Ask the person who calls people--telephone surveys

[Captain_Amazing]

@Seanette

So explain Flyer’s smug boasts about how he? will keep calling the same victim until said victim finally gives in. That’s hard sell in spirit, even if money isn’t involved.

I can’t. That’s not something we did, and it’s not generally, as far as I know, that’s not something reputable survey companies do. If you say “I’m busy” or “I can’t talk now”, they’ll call you back, but if you say, “Please don’t call me anymore”, or “Take me off your list”, or “I’m not interested”, they should take you off their list and stop calling. If they don’t, try to get ahold of their supervisor or somebody else in charge there and complain.

@Seanette

Wrong. The answer is OPT-IN. Otherwise, you’re as much of a nuisance as any other tele-spammer. In fact, worse, because you’ve weaseled an exception to the DNC list, which gives the person paying for the phone a little say in how it’s used.

Tell you what, I’ll decide for you what is a worthwhile use of your time and phone, then I will call you during your sleep hours, and I will use the Flyer approach of calling over and over any target who refuses to donate his/her time but can’t divine the exact words of the magic incantation that will get Flyer to go away.

Sound fair and reasonable? No? Then why do you think it’s OK for Flyer and its ilk to do this to the rest of us?

I don’t know that “opt in” is a good idea, and will, generally, make polls less effective. Polls work by trying to find a random sample of the population. Opt in polls skew the sample, and increase the margin of error of the poll. That’s why if you go to someplace like CNN and fill out an online poll, really the results aren’t worth much. It’s because only the people who were interested in taking the poll took it.

Here’s AAPOR (The American Association for Public Opinion Research)'s comment about the uselessness of opt in polling.

http://www.aapor.org/opt_in_surveys_and_margin_of_error1.htm

As for calling during sleep hours, generally, polltakers call on weeknights between 5-9, and on weekends between 10-2, if I’m remembering correctly. Obviously, for shift workers and some other people, this will be during sleep or work hours. This is unfortunate, certainly, and if a pollster is disturbing your sleep, then I’m sure he’s not doing it intentionally. The fact is, though, those hours, for most people, are not sleep hours. For the vast majority of the population, that’s when they’re at home and not asleep. If they make the calls at 2 in the morning, that might be the most convenient time for you, but it’ll disturb even more people trying to sleep. That’s one of the unfortunate things about working unusual hours; that your schedule is out of synch with most people, and that affects your life in a whole variety of ways, as I’m sure you know. Being woken up by calls that are, for most people, at a reasonable hour, is only one of them.

As far as not wanting to take the time or interest in taking the poll, that’s certainly your choice, and no one can force you to take it. And, like I said before, if you say you don’t want to take the poll, most reputable polling companies will remove you from that poll list.

[Khadaji]

Captain Amazing, I think things have changed since you were in the business. I believe your company would respect the request to be taken off the list, but this year I had two companies continue to call even after I politely requested that they quit. After much searching, I found that the first one had an opt-out on their site. The second one I couldn’t find any way to make them quit calling me - and of course, we have the narrative of the OP.

After the second one started hounding me I got a screening device.

As an aside - while it may be coincidental - I started getting those calls immediately after going to Jiffy Lube. Both times I started getting calls right after having my oil changed.

[Captain_Amazing]

We weren’t a company. We were a college. We did political polling. . .a quarterly state of the economy poll ("Do you feel you are better off, worse off, or not any different economically from one year ago, etc), and election polling.

I do think that people should be taken off lists if they request it, though, and I’m surprised that there are places not doing it.

[dropzone]

@Khadaji

…but this year I had two companies continue to call even after I politely requested that they quit.

My company says it will take you off its call list in no more than 30 days because it can take a while working it all through the system and this buys them some time if the call list is in the hands of a sub, for instance. However, legally they have up to 90 days to stop calling.

As an aside - while it may be coincidental - I started getting those calls immediately after going to Jiffy Lube. Both times I started getting calls right after having my oil changed.

Were the calls from Jiffy Lube? Because, as I explained in another thread, that established a business relationship between them and you and they can keep calling you for several years after your last purchase.

The federal DNC law is not a panacea, but it really has reduced telemarketing calls.

[Steve_MB]

@Gorsnak

Lynn’s scenario was an analogy to a shift worker trying to sleep during afternoon/evening hours. Are you really so daft as to not understand that?

