Actually, that makes sense-when our dog doesn’t go for her daily walk, we notice she tends to act all hyper and gets into trouble. The walk keeps her from getting bored and tires her out.
I don’t have any questions for you, Elenfair but I did want to thank you for training service dogs. I knew a woman whose daughter was blind and she had a Leader Dog. Because of the dog, she was able to get to and from a job on her own, go places and do things independently, and live the life she wanted. Service dogs can change people’s lives for the better.
You’re good people.
Elenfair - Why do you rarely see dobermans as service dogs? Wonderfully trainable, very people-oriented (especially their person), a good size. And for someone who is blind or has issues holding brushes, etc., very little coat care.
I presently have a dobe, a standard poodle and an alaskan malamute, all rescues. My poodle is probably the sweetest dog I’ve ever had. I had a GSD who was sweet and loving, but terribly goal-oriented. The dog learned that if he was persistant and worked hard he could unlock the windows, open them up and get out of the house. He never went off the block, but if I wasn’t home, he wanted to find someone who was. I tried him on tranqualizers, but they made his personality go away, so I just learned to live with the damage to the mini-blinds. Mike died of age-related complications last year. It’s amazing how much you can love a dog that causes so many problems. I’ve had dobermans for the last 20 years or so. Each dog has been loving, smart and gentle. Ideal dogs, IMHO.
StG
What happens to puppies who start out training to be service dogs but don’t cut it? There’s a test they have to take, right? do they get a second chance if they fail the first test?
do they have times when they’re “on duty” and times when they’re “off?” like if I had a friend with a service dog, I wouldn’t play with the dog in the grocery store, but, in general (obviously, it’s up to the owner and it depends on the dog) could I play tug-of-war with the dog once we got home? could my friend?
One from my mom: is it possible to train a five-year-old dog? (I say it is, but I’m just a kid. You’re the expert.)
what kinds of things does the owner do to continue training? For example, do dogs learn to perform tasks related to the owner’s job? If so, does the owner teach them these things, or does the dog just pick it up with the operant conditioning?
How much does a service dog cost? Does insurance cover it? Do you get paid to train them (or reimbursed in any way for the expense of keeping them?)
Do you ever get to see the puppy again once it’s been placed with an owner? Do you have contact with the owners?
Do they go through normal puppy stages when they’re with you? pooping in the house, chewing up your furniture, getting into the trash, etc? Or is it less than most puppies?
I think what you’re doing is really cool and it’s something I’ve always thought I’d do once I’m old enough. But, like others, I’d hate the goodbyes and I don’t know how well I’d handle always having a puppy in my house.
I hear that in Australia, they were crossing Labrador Retrievers and Poodles to get a hypoallergenic guide dog, what do you think of this?
Also any rare breeds that were used successfully in the Guide dog program?
Do you get potential guide dog puppies from a special breeder? Or is it from dogs of working/show lines?
And I wish I could own a Nova Scotia Duck Tolling Retriever or an Australian Shepherd.
This is one of the hardest parts of training, in my understanding. Guides must obey their partners - except when it will lead into danger.
What do you use as a postive reward? We’ve raised four dogs for Guide Dogs for the Blind in San Rafael, California. They do not use treats, but only words and pats. It’s worked fine so far. We’ve raised two goldens and two labs.
The golden we just sent back is on breeder watch!
Guide Dogs of America (based in California) occasionally uses poodles, for hypoallergenic reasons. I’ve never actually seen a guide poodle at work, though.
Oops, I meant what Voyager said: “Guide Dogs for the Blind.” Sorry.
I’m raising a puppy for them right now. He’s 9 weeks old and doing great so far.
I can answer one of SurrenderDorothy’s questions:
There is a “final exam” for dogs in guide dog college, but they can be dropped from the program before that if they are determined to be unsuitable for guide work due to medical or temperamental issues. Dogs that are dropped from the program can be placed with families as pets or, depending on the reason they were dropped, trained for other work.
I’d like to clarify one of my questions…
how much does a service dog cost for the owner, and does insurance cover it?
And I read your other thread, so the “do you get paid” has been answered (and I don’t mean to be rude in asking that… just wondered if it was something I’d ever be able to afford to do. I woke up the morning after I wrote that and thought, “did I seriously ask someone how much they get paid? what was I thinking?”)
My husband works in a prison. They have a program where puppies are resuced from the pound, and given to the inmates to get basic obedience training. The bright ones go on to a service dog training academy. The ones that don’t make the cut, or don’t complete the academy training are adopted out to the public.
It’s a wonderful program which has had awesome results.
Our dog, who has quite recently gone to his reward, was originally training to be a Guide Dog but failed* because he liked to poop when out on the street. He came to us as a Pets as Therapy dog (my husband is disabled).
- we prefer to think he didn’t fail at all but wanted to live a life of rest and relaxation instead of having to work for his keep. :dubious:
Hi Guys - sorry to have let this thread disappear. lno’s grandmother passed this weekend, and we were gone from Friday until today.
I’m going to chip away at answers right now!
E.
