I have kids and a host of uncommon opinions. Some are more socially taboo than others; religion is one of them. As the Dudeling gels into a more or less human form (he’s only 3.5 now), we’re finding it interesting to temper some of our views around him and wondering what to say/how to approach things with him.
This has both been completely new in a have-to-be-in-the-situation sort of way and an it’s-just-like-we-predicted sort of way.
French Toast asked some good questions. We have yet to delve into the concept of god, but will shortly. Will be interested in how things go.
I was raised without any kind of religious guidance, including advice about what to say when other kids brought it up. My husband was raised by a Southern Baptist preacher and went to Bible college with a specialization in “missions”. He turned atheist at 30.
I think our stance is going to have to be the one we have presented to his family in order to keep getting along with them: that I’ve never been in the habit of going to church but am still a nice person, and that while he still “believes” he’s fed up with the politics and back-biting of organized religion.
Your lack of being a parent doesn’t make your point any less valid.
It’s curious how leftist mentalities always ‘preach’ (see what I did there, go on admit it you laughed just a little) tolerance yet rarely practice it.
Proof is in the pudding with how many parents here claim to dismiss religion or God(s) as viable or believable, and immediately categorize it as ‘myth;’ rather than having a truly open minded mentality (another over used and under respected phrase).
What’s more alarming is the open and unashamed admission that these same parents have to somehow limit the dogmatic views of their kids out of fear of what? That they won’t be like you, so jaded and intolerant of others? Or that they’ll actually be happy following a religion?
If a teenager - in today’s world mind you…- openly supports a western religion(or eastern I suppose), you should be proud; it would seem to me they are wise beyond their years and have already aligned themselves with a belief system - which often entails respectable characteristics such as tolerance, patience, discipline..
Meanwhile, other teenagers are doing the boring angst thing and going around spouting off excerpts and footnotes from “In 90 minutes with Soren Kierkegaard” acting like they’re neo-existentialists and experiencing string theory while tripped out on Ketamine.
Maybe this thread would have gone better if it was “Agnostics with kids”
This. You cannot ignore religion or simply mock it. Teaching your kids to do either is going to cripple their ability to deal with history, culture and other people.
I always just told them what other people think, and then what I think. When they were younger I was more generally respectful of religious stuff, but my kids are older now (10 and 13) and we make occasional jokes.
As soon as they were old enough to really have an opinion, they were atheists. We live in the south, so a lot of our discussions are about the balance of being true to your beliefs while not causing too much trouble. For example, they more often will say they don’t go to church, rather than they don’t believe in god. And they have been taught that while you are in another’s home you show respect for their rules and beliefs, period. If everyone is praying, you bow your head and remain silent during the prayer, for example.
There is some overt (almost certainly illegal) religious crap at their public school, and I have told them if they choose to fight it (by refusing to participate in a teacher led prayer, for example) that I would support them 100%. Mostly that isn’t a battle they want to fight, however. They are pretty closeted, but it’s their decision. I think as they get older and peer pressure and the urge to fit in decreases, they’ll be more open about their (non) beliefs. Also, they are wary about telling people because they understand it’s often taken as arrogance by theists, and they don’t want to hurt anyone’s feelings. Almost everyone they know is religious, after all.
We discuss religion a fair amount, but always in an historical way. My kids know a lot about many different religions, more than most kids their age, I’d wager. My son in particular has a real interest in sociology in general, and different culture’s religions in particular, so we talk about that a lot. I teach morality entirely separate from religion.
While I wish you were right about that, I have to argue that it isn’t, looking at the vast swathes of recorded history, and kids’ own tendencies to make up and then believe in causal reasons for the physical phenomena they don’t yet understand.
People aren’t inherently logical and rational - it takes conscious effort to not engage in some level of magical thinking, and even the most strident rationalist atheist does so when they’re not paying attention or on minor amusements.
Not a parent (yet) but an atheist, and husband is animist. Planning to keep the religion is harmful talk to a minimum until my mother passes away (or the kid is old enough to be tactful, which given this family is somewhere around 30 years old) to keep the peace.
Otherwise, planning to focus less on downplaying any specific religion, and more on what I think is important: logic, reason, empathy for people who aren’t able to bypass their indoctrination or cultural mores or internal wiring, and being kind to others even when you think they’re stupid or crazy.
ETA: there’s also going to be Miss Elizabeth’s very good post about including religious information as a cultural/historical fact.
I find this post fairly offensive, and frankly I wonder how “open-minded” you’re going to be when you read about atheist parents who don’t fit your ignorant preconceptions.
This could have been a learning opportunity for you, but from this post I see you aren’t interested in learning about people different than yourself. I’m glad I raised my kids better than that.