Probably, for one simple reason:

[QUOTE=Upton Sinclair]
It is difficult to get a man to understand something when his job depends on not understanding it.
[/QUOTE]

[Steve_MB]

@Captain_Amazing

The way I see it, we’ve got an election going on, and if you go over to the election forum on SDMB, you’ve got all sorts of people talking about “Oh, Obama’s ahead in Ohio, but Romney’s ahead in Florida, and Gallup says that Romney’s up by 5 points, but can you trust their methodology”, and all that, and you’ve got websites like realclearpolitics and fivethirtyeight and the like all asking “Who’s going to win the election”.

Yes, and if they change the rules so that only people who still answer landline phones at the end of October in an election year are allowed to vote, the former may end up having some logical correlation to the latter.

[Clothahump]

@Flyer

A lot of folks have a lot of misconceptions about telephone surveys in general. The biggest is the Do Not Call list. There’s an awful lot of people who have no idea of what the DNC list actually does. They think it applies to all unwanted calls, when in reality, it applies to only a relatively small subset of unwanted calls. I’ve had people threaten to report us (I always wonder just who they would report us to–the FBI? their state Attorney General?) even though legitimate surveys are explicitly exempted from the DNC list.

Why the hell do we even bother to have a DNC list, then? I don’t pay unghodly amounts of money to the phone company each month just to have some twit call me in the middle of whatever I’m doing to ask me a bunch of retarded questions.

Is there any way possible to have a number listed so that it NEVER gets a survey call of any kind?

[Seanette]

@Clothahump

Why the hell do we even bother to have a DNC list, then? I don’t pay unghodly amounts of money to the phone company each month just to have some twit call me in the middle of whatever I’m doing to ask me a bunch of retarded questions.

Is there any way possible to have a number listed so that it NEVER gets a survey call of any kind?

QFT. How did survey-takers manage to weasel an exception to DNC, anyway?

[Musicat]

@Clothahump

Is there any way possible to have a number listed so that it NEVER gets a survey call of any kind?

Not that I know of. But having an unlisted number really, really helps. It makes the number disappear from all but robo-dialers, where they call every number from 0000-9999.

I’ve had an unlisted main number for 30 years; junk calls on it are few and far between and if I don’t recognize the caller, it’s 99% sure it is unwanted. I can contrast those with a commercial number I have, and even though that is in the DNC list, it gets many more unwanted calls.

@Seanette

QFT. How did survey-takers manage to weasel an exception to DNC, anyway?

Political influence. Why do you think charities and political calls are also exempt?

[Seanette]

@Musicat

(of exemptions to DNC)
Political influence. Why do you think charities and political calls are also exempt?

That also annoys me, particularly political. When I say Do Not Call, I mean it! There is a reason for putting an unpublished number on the DNC list.

[Dave_Hartwick]

@Seanette

That also annoys me, particularly political. When I say Do Not Call, I mean it! There is a reason for putting an unpublished number on the DNC list.

Is it severe social anxiety?

[Senegoid]

Just noticed an article on Yahoo today:

Jobs That Make the World a Worse Place

And telemarketers didn’t take the top spot!

Explanation: They surveyed workers in various jobs (that they figured would be considered as making the world a better-or-worse place). The question apparently was “Does your job make the world a better place or worse place?” and got the workers own perceptions of their own jobs.

Excerpts:
Fast food worker: Workers who say their job makes the world a worse place: 38.4%
Gaming dealer: Workers who say their job makes the world a worse place: 17.6%
Telemarketer: Workers who say their job makes the world a worse place: 9.4%
Other runners-up: TV newscast director, bartender, loan collector, fashion designer.

Note, this says nothing about how the customers, clients, marks, or the world in general views these professions. Only how the workers in those jobs view their jobs. The low worse-world rating that telemarketers give themselves only tells me how conscience-free those workers are. The job may attract anybody who’s desperate enough to have a job these days, but probably does best at retaining only those who are really conscience-challenged scum (or really really desperate for a job).

I’m willing to allow that survey workers (will, some survey workers) aren’t quite as low on the bottom-feeding hierarchy as telemarketers, but they’re still just as disruptive and intrusive when they come a-calling. The ones that won’t take no, or are persistent and hard to get rid of, or hide or falsify their caller ID, or do push-polls, of course, are down there with the telemarketers or even lower.

