We have a storage shed in our backyard that was already there when we bought our house five years ago. It is a wood structure that the previous owner had it built by a custom shed company and it could be 10 to 20 years old. Our house has a fully finished basement and no garage, so this shed is a necessary structure.
It seems to have been built directly on the ground (no concrete pad) and, during our time living here, has served as a shelter for various animals including skunks, raccoons, and ground-hogs. So we possibly have a situation in which we think that this shed is resting on floor joists on tunnelled or significantly pitted ground. The actual floor consists of thick panels of particle board.
At some point something bad is obviously going to happen to the shed, such as rotting support structures, the shed floor sinking into whatever animal condo is going on underneath, etc.
My wife and I are starting to figure out how best to address this potential problem. We don’t have tons of cash and everything from the floor up is in good shape. In an ideal world we would either replace it or temporarily lift it, install a concrete pad, and then replace the shed.
As a cheaper solution we are instead looking at emptying the shed and then removing the floor panels so that we can see what’s under it and ensure that there are no animals still there. Then we would like to fill all spaces with cement, for support, and to ensure that nothing digs under there anymore.
Is that a realistic or reasonable approach? We will be selling our house in about six years and we are trying to make sure that there are no issues that could bite us at sale time. Thoughts of dopers would be greatly appreciated.
If this was built on-site as an “instant shed” commonly purchased through a local building company, it is probably constructed with pressure-treated joists that lie directly on the ground (possibly with some masonry blocks used to level it). The other lumber is probably ordinary. This is a very common method of construction.
If it was constructed this way, you have several options and considerations.
First, the joists will probably be just fine for many years. It often helps to make sure that the entire length of the joists are not in contact with the ground. You can usually do this by using a couple jacks (or even a sturdy timber as a lever) and raising the joists enough to insert masonry blocks as footings. You may need to put another timber under the joists when you exert the lifting pressure so you raise the entire shed. Raising the shed is not necessary, but it often makes the drainage better under the shed, as well as keeping the joists out of contact with soil. You’ll also be able to reach underneath and clean out any debris.
Second, consider getting plastic lattice and installing it on all sides to prevent animals from getting under the shed. This usually looks pretty good and allows ventilation. It took me about one sheet (4’x8’) of lattice and an hour to install some on a friend’s shed last year.
Finally, I got a small exhaust fan and a solar panel so the shed gets a little ventilation (when it’s sunny). I put it high on one end and installed some metal vents down low on the sides. I figure it also helps keep the inside dry.
TL;DR: You can probably lift the shed and put it on blocks. Lattice will solve the animal problems. A fan helps, too.
The biggest problem I see is that IF the floor was framed first, and then the walls framed on top of the floor, the particle board flooring won’t come out easily … the flooring is between the joists and walls … so check if you can if the bottom plate of the wall is sitting on the particle board …
Concrete is expensive … recouping the expense when you sell might not happen … whereas a couple square yards of hardware screen strategically stapled will keep the critters out …
I guess I’m not clear on what … exactly … is sitting on the ground … perhaps some pictures would be helpful …
Yeah, really. It doesn’t pay to fix it too good. It’s a shed. Worst case, it rots out and collapses, that’s the long term fate of the shed, regardless. If a piece of the floor gets too rotten, just cut it out and replace it with treated plywood. Like others point out, the serviceability of the shed will probably have very little effect on the sale price when you sell the place in 6 years.
It sounds like you don’t have any actual evidence of floor rot or any other problem. You’re just worried about it based on the shed’s history of housing animals. Chances are the shed’s floor is in a lot better shape than you think it is. If you are worried about cost (you said you don’t have tons of cash), I would say the best thing to do is ignore it.
Worst case, the floor does end up with a problem. At that point, just cut out the particle board around the problem so that you can see what’s underneath, and then fix whatever the problem is. You can fill in a hole if it’s the ground that’s the problem, or you can brace up the floor joist if a critter chewed through it.
While it’s possible that critters have done some damage underneath, the floor isn’t going to rot like you seem to think it is. I had a shed that was built when our house was built in 1960, and we tore it down a few years ago because of rot, mostly on the front wall and around the sides. The wooden floor was rock solid, even after 50 years. My kids had broken the windows out of it, so rain had been leaking in for the last decade or so of its life and even that hadn’t rotted the floors.
You should be able to lift it with a small hydraulic car jack, shouldn’t be a problem at all if you empty it out first. Empty you may only need a big lever to get it up out of the ground. You could slide some landscape ties under it to get it off the ground, or concrete blocks. Depending on the state of the joists under the floor you may need to replace them but just letting them dry out and and dose of insecticide may be all they need. If you can get it under there a layer of heavy black polyethylene under the joists is all that’s needed to keep critters out, even sitting right on the ground.