Most trainers kind of fall into the job by accident. Most started out with their own dogs, learned to train it, were asked by their own trainer to help teach classes… and voila! As far as the earnings go, it’s mostly a labor of love, let me tell you. That said, people who teach dog obedience classes can make a very decent living.
Bildo - that was such an awesome moment!!
kaiwik - send her here:
http://www.woodhavenlabs.com/breeding/breeder2.html
http://www.woodhavenlabs.com/breeding/breeder3.html
… if she has any sense at all, she’ll change her mind.
Guinastasia - the australian shepherd is a herding dog. Look up the breed club, lots of information on their site. Retired dogs DO make awesome pets. There is usually a waiting list for people wanting to adopt retired workers or dogs who are washed out of the training program.
GKW - You can certainly teach your dog a new response to people arriving. Some people use the kneeing technique (works well), or totally reshape the behavior. I know someone who has trained her dogs to make a MAD dash for their crates when the doorbell rings! They do so because they KNOW if they do, they will get a HUGE raw meaty bone and that’s WAY better than getting ot say hi. 
You could also do a sit/stay, open the door… drill drill drill, get volunteers… Make YOU the focus point… if you’re more interesting to your dog than the people who arrive, then you’re all set. You may want to turn yourself into a hotdog/liver dispenser a while Regarding the CGC, it will not result in insurance changes or breed ban exemptions, unfortunately. That said, I recommend you do it! It’s a lot of fun, and nice to know you have a dog who can be a good Canine Citizen.
Stinkum - Thank you!
StGermain - I love dobes. They have been used by some people as service dogs. They tend to do very well. No school has used them, however. Part of it is an image issue. Other reason is also related to “breed bans”. Also, there has been concern about a type of dementia that affects some dobes as they get older.
SurrenderDorothy -
a)Dogs in training are constantly evaluated, and re-evaluated. It’s kind of an ongoing process. They have to be safe, solid, and almost flawless in their obedience skills before certification. We do allow puppies some mistakes, obviously, but some get cut from programs for all sorts of reasons, most common of which are noise sensitivity and over-friendliness with strangers.
b)All service dogs have off duty times. Their handler releases them and they are more than welcome to play with anyone who wants to play with them! Usually, it’s at home, and the vest, harness, or whatever they wear is removed. My dog knows the difference between work and play. He is a different dog on duty and off. All handlers play with their dogs - games of fetch, walks, and holidays, too. Dogs do need a break, sometimes. A lot of folks also have helpers/friends who may come in and take the dog out to the park, or to run and play, or for a run.
c) Yes. But what’s the point? It would take 2 years (or so) for the dog to be fully trained. By then, it would already be a senior, and might have 2-3 years of service left before retirement… Too much time and energy for little results.
d) Dogs are always learning, brushing up their skills, and bonding with their handler. During the teaching of the team phase (when people are partnered up with their dogs) we teach them what to do, how to train, and how to keep the training up to snuff. It’s very important to reinforce the basics, on at least a weekly basis. My dog and I, for exaple, do a training session every day. He finds it a LOT of fun.
e) Most schools will place a dog with a disabled person for free. It costs them on average between 20 and 35 thousand dollars to train a dog. Yep, that’s awfully expensive. Some schools will charge a small fee for equipment. Insurance does not cover costs. Once you are teamed up, yes, you are responsible for the care of the dog. That said, many vets offer discounts for working animals. Some vet colleges also offer services for free. Some pet food makers may also donate or support individual dog teams with grub each year.
f & g) Yes, sometime we do see dogs we’ve placed. It’s always nice to hear updates and get pictures, too! As for puppies, well, they’re puppies. They chew, they have accidents… but all in all, because of the amount of time we spend training, they seem to learn faster. Some of that is bred into them, but most of it is environment - it’s the amount of time spent on training and learning each and every day. they usually get way more of that than family pets.
… continued in the next post!
BluePitbull - Yep. And the breed has picked up in popularity here, too. The problem with the Labradoodle is that there is NO WAY to guarantee type, especially the type of coat the puppy will inherit. It could have a poodle coat. It could have a Lab coat. It could have something in the middle. The philosophy of many programs is, at that point, why not just go with the standard poodle, if you want something almost hypoallergenic? Truth is, no breed of dog is 100% hypoallergenic at all. Now - I think labradoodles can be awful cute
As for rare breed guide dogs - MIRA in Quebec trains Bernese Mountain Dogs as seeing eye dogs, and Labernese (Labrador/BMD crosses). That’s about the rarest you will find. I have seen plenty of odd breeds doing service work. A lot of it depends on the trainer and the dog.
We do sometimes get puppies directly from breeders. We have pups from strong show lines and working lines - mostly these dogs have outstanding structure and conformation, making them really healthy workers! I love tollers and aussies 
They make wonderful companions and working dogs. They do get bored easily though so it’s good to give them a job of some kind.
Voyager - I use treats with puppes, and pure praise (pats, praise) with grown dogs after the age of one. Seems to work well, all in all. Good on ya for working with that first stage of training… you guys do really hard work, and all of us (and especially the end users!) appreciate it SO MUCH. Congrats on the latest puppy!