[Senegoid]

@Dave_Hartwick

Is it severe social anxiety?

Who here is ready to start a new Pit thread just on Dave Hartwick?

[Muffin]

@Senegoid

Who here is ready to start a new Pit thread just on Dave Hartwick?

Waste of time – he’s a telemarketer.

[Musicat]

@Muffin

Waste of time – he’s a telemarketer.

How about we take a poll about it?

[kambuckta]

@Musicat

Not that I know of. But having an unlisted number really, really helps. It makes the number disappear from all but robo-dialers, where they call every number from 0000-9999.

No it doesn’t.

As I mentioned previously, (at least in Australia) our numbers come from a variety of lists that are compiled by Brokers to include the demographic cross-section of the people we believe will support X charity. The numbers are garnered from a variety of sources as I noted in that post, but never from the telephone directory: ergo, we regularly come across unlisted numbers (called ‘silent numbers’ here) and I spend many hours a week patiently explaining to people why we have their number listed. They are almost invariably placated by my explanation, then get shitty when they realize they are PAYING for an unlisted service for nought. Meh, they can take that up with their telephone provider.

But before you all go ballistic again, rest assured the companies I work for, ALL of my coworkers and myself are more than happy to add your name to our DNC lists. It doesn’t faze us, we’re mostly quite normal and decent people, and if you ask us nicely, we’ll click the button and you’ll be gone from that list FOREVER. Mind you, you are likely to be on many lists, so it’s a procedure you might have to do on a number of occasions, but the vast majority of the calls will stop.

I cannot in all honesty deny though that we do get some complete shitstains, through our doors…rarely, and they are gone very quickly but it seems like the people in this thread have had the misfortune to encounter them. If you feel that you are not being taken seriously in your request, DEMAND to speak to a supervisor. If that is refused, grab as many details as you can and contact your local Telecommunications Ombudsman (or whoever it might be in your neck of the woods) and make a formal complaint. The quicker we get the shonkies out of the industry, the better our ‘Like’ status might be…maybe

Funnily enough, I can’t remember the last time someone spewed vitriol at me IRL like I’ve heard in these threads. Sure, people get a little testy sometimes, but I humbly apologise for taking their time, wish them well, they likewise wish me a good day (and more often than not apologise for being snarky) and we both leave the call feeling OK.

S’all good. I’ve been doing this stuff for over 20 yrs now, worked at a variety of places, worked with some really interesting people (and as noted the odd complete fuckhead), but representing these charities with respect and politeness is foremost in my mind at all times.

It’s my job, and I take it very seriously. Without ‘community’ fundraising, a lot of these charities wouldn’t exist at all, and the losers would be the kids needing some peer-support for their journey through cancer treatment, the hospitals desperately needing new equipment for the Radiology Department, or the Emergency Rescue Service wanting to upgrade their training and/or life-saving equipment too. Over my years, I (at last count) have personally raised over $1million for these people. But you lot reckon I still should have this on my conscience??

Yep, I lie straight in bed at night: how about you?

[Spoons]

@kambuckta

As I mentioned previously, (at least in Australia) our numbers come from a variety of lists that are compiled by Brokers to include the demographic cross-section of the people we believe will support X charity. The numbers are garnered from a variety of sources as I noted in that post, but never from the telephone directory: ergo, we regularly come across unlisted numbers (called ‘silent numbers’ here) and I spend many hours a week patiently explaining to people why we have their number listed. They are almost invariably placated by my explanation, then get shitty when they realize they are PAYING for an unlisted service for nought. Meh, they can take that up with their telephone provider.

Okay, fair enough. Now, how do I get them to take my business and personal phone numbers off their lists permanently, for all time, period?

