I, for one, just enjoy the debate.
Besides, I’m here at 0410, do you think I have anything better to do? 
This, as Call me Frank has already mentioned, is Pascal’s Wager. However, it has an inherent flaw - Pascal assumed that if God exists, then God must conform to his own cultural definition of God! What if God exists, but is really Allah? Or Buddah? What if God exists but thinks that not believing in It is better than believing in a travesty of Itself - thereby allowing atheists in to Its heaven, but denying all those of “false” faiths (which may well be all faiths - after all, there are plenty of contradictions between religion, so if at least some of them are wrong, why not all of them?)
This is neither here nor there on the question of whether some form of Supernatural Sentience does in facr exist - I think not, you are entitled to a different opinion; and certainly has nothing to do with the OP - but I felt it necessary to point out that Pascal’s Wager has this king-sized hole in it, and just won’t hold water.
Dani
What’s the hurry? 
In all seriousness, I asked the same thing for probably more years than you’ve been alive. As my sainted mother used to say, you never know what’s around the corner. Why does He work this way? I can speak only from my own frame of reference, and your mileage may vary, but for me, it was always an intellectual quest — a search with my brain. It was when I shut down my brain for a brief moment, and opened my heart, that He poured Himself into me. I know that I cannot hear with my eyes or see with my ears, and I know that I must communicate with God with my heart.
See, I think if you don’t get religion from your parents, you’d have to be totally unsupervised and kidnapped by fanatics to ever buy into it. Or lacking in some sort of internal mechanism that won’t allow you to distinguish fantasy from reality. When my son was accosted by religious folks (who bribed him into church with Happy Meals), he asked me and I told him my opinion – that being that it’s unknowable but I’m not betting on it. I don’t find it necessary to “pound” it into his brain. It’s apparent there’s no god interfering with life on Earth. The schooling is only necessary when you’re trying to convert someone.
I agree that religion and mental illness are two separate worlds that may converge for a few people. I too was diagnosed with schizophrenia in my past. I visited a couple mental wards for short periods of time.
I experienced delusional thoughts. At times, I believed I was the second coming of Christ. At other times, I thought that “story tale” witches where very real. I even thought that certain aspects of the book “1984” were literally happening. I ran the gamut of feeling very wonderful to scared to death.
While the worlds of religion and mental illness combined for me for a time, I do not apply this combination to other people. My friends and family run the gamut of believers and non-believers. I cannot logically make the connection between religious beliefs and mental condition. This would be like saying that followers of one political extreme are mentally ill because their beliefs differ from mine.
Part of me believes my current religious beliefs are based on my previous bouts of delusional thought and depression. Religion and gods and Jebus became very real to me at times. These thoughts made my life more exciting. Much of what I had been taught about Christianity became very real and applicable.
My mental illness has stabilized for a number of years now. Most, if not all, of my symptoms have disappeared. My skepticism of Christianity and belief in a god has peaked at its current level. I was skeptical of religion before my past delusions. I spent considerable thought blaming a god for the depressions that I suffered for multiple years. I’ve come to the understanding that things happen in my life that cannot be explained. Life won’t always seem fair. I take responsibility for what I can in life and let the rest go. Some things are unknowable.
I admit that I don’t understand some people how some people take religion to extremes. I’m not going to sit here and judge them as mentally ill. At the same time, I will not stand for someone witnessing their faith to me and telling me that my life is somehow lack or incomplete because I believe differently than them. I will respect your right to believe as long as you respect my right to not believe.
FWIW, I’ve never used the term “mentally ill”. That was someone else. I’m also not an athiest.
Now: a solo practitioner of what? If the answer is Christianity/Judaism/Islam/any organized religion, then you fell for a con. And there is no prejudice, angst or ignorance whatsoever behind my statement; it was a statement of fact, pure and simple.
