WTF?
California home of prop 13?
Which was the people’s reaction to high taxes.
Before you blame Arnold too much, don’t forget he is trying to clean up the mess left by Gray Davis and the prior legislature. That bunch of Yahoos took the state from a 6 billion surplus to what a 33 Billion deficit. These guys made a bunch of drunk sailors on liberty look cheap.
Which that dumbfuck panders to on a regular basis…
Sam
The “fearless leaders” have been trying for years to find a way to do away with, or find a way around Prop 13. I was thinking of more recent things, like the “for the children” taxes, various “clean the environment” bonds/fees/taxes, more taxes for the police we aren’t going to get, bonds and taxes for street “repair”, etc. Don’t EVEN get me started on Gray Davis. I would have voted for Hannibal Lector or Eric Cartman before Davis. I voted for Arnold. I’m not anti-Arnold. Imagine that. A registered Democrat voting for a Republican. The problem is, too much of the prior legislature got re-elected. Voting Davis out and Arnold in is one thing. But, to really clean house, you have to go all the way or not at all. So, we got stuck with “business as usual”.
Oh, I understand you’re predicament. I’m just saying that at this point it just isn’t feasible. I admit I’m on the other end of the country practically, so I may have a lack of local perspective. But from the outisde, I’d have to say you’re blaming the wrong person here. It’s just too late to fix now.
What I’m saying is, it sounds as though your own local representatives have stopped presing for it. Arnold certainly isn’t going to push if they won’t.
Actually, not to me. I’m curious as to the specifics, if anyone has them (contractors pissing away millions usually don’t like talking.) Can you tell me exactly how they spent that much without putting up anything useful?
That’s definitely a mistake. But wouldn’t they have to sit there and get more bids? That might take more years of wrangling.
Like it or not, they’re powerful. Its easy to wish that some people didn’t pay any attention to powerful but corrupt and/or useless facitons, but its still impractical. Believe, I know of which I speak; the Tennessee Dept of Transportation is ridiculously well funded here, while other social services go hang. Likewise, for years they’ve been pouring money down the drain on Tenncare. It’s not wise, but it happens.
Ah. I see. Let me try putting it another way. There was an audit done specifically to find where the fuck the money went. I’m looking to see if those findings were published (I vaguely remember headlines), but I do recall that’s when it was decided we would go with the causeway plan.
I’m not trying to be a jerk here, so I’m sorry if I came across that way. I’m just saying it looks to me like the situation is hopelesly fouled. Is there anyway to build the pilings, put up a temporary structure and then redo the superstructure afterward?
Yeah, it is pretty screwed up. Someone is going to be unhappy no matter what. This particular bridge has to be built specifically with earthquake safety in mind, which I’m thinking is what the engineers are saying is taking so long. But really. Is it THAT difficult?
Why do you hate children? When I move here from New Jersey, my kid was almost a year ahead of her class in our reasonably good school district, thanks to Prop. 13. I almost wish I believed in hell for that scumbag Jarvis to rot in it. He destroyed the education of a whole generation of kids, and now they’re stupid enough to vote for Arnie. Arnie believes in the people, except when the people vote for money for schools he doesn’t want to give. (And all propositions suck - and he was busy backing ones that sucked out more tax money before he ran, remember.) But yeah, having people living next to each other in almost identical houses paying tax that is thousands of bucks different is real smart.
Yeah, when he was running he had a secret plan to do away with the deficit. Yeah, he cut the car license fees, and took the money from the cities so they have to lay off cops. Good move.
As for the bridge, he isn’t responsible for the mess, but I thought he wanted to do a cheaper version which would require a whole new planning cycle and cost more. It’s screwed up badly enough already, it’s time to build the thing. Though I am not so hot on this since I moved offices and no longer have to cross the Dumbarton every day.
Silentgoldfish, I dunno about you mate, but if I want to go to the golden beaches at Surfers Paradise, I usually end up having to park in a paid carpark. Street parks are very few and far between. So I pay $7 to the owners of the carpark instead of the government. Doesn’t make much difference to me!
And now, before you start telling me how the Sunshine Coast is superior to the Gold Coast - that might be so, but I just don’t like the beaches at the Sunshine Coast. YMMV, I’m sure.
Oh, and because this is a pit thread about Arnie… I’ll be back.
Max.
Oh yes indeedy. What we learnt was that we liked people who could tell us happy lies very convincingly.
[QUOTE=Maxxxie]
Silentgoldfish, I dunno about you mate, but if I want to go to the golden beaches at Surfers Paradise, I usually end up having to park in a paid carpark. Street parks are very few and far between. So I pay $7 to the owners of the carpark instead of the government. Doesn’t make much difference to me!
[QUOTE]
Stop your whingin’.
You have a couple of thousand kay of free beaches at your disposal (any one of which would put the best beach in California to shame), but you want to go to the very very very crowded one and so (sur-prise, sur-prise) parking is at a premium so you gotta pay.
Cry me a river.
It’s a bit different to a statewide fee on going to the beach.
I don’t hate children. Why do people keep saying everything is anti-children? Where the hell did the “for to children” money go? It sure didn’t improve the schools, did it? What about the cigarette tax? Where’s the money? Apparently not to the schools. What about the lottery money that didn’t improve the schools? What about all the bond issues? Prop 13 was a reaction to ever higher and higher property taxes. People were pissed. They kept having to pay more and more, but what did anyone get in return? There’s no money for street lights, road repair, better schools, more cops, etc. But there is always money to support some leech’s pet projects (LAX anyone?) Unneeded and unwanted “beautification” of downtown? Subways that only service downtown? Sports arenas? It goes to feed egoes or simply vanishes, it never goes where it should.
This is the pit. So, to anyone who keeps using the Soccer Mom argument of “holy crap what about the kids you’re a kid hater blah blah blah blah”, my response is stfu.
Ahhh you Aussies!
We are very envious! (west coasters)
There are a few No-pay Beaches here in So.California, however, with restricted 1-hour parking.
I get tired of hearing, “well look at all the amenities the State provides”. Let’s see, a few snack shack/board rental places. Showers, Lifeguards and the Police!
Back in the '50’s, 60’s & 70’s, these beaches were optional, usually the city beaches. The long streches of coastline were pristene and exciting! We brought our own boards and food, some surfers bring a 5-gallon container of water to shower with. Lifegaurds are Kings! and part of the beach, any beach!
My gripe is with the ever-inflating access/parking fees dictated by the State.
How long before the State charges you to Web Surf?
ExACTly. If the money went where it was supposed to go (which it never does), I wouldn’t bitch so loud. And then, on the occasions when the state actually manages to throw a few schools a bone or two, it makes front page news about how the state is helping schools. As if we should all thank them for doing what they were supposed to do in the first damn place! GAH!
The chosing of a design has been done. The planning has been done. The seismic engineering has been done. The environmental impact reporting has been done. The construction has started.
Changing to Arnold’s slab will require throwing out everything that’s been done, plus costs for removing the already-built pilings and foundations that will be in the wrong places for a different design. Oh, and there will be new EIRs needed for the demolition work, plus for the new design.
Oh, and don’t forget that during all this dilly-dally, the safety retrofit of the old eastern span continues as it has to be done, regardless of what’s being built to replace it.
Yup, and now it turns out the slab will probably cost as much as continuing on with the original plan.