Ah, you say, you and I have a business relationship. No, I disagree. I am always getting phone calls from American Express (AE); which apparently has some sort of arrangement with Air Canada (AC), who has some sort of arrangement with the Canadian Imperial Bank of Commerce (CIBC), to continually solicit me for AE cards offered through CIBC based on my AC frequent-flyer membership. I’ve flown Air Canada many times, which apparently gives AC, AE, and CIBC leave to continually bug me about cards, flights, and other “privileges.” I do not do any business with the CIBC (nor will I, based on their use of telemarketers); my business and personal banking is with other banks. Such “business relationship” is, in my view, rather tenuous. I have asked to be removed from their call list in a polite fashion. On the next call, I have followed by saying, “take me off your @#% call list"; and on the third call, I have eventually said, "Don't ever @#% call me again.” I still get calls. Apparently, I’m not using the right magic words. Seriously, how hard can it be to interpret “Take me off your @#$% call list” to “Gee, let’s not call this guy again”?

Telemarketers and telephone surveyors are scum. (How hard can it be to understand “No, I do not wish to hear from you again. No. No. No”?)

And if telemarketers, surveyors, etc. seem to feel that simply because I have a phone, it implies that I want to be called, it is not true. I recall the words of our friend Cervaise, who said in response to a telemarketer (paraphrased), “I have a butthole too, but that doesn’t mean I want a running jigsaw inserted into it.”

Telemarketers, don’t call me. Surveryors, don’t call me. If you do, don’t be surprised if you’re met with a torrent of profanity, calling into account the provenance of your father, the promiscuity of your mother, and the sexual diseases of your sister.

'Nuff said for now.

[kambuckta]

@Spoons

Okay, fair enough. Now, how do I get them to take my business and personal phone numbers off their lists permanently, for all time, period?

Ah, you say, you and I have a business relationship. No, I disagree. I am always getting phone calls from American Express (AE); which apparently has some sort of arrangement with Air Canada (AC), who has some sort of arrangement with the Canadian Imperial Bank of Commerce (CIBC), to continually solicit me for AE cards offered through CIBC based on my AC frequent-flyer membership. I’ve flown Air Canada many times, which apparently gives AC, AE, and CIBC leave to continually bug me about cards, flights, and other “privileges.” I do not do any business with the CIBC (nor will I, based on their use of telemarketers); my business and personal banking is with other banks. Such “business relationship” is, in my view, rather tenuous. I have asked to be removed from their call list in a polite fashion. On the next call, I have followed by saying, “take me off your @#% call list"; and on the third call, I have eventually said, "Don't ever @#% call me again.” I still get calls. Apparently, I’m not using the right magic words. Seriously, how hard can it be to interpret “Take me off your @#$% call list” to “Gee, let’s not call this guy again”?

Telemarketers and telephone surveyors are scum. (How hard can it be to understand “No, I do not wish to hear from you again. No. No. No”?)

And if telemarketers, surveyors, etc. seem to feel that simply because I have a phone, it implies that I want to be called, it is not true. I recall the words of our friend Cervaise, who said in response to a telemarketer (paraphrased), “I have a butthole too, but that doesn’t mean I want a running jigsaw inserted into it.”

Telemarketers, don’t call me. Surveryors, don’t call me. If you do, don’t be surprised if you’re met with a torrent of profanity, calling into account the provenance of your father, the promiscuity of your mother, and the sexual diseases of your sister.

'Nuff said for now.

Well, you obviously fail Reading for Comprehension Grade 1 don’tcha Spoons?

:rolleyes:

[Muffin]

A typical telemarker response.

[Muffin]

@Spoons

Ah, you say, you and I have a business relationship. No, I disagree. I am always getting phone calls from American Express (AE); which apparently has some sort of arrangement with Air Canada (AC), who has some sort of arrangement with the Canadian Imperial Bank of Commerce (CIBC), to continually solicit me for AE cards offered through CIBC based on my AC frequent-flyer membership. I’ve flown Air Canada many times, which apparently gives AC, AE, and CIBC leave to continually bug me about cards, flights, and other “privileges.” I do not do any business with the CIBC (nor will I, based on their use of telemarketers); my business and personal banking is with other banks. Such “business relationship” is, in my view, rather tenuous. I have asked to be removed from their call list in a polite fashion. On the next call, I have followed by saying, “take me off your @#% call list"; and on the third call, I have eventually said, "Don't ever @#% call me again.” I still get calls. Apparently, I’m not using the right magic words. Seriously, how hard can it be to interpret “Take me off your @#$% call list” to “Gee, let’s not call this guy again”?

You’re forgetting that making a request to be taken off the harassment list constitutes a business relationship that then keeps you on the harassment list.

Fuckers.