I started out in the Episcopal Church and I believed bigtime. But I had questions that others could/would not answer, so I started digging for the answers myself. Mind you, I was looking for answers to support my beliefs. What I found was that it’s all a lie, a giant con game that has been foisted off on people ever since the first caveman figured out that he could blow smoke up the tribe’s collective ass and “interpert” the thunder and lightning. In exchange, they would hunt for him and give him a woman or two. Nice work if you can get it.
It took me years to even find the correct question to ask. I’ll save you those years and give you the question. Take at least three religions, widely seperated by time and/or distance. I like to use Christianity, the human sacrifices of the Aztecs and the Greek Pantheon. Throw as many more into the mix as you desire. Now - analyze your mix from an historical perspective, with an open mind. What do they have in common?
If I tell you the answer, it probably won’t mean much; I think your answer will have far more personal meaning to you if you dig it up yourself. However, if you are not willing to take the time and are willing to accept the research that I spent 20-plus years of my life doing, I’ll tell you the answer that you will find. Let me know.
Metacom not do that! OG get severely pissed if do!!
I made a comment about this on page 3, but no one’s addressed it yet: I stated that I’d rather have a kid that was a “soft,” laid-back atheist, instead of a fire-and-brimstone agitated super-fundy preachy Christian. I’d get along better with the soft, laid-back atheist. (I always have.)
Would the atheists on this thread, if forced to chose, prefer to have a laid-back Christian kid (you know, one that was low-key and not preachy or judgmental), or an agitated, in-your-face, preachy, militant atheist?
I dunno, wiping up the slobber from the mentally retarded theist might get tired after a while…
Pardon me, I have to go figure out how to open up my magic cold box so I may gnaw on a raw squirrel I speared yesterday.
And those are the only options because?
Enjoy,
Steven
LOL, I am not much for the sig thing, but may I?
Someone seems to be missing the point behind the concept.
I explained some this before. Because there are different kinds of people. People who act a certain way and treat others a certain way. Some people are strident, agitated, preachy, and “in your face.” Others are laid-back, non-judgmental, and not “in-your-face.”
So, I’m curious—would a preachy, strident, “in your face” atheist kid be preferable to a laid-back, non-preachy, non-judgmental Christian kid? Simple question.
Irrelevant. He’s asking which of two children you’d prefer, not which from among only two possible children you’d prefer. You might ask how much salience the question itself has, however.
I’m an atheist who - I suppose - would rather have a laid-back theist for a child than a militant atheist, if by militant you mean someone filled with hate for anyone who is open to the possibility of their being a God (say, an Ayn Rand). I’m not open to that possibility, but I see no reason we can’t all get along. For the most part.
You may even make it into a bumper sticker, provided I get 5% royalties.
I’d prefer the laid-back theist of course. I’d be far more disappointed if I raised an asshole than if I raised a Believer.
Eh, there would still be the mild disappointment that I’d raised a theist… but like Diogenes the Cynic, I don’t know how much I’d like rasing a jackass either.
So put me down for “Laid-back theist”…
You have a lovely, succinct way of putting it.
Yes, that was the point I was trying to make. That not being an asshole is more important.
Another clarification question for y’all: Would you consider a non-asshole, laid-back, non-judgmental theist to still be “mentally ill”? And what if they made the transition to theism gradually, and other parts of their life and their general personality and behavior did not alter in a negative way? Would they still qualify as “mentally ill” in your book?
Just to be clear, I never said I thought that theistic belief was a sign of mental illness. My fear would not be that my daughter was crazy but that she was gullible, naive, not thinking critically. I would especially be annoyed if she was led to convert to something out of peer pressure or was fed a load of crap by some self-appointed soul saver. I would most particularly be agitated if my daughter were to adopt beliefs which were demonstrably false (e.g YEC).
A faith which was the result of some real experience or honest effort at thinking and exploring would be less bothersome to me. I just don’t want my kid to be a sucker or to surrender her brain to some self-appointed religious authority.
I can’t speak for the others, but my own preference is that whenever you mean to use “supernatural”, say “imaginary” instead.