Ego and Nocturne answered my question very well. I’ve heard arguments by others (perhaps not well learned others) regarding how “God is just a fairy tale”. And then those people went on to allude to the Christmas story as a “pretty little tale” etc.
Have always been curious.
Regarding the flying into buildings and Spanish inquisition etc? You’re absolutely right. But remember, those acts were perpetrated by men who took it upon themselves to decide what “God meant” by his word.
Part of the reason I left the baptist church. I found that the teachings of my church actually weren’t supported by the Bible, but had more or less been “reinterpreted” to mean what the " powers that be" in the church wanted them to be.
I’m a pathetic excuse for a theologian though, (forgot most of my Bible verses years ago), so other than occasional questions, I stay out of religious discussions, most of the “combatants” are better versed (pun not intended) than me.
I do still believe in the Bible basics, just without the organized money grubbers’ doctrines and dictates thrown in.
In fact I envy those who have the capacity to believe in something out of their line of sight, I seem incapable. When I was a kid I couldn’t be talked into Santa Claus or the tooth fairy either. I feel I am missing an aspect that could make life richer and in fact I have dabbled in many forms of religion and studied them at a university level. I just don’t get it.
Where I object to the belief of others is where it is imposed on my life. I cannot marry my girlfriend. We cannot live together in her country because the USA will not recognise our union. People feel it is ok to insult me and my life and call me names based on their religious belief. Even if I was able to find the aspect of myself that allowed for spirituality I would not be welcome in many places of worship. Christianity has been the root of many laws and social mores that directly impact on my life, sometimes that has been in dangerous ways.
I like to think I am a nice, kind, loving generous person who tries to never harm anyone else yet I am a sinner because I am a woman loving woman. People will turn their backs on being friends with me when they find out I am a lesbian. Some have assaulted me invoking the name of their God. Please don’t confuse my wariness towards those who say they are Christian with hate, it isn’t. It is fear.
And door to door god-botherers are as annoying as telemarketers.
P.S. I am not saying that I believe that true followers of Christ want me harmed. There are those who use the Bible to support their own bigotry and unfortunately they all say the same thing as those I consider to be true Christians. “I am a Christian”.
You’re an athiest and your girlfriend is a Christian, and the laws of the US won’t recognize your marriage? I’m confused. The US allows for civil marriages. What’s the problem?
<2> I dislike any person who loudly trumpets their beliefs as the “right” ones and mine, by default, as the “wrong” ones. I also have a problem with belief systems that exclude people based solely on their sexuality.
I’m Christian - Episcopalian. I also wear a silver cross around my neck and if someone asks, I will say that I’m Christian. However, I’ve converted from Paganism and I still hold a lot of that faith within my heart. Luckily, I belong to a denomination that’s fairly open-minded (in fact, my priest at my last church discussed her views on how evolution and the Book of Genesis are compatible, and how one doesn’t cancel out the other), so I finally feel like I’ve found a home. It was never a question of not believing for me, it was a question of where I should go to believe and what particular beliefs I felt comfortable with. I can’t deny what I feel in my heart - and that is that God exists. Someone else may not have that and that’s fine. I don’t try to convert anyone, but I will discuss religion in a calm way if the subject comes up. I have good friends who are atheists, some who believe but have been badly hurt by their churches, some who just don’t even think about religion, and it doesn’t affect me.
That doesn’t mean that Jehovah’s Witnesses don’t drive me batty, especially when they stand in front of my car as I’m pulling out of my driveway like they did last week.
I am the atheist spawn of a fundamentalist minister. My childhood was a horror. For the first 15 years of my life I was not exposed to anyone outside of a conservative religious environment. Then we moved to a medium-sized city, where I had a bit more freedom, but I was spied upon and my infractions were reported. My sins were such things as espousing any tolerant or liberal views, listening to rock & roll music, wanting to go to a school dance. I cannot think of a single adult from my childhood who was not a horrible person and a hypocrite.
I do not hate these people. I just want them to leave me alone. I am a much more moral and ethical person than 99% of the Christians I’ve met. It was only recently that I met religious people that I respect. There are some wonderful religious people, but my experience has been that most of them are dangerous, and that we would be living in a country with Taliban-level repression if they got their way.
Yes, he did, and if what you are about is finding flaws in your opponents’ statements, you found one. Congratulations. You want a medal?
On the other hand, if you’re interested in the gist of your opponents argument, you haven’t yet asserted the contrary to the notion that religion has caused a great deal of suffering. Who cares whether it’s more or less than some other particular source?
And, while Stalin and Mao caused a lot of death, there are other kinds of suffering in the world, so I’m not sure the appeal to a higher authority is germaine. Since Ego qualified the post you attacked with ‘imo’, I’d say you haven’t yet won the argument.
Are you claiming it’s possible to live by what the bible says (I assume you believe is god’s word), without interpretation?
I’m not well-versed (ouch!), but isn’t there loads of stuff in the bible that is frowned upon in these enlightened times? I mean like slavery, death penalty for working on the sabbath, etc.
If the bible is god’s word, and you don’t follow it in every particular, I think you must be deciding that god didn’t mean what the bible says. Or you don’t believe it’s god’s word.
As opposed to what? God telling you directly? And how do you know god didn’t speak to them too? In the end, when someone tells you god speaks to them, you have only their word on it. (And your first thought would probably be to get them psyciatric help)
He was speaking only of men, I’m sure. But out of curiousity, what was religions number? And what source did you use to arrive at your figure? Are you quite certain that it was less than 43 million? (note: what was the total world population at the time of the crusades? Was it as much as 43 million?)
A nit perhaps. But I believe contempt and hate are quite different. One normally doesn’t wish to harm those one feels are contemptable. I’d imagine far more athiests feel contempt for religious belief than hatred.
Anymore, I just call myself a theist and have done with it. I don’t really know if I believe in my own religion-Catholicism. I mean, I like some of the teachings, and some of them I don’t know. I don’t KNOW if I really believe Jesus was God or if the Bible was totally true. But I can’t NOT believe in God. I just can’t. It’s not in me. So, I figure, if someone is an atheist, it’s not because they refuse to believe in God, or just want to “have their cake and eat it too,”, but because, they cannot believe-it’s not in them to believe.
And yes, I’m so sick and tired of this whole fundy persecution complex. Get off the damn cross already-we need the wood to build a bonfire.
Do atheist keep there beliefs to themselves? I think not. It’s taught in schools and evolution is taught on TV (especially TLC and the Discovery channel.) Fair is fair.
Well, that’s slightly unfair. Between them, the Catholic Church and the Islamic invaders of North Africa and Spain managed to preserve a whole lot of the books of antiquity. We might not have Plato or Aristotle or the plays of old if not for organized religion. Left to it’s own devices, Europe would have been a field of disconnected warlords and minor kings. It still was that to a great degree, but the Church was a stabilizing force and kept everything nominally tied together. The Dark Ages needed secular thought to end them, but we never would have had the luxury of secular humanism if the Church hadn’t kept the ancient texts around for people to appreciate and develop a new world from.
You’re an athiest and your girlfriend is a Christian, and the laws of the US won’t recognize your marriage? I’m confused. The US allows for civil marriages. What’s the problem?