You don’t say how big it is, but I took down an old sheet metal shed because mold had gotten to it and it wasn’t in a great place either. Not having time to build a new shed and not liking the price for getting a pre-built unit put in I decided to get an 8’x20’ cargo container. You can get beat up units for under $2000, I called a place that rents them and for under $100 month I got a brand new unit, what they call a ‘one-tripper’, built in China, shipped here full of goods, and sitting on lot since then. I had the option to buy instead of rent but this one is in such great condition they want over $3000 for it so I’ll continue to rent until I’m done paying for an addition on my house and buy it then. I’ll get 50% of rent payments towards the purchase. Even the beat up units are worth it over a typical shed as long as the door shuts tight. These things are made of heavy steel and will last forever. They don’t need a foundation but sitting on landscape ties is fine to get them off the ground. The doors seal up tight and are open the full 8 foot width. Not a bit of moisture is getting in there, no animal is going to scratch or chew it’s way through the metal. I have enough roofing materials left over from the addition to build a simple peaked roof on top to make it look like a shed and provide some extra storage. When I own it I’ll paint it up to look like a shed. I can even trade it in for an older unit that costs less if I purchase. So before you buy another shed look into one of these. There’s a storage container glut right now because we import so much and export so little so these things will be a deal for a while.
Regarding the size of our shed, it is 10 x 12 ft. And the floor panels were laid down first so removal would be difficult. As far as the ground-to-shed support is concerned, it seems to be some joists running along the length of the shed and they are resting on patio stones (those grey square ones) or something of that nature.
The animal problem is not, however, in the shed. It’s under the shed and our concern is that we could have something go in there to die, or someone’s cat get stuck in there. We have had mice in the shed but that’s another issue which we can resolve.
I will try to get a better look underneath it. I think for our purposes the lattice idea is probably the best as there is no sense that the floor is weakening.
TriPolar, by “cargo container” I assume you are referring to a sea container. It’s actually a great idea but because of the configuration of our yard it would be tricky (but still bloody tempting nonetheless). Something to think about.
Thanks all and any further advice related to this is welcome.
Personally, i would pull the shed up on some 4x4’s with a truck or small tractor or something
frame a little pad for it and pour concrete, nothing you cant do by hand, we are only talking about a pad for a shed.
Then pull the shed back up on its concrete pad.
Now no animals digging under it, less prone to rot etc.
And if the plywood floor eventually rotted out, you could just cut it out and use the concrete pad underneath as the floor.
An 8’ x 20’ stick built outbuilding would cost roughly the same, and be A LOT sexier with lil’ heart shaped windows. Just don’t think of all the trees that were murdered to bring you the lumber …
When we purchased our house, it came with a Wendy house.
We didn’t want it, so we listed it and sold it. A young couple turned up, and he tried to move this thing with ropes and pulleys and straps and rackets. Even with everyone helping, we made no progress. So they said they would come back with some big Samoan stevedores.
Instead, the next day they turned up with her father, who wasn’t a big man. But he did have a coil of number 8 fencing wire and some chain tensioners. A couple of lengths on the truck, and a loop of wire round the shed, and he (on his own) just used the fence tensioners to ratchet the shed along the ground, and up onto the flatbed truck. It was really awesome to watch, but I did stand well out of flailing wire range.
It may be easier to move the shed to lay a concrete pad than you think.
When I got our shed about 10 years ago I found that if it was installed on a permanent concrete foundation it required a building permit and inspection and had to follow code. We chose to put the shed on a pad of gravel so it is considered a temporary structure not subject to building code regulations.
The occasional ground hog that decides to take up residence is dealt with as a separate problem, not really related to the shed – they might tunnel anywhere.
I used to know a really cool guy who had a beautiful mansion-type home. Behind his home was an exact duplicate house, scaled down to something a bit larger than a child would have as a playhouse.
He was an MD/PhD clinical pathologist. His little house was set up as a laboratory where he primarily did histopathology. Having his lab in his home would have meant having to deal with the odor of formalin among other things.
It was awesome. He would wake up in the morning, shave, shower, get dressed, etc
then walk 40 yards to work.
If you want to keep critters from getting under the shed, you need to not just block and space between the bottom of the shed and the ground, but keep them from tunneling. Get some fencing material or hardware cloth of the proper mesh to keep out the targeted critters. Bend a length into an “L” shape configuration. Fit it up to the wall with the long leg of the “L” extending out along the ground about 12-14" and attach the other leg to the wall. You could cover it with dirt or gravel. This will keep any tunnelers from getting under your shed.
