn’t being a VCO3, I had a black roommate who spoke often of CPT.

Cite on the “modern medicine is proving” bit?

And it’s not “American”. It’s “British” and evolved from the use of railroad timetables. When the train leaves at 1:20, it leaves at 1:20. Arriving “in the afternoon” just ain’t gonna cut it. :wink:

See, it’s this attitude that I don’t understand - why does it bother you so much? Is that coworker relieving you (in which case I fully get it), or are you just annoyed that he’s not there at the magical time that was mandated? Does it bother you less if he stays five or ten minutes late to compensate?

Again, I’m chronically late, and I think that the whole idea of “on time” - when it’s not a social engagement or you aren’t specifically relieving someone else - is arbitrary and pointless. If I get the work done that I’m supposed to get done, why does it matter whether or not I was there exactly at some randomly chosen time?

Really? From your OP:

So what the fuck is your excuse?

So do we agree that it is unreasonable to declare by fiat that failure to strictly adhere to an arbitrary “be at work at 9” constitutes “rudeness,” “selfish,” “unreliability,” or a message that “everyone else can F off”:

It certainly might be some or all of those things, but it would require analysis of the specific work situation in question and the needs of co-workers, company, supervisor, customers and clients, etc.

If nobody needs you to be perfectly punctual and nobody is inconvenienced by the absence of perfect punctuality, then these conclusory attitudes are unsupported and unreasonable.

Am I being whooshed, or did you actually just ask me for a cite that I provided in the very same paragraph as the sentence you quoted?

Boy, you sure live up to your name, Hostile. :stuck_out_tongue: I only heard it used in a derogatory manner by white people who wanted to gripe about black people being shiftless, lazy, etc. I know that some black people joke amongst themselves about CPT, including this author, but given VCO3’s track record, I immediately thought of his usual MO.

Oh no! I’m profiling VCO3’s posts! I’m a VCO3ist!

I guess I’m sleepy. :wink: As well as the server - it’s timed out on me a number of times on this thread.

I think you need to send your ring in for a tune up. “CPT” is an old term, used mostly among black people themselves, just like WhyNot’s examples are used among the ethnic groups they apply to. Your good ol’ boy notwithstanding, it has been my experience (as a black person), that most white people, especially young white people, have never heard of it.

Furthermore VCO3 has posted a previous thread complaining about the need to be punctual, so apparently this is a real issue for him.

In other words, I think you are doing VCO3 an injustice. He has made enough trouble for himself in the past, most of it deserved. We really don’t need to manufacture trouble on his behalf.

Just chimin’ in, as a middle-aged white guy, to say that I’ve never encountered the expression except as used among black people, and when I have seen it used, white people have commonly required an explanation.

(And it’s not like I’ve led a sheltered life when it comes to hearing white racist remarks. :frowning: )

Moderator Note:

Stop this immediately. We don’t call names and we don’t call trolls in General Questions. If you want to call VCO3 out on an OP, take it to the Pit. Thanks.

Gfactor
General Questions Moderator

As a white person, I’ve never heard of Coloured Peoples’ Time.

Mea culpa. If VCO3’s OP indeed did not have an ulterior motive, than I am wholeheartedly sorry.

However, since first hearing the term used by a racist redneck (he was proud that his ancesters fought alongside Lee), I have heard many bigots use it. They love the idea that blacks still have the stereotype of that shuffling, shambling Stepin Fetchit. Their use of the term CPT, though, is akin to black people using the “n” word amongst themselves and it being, if not acceptable, tolerated but when a white person uses it all hell breaks loose. To me, it doesn’t matter who uses it. It is still offensive and is something that should be cast aside.

Personally I don’t think there is any excuse for habitual tardiness. I don’t care who you are, what your ethnicity is or what kinds of excuses you dream up. If you are supposed to be at work from 9 to 5 then you show up by 9 and you leave at 5. If I am there at 9 and am counting on something from you, but you don’t stroll in until 9:30, then you are inconveniencing me, our customers and our company. Set your clock ahead so you don’t run late anymore. Give yourself a few extra minutes just in case traffic is bad.

The message I get from someone who is habitually late is, “My time is more important than yours and I’ll get there when I’m damn good and ready. If you don’t like it, tough titties.”

Again, mea culpa. I will refrain from casting aspersions upon the distinguished ** VCO3**.

I completely forgot that I made that thread. I’m losing my mind.

I was once told by a woman who spent half her office time in Mexico and half in Denver that I (in Denver) was on “mexican time.” The specific occurrence when she said this was when I’d said I’d be in about 9 and I managed to get there around 10:30. But in all fairness, I’d been there until about 3 that morning dealing with a computer that lost a whole issue of one of our weeklies.

Also, I used to go to LA for meetings about once a month. Everybody was late, always. I was usually on time but that was because I started from Denver at 4:30 a.m. to catch my plane and I always figured that was the important one–not to miss the plane–and I never did. After that it was pretty much up to the air controllers and how long I had to wait for the rental car and then how much traffic I had to drive through. I would get kind of steamed when people came in really late complaining about the traffic but really, once I caught the plane, I was kind of on the express with nothing to distract me like a spouse who couldn’t find socks or a kid who just remembered he needed a science notebook and noplace to go but straight to the office where we were meeting.

This world is full of aliens.

Thank you.

I do think we have all focused in very tightly on the work aspect of being on time.