Well from recent posts about how Allawi shot people, prisoner abuse, insurrections on a wide scale, mounting deaths and dispair even rape and Zionism by proxy ( :rolleyes: )
Are we doing anything right?
What is ‘Zionism by proxy’? Is proxy over there commiting Zionism all over the place? Are we resettling jews into Iraq? Inquiring minds want to know!
Haha, no I read on Islamic forum that they are trying to subvert Muslims by getting the U.S to control them for their purposes of creating unrest and getting the Kurdish to create a new state, divide and conquer etc…
Yes, we’re doing a lot of good, trying to rebuild their infrastructure, bring order to chaos (and I know our actions caused a lot of the damage and chaos), and generally trying to help people. The overwhelming majority of the intentions by our guys over there are good, the actual number of good actions exceeds bad actions, and I believe our forces are trying their damnedest to do the right thing.
It’s just that given the society and the situation, I’m not sure the net result will be good.
No, scratch that. I greatly fear that the net result will not be good. But not due to malice on the part of the vast majority of our forces there. They were not given the proper training or tools to do what is being asked of them.
How do you train a twenty-year-old Guardsmen from Cedar Rapids how to walk on water, raise the dead, and turn a giant prison camp into a bourgeois parliamentary democracy?
Thats true, but do you think the media could be a little more supportive? And are there any Muslims at all who will ever be able to see the better angels of our nature, or is that just hoping too much?
Well, we broke their arm, now we’re taking them to the hospital. That’s good, right? :rolleyes:
That’s hoping too much. An unbiased media (which I don’t think we have) needs to report on what is actually happening, good and bad, so that people can have informed opinions. Moreover, the people on the receiving end of our invasion have a right to be angry at the bad things that have resulted – they’re not in a position to look past death and destruction in order to praise us for rebuilding damage we caused.
Overall, I agree with Qadcop – I think many people over there are working their asses off solely to try to improve things. But they’re working against a backdrop of incredible anguish and frustration recently caused by the same country they’re representing. Over 10,000 dead Iraqi civilians, minimal security (allowing thugs and criminals to go unchecked), and tremendous damage and destruction. It’s a shitty situation in which to try to do good, and must be incredibly frustrating for the people over there who are working so hard to make things better. That’s not a reason to try to downplay the bad, though, it’s a reason not to start wars unless you have to.
I have a friend serving in Iraq and I’d like to pass along these two stories I heard from him.
My friend Mike was directing crews that were repairing the power system in Iraq. Now occassionally one of those high tension towers would get blown up and knock out power and they would go and rebuild those. One day at one of the destroyed towers they found a note from presuably the bombers. In broken english it read,
We’ll stop blowing these up when you get the power restored.
The second story is this. He was out with a convoy and they stop in what looks like the middle of nowhere. Of course within minutes they are surrounded by kids. The G.I.s all hand out the little gifts they have to the kids who are now begging for them. They hand out candy and bottled water and when they do the kids are “We love America! America is great!” Now Mike runs of things to give them. A kids asks for something and he says “Sorry, I don’t have any more.” The kid responds with “FUCK YOU! FUCK AMERICA!”
Mike has done this sort of work in Afghanistan and Bosnia and he thinks the Iraqi people are just some of the worst people he’s ever met. He still tries hard to do his jobs as best as he can but the people are really getting to him.
To think that nothing good is happening in Iraq is to underestimate the level of character of the average US service person. I am certain the individual acts of charity, goodwill and courage are carried out each and every day.
But it seems that an organized push for reconstruction and humanitarian aid is getting bogged down due to security concerns. There aren’t enough feet on the ground over there to manage organized feats of goodwill, so nothing makes the news. But the individual feats continue on each day.
I suspected that Fox might have something on this, and lo and behold:
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,119503,00.html
Among the things they list:
[ul]
[li] Rescuing Iraqis from a thug dictator[/li][li] Ending the pillaging of Iraq’s treasury[/li][li] Eliminating once and for all the spectre of Iraqi WMDS known to have existed[/li][li] Improvement in the quality of life[/li][li] 2,500 schools rennovated, and 800 more on schedule[/li][li] 9 million math and science textbooks distributed[/li][li] Health budget increased by more than $900 million[/li][li] 30% increase in health-care eligibility[/li][li] 900% increase in doctors’ salaries[/li][li] Availability of cancer drugs[/li][li] New human rights and revamped justice system with 600 new judges[/li][li] Elections scheduled (real ones, not 100% Saddam “elections”)[/li][li] Freedom of speech[/li][li] 120 newspapers publishing[/li][li] Internet access and satellite dishes, banned previously[/li][li] Revival of oil production[/li][li] Electricity 40% above pre-war capacity[/li][li] Ongoing improvements to water supply and other infrastructure facilities[/li][li] New sewage facilities, including a neighborhood in Basra that was awash in raw sewage for 17 years[/li][li] Baghdad airport now up to 43 flights per day, including service to Jordan[/li][li] Widespread cell phone usage, banned previously[/li][/ul]
Is there any wheat amongst that chaff?
Well, people keep telling me its the Wests ‘Gaza Strip’ or ‘Graveyard’ I joined an Islamic forum some while back, and I declared my own little Jihad to get some Muslim people reassured about our intentions and to argue about how we’re there for good even though the reason was bad. What I heard from them was depressing, they accused our troops of everything under the sun, rape, murder, killing babies with intent, the sort of stuff which would make the Republican guard look like saints, and I thought ‘How we help them when they don’t even want to be helped no matter how bad a situation it is?’
Like the Americans seeing the good side of their nature? As long as we view them how we do, they’ll view us like they do.
[ul][]Once again cleaning up another geo-political mess that was caused by European colonialism[]Shedding light on the corrupt sewer known as the UN[/ul]
Yeah because everyone views Muslims as terrorists :rolleyes:
My view of them is this, they’re miserable under their rulers.
You know what they say about the news industry? Good news is no news.
Of course, you fool. We’re creating a launch platform for the post-election unprovoked assault on Iran.
Sorry to say, but a lot of people do. Look at our attitudes towards the French, it’s the same shit.
So are we.
their reasons I think are alot more pressing than ours.