I need some help! I recently started working at an outlet mall close to the Canadian border and Vancouver BC. We get a huge amount of Asian traffic in our store and I am afraid I’m going to offend someone by misidentifying their ethnicity. I can pick out some facial characteristics (Koreans tend to have broader faces, Chinese eyes tend to tip up), but not always and I am never certain.
Also, I worry about what cultural gaffs I may commit! :eek:
Any advice?
I found some good advice on this board via Google, that’s how I landed here and why this is my first post. I’ve read Straight Dope for years, didn’t know it had a forum!
Obligatory link with test. It is not incorrect to note differences, but rules are not definites.
The best way to avoid gaffes is to not misidentify. I don’t know many situations where this would be beneficial. Do you just want conversation starters? “You look Chinese. How 'bout them shark fins? Lots of capitalist pigs around here, am I right?”
Learn to recognize provenance names and languages, it’s not hard. And I don’t know about up there, but in many places Chinese is the most likely just by population.
This really is not a debate.
I am sending this to General Questions.
I am a bit curious. I work in retail and I really cannot tell someone ethnically Polish from someone Russian, Ukrainian, or German, but it does not seem to be an issue. What sort of gaffes or problems do you envision?
Why would you need to identify their ethnicity in the first place?
Hello and welcome Lois.
I think you worry too much. Asians, or anyone else for that matter, don’t really expect anyone to tell by looking, what their country of origin is. If you are in a conversation, there can be a problem as asking a second or third generation immigrant, “Where are you from?” may not elicit the answer you want. On the other hand they will probably be quite used to it and not readily offended.
England is a country with a large number of immigrants from countries all over the world. It may be a surprise to you, that I find it hard to tell a Canadian from an American, but that usually caused amusement rather than annoyance. I also cannot spot the difference between an Indian and a Pakistani, an Albanian and a Serb or a Pole from a Ukrainian. I have met all these nationalities locally and they have never assumed that I can.
Exactly. “Hey, you . . . the Korean guy” can/should be more along the lines of, “Hey, you . . . dude in the black beret”.
If you treat all customers politely, their ethnicity should never come up. If you’re morbidly curious about it ask, “Is this your first trip to Vancouver?” so they’ll volunteer the information.
Even Asians can’t reliably tell each other apart (I should know; I am one). For the most part it shouldn’t matter. Just speak to them in English as you would anyone else. If you must know, or just want to make conversation, just ask them. It’s more annoying to be mis-identified and expected to speak some other language, especially when the intent for the conversation is unclear.
IMHO: “Konichiwa!” would elicit a “Uh, sorry, I’m from California” from me, after which I’d probably leave the store before they tried to sell me chopsticks or tell me about that time they went to some Japanese city I’d never heard of. Our ethnicity is about as interesting to us as yours is to you, and hardly a scintillating conversation topic to break the ice with a shopkeep with – especially near a place like Vancouver (40+% Asian, 30% Chinese). The response you’d likely generate is probably “Ugh, I don’t want to explain this again” rather than the “Oh look, what a friendly shopkeeper!” you were hoping for. Just don’t ask if you can help it, and find another “in” to start a conversation with. If you must know, assume you can’t guess, because you very often can’t.
Even Americans and Canadians have trouble telling each other apart. I crossed the border and was mistaken for a local. Occasionally, I can pick out a Canadian down here if I hear a “sorey aboot that, eh” accent, but even that’s not a strict border thing. Some Americans close to the border sound like that, and some Canadians (e.g. Newfoundlanders) don’t usually sound like that at all.
Nor can white people reliably tell each other apart. You can typically identify someone as “probably Celtic” or “probably southern European”, but beyond that it’s tough. Is that guy Greek or Sicilian? Is she Irish or Scottish?
I’m reminded of Margaret Cho’s reaction to someone telling her she could never tell Asian people apart:
(suspicious side-eye)And why do you need to tell us apart?(/suspicious side-eye)
Hi Loisalene, and welcome to the boards. I’ve done (more than) my fair share of retail work and customer service in general, and I can think of no reason at all that you would need to know someone’s country of origin, or be required to identify it based on their facial appearance.
Treat all customers and potential customers the same, regardless of skin color/eye shape/clothing, and you’ll be fine.
Speaking as a white guy… I can’t tell different Asian nationalities apart just by looking. If you know people’s names, it becomes much easier.
If the name is Kim or Park (or Pak) or Rhee, you can usually guess they’re Korean.
If the name is Nguyen or Tran, safe bet they’re Vietnamese.
A multi-syllable name (Tanaka, Suzuki, et al) is typically Japanese.
There are only a few COMMON Chinese family names, though those names can have many variations in English. Chang (or Chan or Chen or Cheng or Chiang), Wong (or Wang or Huang or Hwang), or Liu (or Louie), or Chow/Chou is usually CHinese.
A Spanish-sounding name likely indicates a Filippino.
But there are nmes like “Cho” or “Lee” that cut across different nationalities.
You could always ask politely if it really is in fact necessary.
My wife is Chinese, and when the need arises, she will first ask “Are you Chinese?” and if the answer is yes, then “Guangdonghua?” (Cantonese?), though in Hong-Couver this last might almost be a given.
Never met a Rhee and can’t name one besides Syngman. It’s usually Romanized as “Lee” which can denote a number of ethnicities as you note. Cho is usuallty Korean as other Chinese transliterations are more common (e.g. Zhou). Cantonese tends to be the more common Chinese language/origin in the US and Canada in decades past but I believe not so recently.
Korean, Vietnamese, and sometimes Chinese can be contrasted with Japanese by the much lesser diversity of names in the former. The most common surnames: Satō is most common in Japan but still it’s easier to find someone with a different name. I believe it’s about 1.5% of the population. Whereas 46% of Koreans are Parks and almost all have one of 5 surnames (or variations). 38% of Vietnamese are Nguyen and the top 5 are 71%. Koreans are also more likely to be Christian.
Too late to edit. I do mean that a given Christian, especially Protestant, is more likely to be Korean than the other common ethnicities. Filipinos are largely Catholic, and Christianity is a large religion in South Korea but not a majority (~29% or larger than Buddhism but less than “no religion”).
Since the OP is looking for advice, let’s move this to IMHO.
Colibri
General Questions Moderator
Sometimes it’s really hard to tell the forums apart.
They are notoriously inscrutable.
In case he gets robbed, he needs to know what to tell the police. 
I sort of know what he means though. A phrase or gesture could be offensive to one ethnicity but not another. For example, you know that palm-up beckoning gesture you give people to get them to go over to you? That’s offensive to Thais, because that’s how you call a dog to you. Palm down is the only acceptable way.
But good luck identifying these ethnicities! My wife is Thai but ethnic Chinese. She has at times – even by her fellow Thais – been mistaken for Japanese, Filipina, Hawaiian and, no kidding, even Navajo.
And Kim! Lots of Kims in not only Korea but also Vietnam and Cambodia.