I’m not sure if I can really agree with that thinking. It seems to be belittling something that is VERY important to a lot of people. I’m agnostic and my daughter hasn’t really been exposed to religion at all outside of knowing her cousins go to church. And even that means nothing to her. However, recently she’s started saying “Oh Jesus…” when faced with something frustrating or annoying. It doesn’t bother me so I haven’t really been trying to make her stop but my parents have been pushing me to make her stop because she might offend someone. I had never really thought about it, and realized that if I allow her to think it’s ok to say such things, despite how it might come across to other people, it’s going to make life a bit rougher on her. She needs to know that respect applies to all aspects of a person, including their religious beliefs.
Right, different scenarios would call for different attitudes toward religion, ranging from positive to negative. Religion isn’t “good” or “bad” – it’s much too complex. “Open respect for religion” to me just means an open-minded admiration or due regard for someone’s beliefs or traditions, which again depends on the scenario.
To answer your OP, I would try to teach my kids about lots of religions, especially those they are likely to encounter, with all the good and the bad that goes along with them (as is age-appropriate). If they decide to be religious, I would support and respect that, as long as they are morally and ethically responsible in their religion.
People have to know about gods before they can not believe in them.
I consider myself totally non-religious. Those who identify as atheist (at least around here) seem to put a lot of thought into the subject. It almost never comes up in my life except when I’m on this board. When my kids rarely ask about religion I tell them to make up their own minds. So far they don’t seem to think much about it (13 and 11).
I don’t really care about offending people on that level. I have raised my kids to have manners and tact, so they wouldn’t use “Jesus Christ!” in any situation where they wouldn’t use “motherfucker”.
I don’t think we need to respect anyone’s religion, just their right to free exercise of the same. So they can be offended all they want, but we have a right to use whatever language we like, because we follow the Bill of Rights, not the Ten Commandments.
And so is the idea that most atheists live unexamined lives. One of the reasons why atheists can get so loud about it is that they have examined religion, all religions, and spiritual belief systems, and thought long and hard and available “evidence” and societal impacts and everything else, and come up with what they believe.
I doubt you have subjected your beliefs to the same scrutiny. If my kids turned out religious, I’d feel like a failure in a lot of important ways. But it’s great that you teach your kids to be Christian, since mine will be stupid, narrow minded Ketamine freaks. (Seriously, does anyone do Ketamine anymore? ). :rolleyes:
You certainly have your finger on the pulse of today’s youth. I’m telling you, I cannot get my 11-year-old to shut up about Kierkegaard. Every day it’s Kierkegaard this, Kierkegaard that. I’m thinking of doubling his daily ketamine allotment just to preserve my sanity.
To answer the OP, I basically take the path of least resistance as mentioned by some others. I don’t bring religion up as a topic, and when asked, I explain that some people believe in religion and gods, but I don’t. I don’t indulge in mockery of religion around them, because they are, IMO, too young and that sort of thing would not be appropriate. I would not be happy if I found out that they went to school and started mocking other religious children, the same as I would not be happy if a religious child started mocking them. So I don’t model that behavior at home.
I feel no particular responsibility or duty to introduce them to various religions. If they want that in their life, they can search it out on their own once they’re older.
My family is not religious, and it was never a big deal. Church was something that other people did that we didn’t happen to do- some people do Little League, some people do Girl Scouts, and some people go to church. I understood that other people had beliefs and that these beliefs were important to them, but that this was something that just wasn’t a part of our family.
As I got older, I started picking up on the idea of being religious is akin to a small personality flaw. It’d be a lot like you’d treat a nice friendly guy who happens to sell Amway or be a Scientologist. It’s not a big deal, but they lose a bit of credibility.
I also picked up on a lot of hostility towards the religious right, which IMHO was perfectly justified. My family challenged me to explore my own understanding of ethics and justice, but they didn’t hide that they have no respect for people telling us gay family members are going to burn in hell, etc.
There are lots of great stories in religion. I even have a nativity scene that I set up over Christmas. I’ve pointed out that the evergreen tree was worshiped long before Christianity and that Christian festivals are laid over the older celebrations.
I sent my kid to a Catholic secondary school, the headmistress and teachers were great but the nuns were mean old bitches who wouldn’t give the kids their ball back and Father Bob, well he couldn’t cope really either.
There was a class called Christian Family Values which the kids were supposed to go home and get feedback from their parents on. I later learned I was one of the few parents who did participate.
They had her for five years, at least she knows a little of how a religion functions and it didn’t impress her much.
Agreed. Who wants to be the wide-eyed naif of a Chick tract responding: “God? God, who?” :eek:
Around our house it’s all treated as history and mythology with the understanding that “some people believe…”. (Though I did try to convince my kid that we were serious Thor worshipers for a while).
At the moment I’m having a hard enough time figuring out how to handle Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny. But I plan to go the “some people believe…” route, and to teach her to think and reason and question. If I’ve done my job correctly, even if my daughter turns out religious (and you never know how these things will go) she won’t reject science and reality to be so.
