Hi Everybody!
Rippingtons_fan here!!
Considering the conditions on the planet Venus, has there ever been any serious discussions about what kind of spacecraft would be needed to survive the conditions on the planet, and what kind of spacesuit would be needed for astronauts to explore outside the spacecraft?
rippingtons_fan
Not in MPSIMS. I’d heard there was some over at NASA, but here we really just speculate on whether Venusians like cheese in a can.
We’ve landed some spacecraft on Venus. If I remember correctly, the longest-lived one lasted a bit under four hours. Forget putting a human on the surface. The environemt is just far too hostile.
What Q.E.D. said. In fact, I seem to remember read somewhere that it’s more likely that we’ll put a person on Mercury before we can get someone on Venus. Don’t remember where I read that, though.
Surface temp: ~800 degrees Fahrenheit. Very corrosive atmosphere.
Yeah, um, no.
Indeed we have - and here’s a postcard from the surface. According to that site: “Venus’ clouds are composed of sulfuric acid droplets while its surface temperature is about 900 degrees Fahrenheit (482 degrees C) at an atmospheric pressure of 92 times that of sea-level on Earth.”
You can understand why the queue of volunteers for the first trip is rather short. 
Grim
Hi Everybody!
I just can’t envision science just shying-away from the challenge of a manned mission to Venus. Perhaps the scientific community will seek practical answers as to how this CAN actually be accomplished, in contrast to those people who can see only obstacles and reasons as to why we can’t do it.
Why not go further and plan a manned mission to the centre of the sun? Wassamatter? Chickenorsummat?
Well, I suppose we could find a way to siphon the clouds away. Then it would only be a matter of time before we could colonize Venus.
How shall we do this, R_F?
Welcome to the SDMB, rippingtons_fan
The scientific community would rather seek practical reasons to get people down on Venus before rushing into expensive R&D; doing things just because (and expending obscene amounts of money on it) is not wise.
Notice that I refrained from adding 3) Hi Opal!… no, wait… :smack:
Can you see any reason as to why we should accomplish this? What’s to gain?
I’d pass on a manned mission, but it would be cool to try and land a tougher probe that could survive long enough to take a good look around.
Right back atcha.
Stop and consider that the scientific community HAS considered the practicality of a mission to Venus, and that the obstacles in question are so great that we can’t do it.
Let’s look at obstacles already proposed by other posters:
Sulfuric acid atmosphere - Any spaceship that lands on Venus must be able to resist acid corrosion on every exposed surface, well enough to continue to be spaceworthy after landing and exploration - unless you’re planning on astronauts dying a noble death in the name of science when they can’t return to their orbiter. If you want the astronauts to step outside and collect rocks and stuff, the spacesuits must also be fully resistant to corrosion, flexible, and lightweight, and presumably equipped to allow the wearer to collect material and data unattainable from inside the ship.
900 degree weather - The ship must be heavily insulated and equipped with extremely efficient cooling systems, yet leave room for the occupants and all their equipment. And continue to be completely corrosion-resistant.The EVH suits must also be incredibly well insulated and cooled, while retaining their lightweight status and manuverability. And corrosion resistance. And equipped to allow the wearer to collect material and data.
High Pressure- The ship must be built of materials strong enough to withstand atmospheric pressure variances ranging from a total vaccuum to 92 times that of the earth, which is similar to the pressure about 920 meters under the ocean. And be corrosion and heat resistant. The EVA suits must be able to protect its occupant from the high pressure, while remaining corrosion-resistant, heat-resistant, manueverable, lightweight, and equipped to allow the wearer to collect material and data.
Materials found on earth that will fulfull all the above requirements: You tell me. Remember, you need several different types of material for different applications, especially on the EVA suits.
Scientific value of landing a manned mission on Venus: Um…we get to say we went there?
I agree about the difficulties of a manned mission, but it’s a bit odd that there isn’t a single Venus probe listed on the NASA science missions list under “In Development” or “Under Study.” Do most planetary scientists think Mars is more exciting?
Cheese in a can? That’s ridiculous. They like string cheese.
Most likely, since there’s evidence that Mars once had liquid water on its surface, and it is at least possible that Mars once had microbial life. On the other hand, even if Venus also used to be interesting, all the evidence has probably ben eroded away by the ridiculously severe weather.
Also such probes would need an efficient cooling system to operte very long, and, as my old astronomy professor explained to me, designing such a system is inherently self-defeating. Any system powerful enough to protect the equipment very long will also create so much heat itself that it, uh… won’t protect the equipment very long. Unless we can come up with machines that don’t produce heat, we’re stuck.
If the surface atmospheric pressure is ninety-two times that of Sol-3, doesn’t that mean that it has a liquid surface?
We could float on the surface. In a beautiful pea-green boat. Yeah, that’s the ticket.
Nope, rocky, roasted and corrosive. With some luck you´d find a pond of molten lead or sulphur.
So has anyone done work on finding batteries, chips, mechanicals, etc, that normally function at these high temperatures? Building a probe whose normal operating temperature is around 900F/480C would eliminate a BIG part of the problem.
Isn’t there a sodium/sulphur battery that normally runs at something like 500F degrees and carries something like three times the energy density of regular lithiuméion batteries, so much so that they were looking at using it for electric cars here on Earth in spite of having to heat it?
What work is being done for high-temeratire chips? Why do regular chips fail at higher temperatures?
Many regular metals are good to a thousand degrees or more, aren’t they?
When a spacecraft contacts another object we have different terms such as:
Landing as the LEM, which seems to mean land on a solid object w/ a substaintail gravitational field
Splashdown as in the early Mer., Gen., Apl., US space programs, which seems to mean ‘land’ in the liquid surface of a body w/ a substaintail gravitational field.
Touchdown, which seems to mean ‘landing’ on a perpaired runway on a body w/ a substaintail gravitational field.
Docking, which seems to mean 2 spacecrafts or space station and space craft 'locking together.
and
Redeview (I know I muffed that spelling), which seems to mean the ‘landing’ of space craft on a body w/o a substantial gravitational field, such and landing on a asteroid.
Are these terms correct. and what are the others, like a lighter then air craft ‘landing’ in the atmoshpere of Titan?