You know, I used to read at a board called bitterwaitress.com - they had a poster a few years ago who posted a lot like Springs1. So did another board whose name escapes me - the poster was just as rabid about tipping. Hmmm. Time for Missy to do a few searches. I can’t believe there are two whackjobs like this floating around.
Good grief. Walk away from a thread for a few days and it goes wonkers!
Before I address specific things, a quick note for Springs1. I know this has been addressed in general terms, but you clearly need a quick lesson in netiquette:
Your online toolbox includes bold, italics, underlining, “scare quotes,” asterisks, ALL CAPS. Please pick one. The first two are pretty standard online, and a single asterisk if you don’t know the codes. COMBINATIONS are simply not needed. Ever.
Just another quick netiquette lesson. It’s generally considered polite to READ (see, now you’ve got me doing it;)) other posts before replying to them. My “excellent server” scenario, as described above, goes like this:
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As I’m talking to my companions, the server moves into my field of view and catches my eye without interrupting the conversation. She holds up the pitcher and looks at my glass.
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If I want more, I nod and push the glass to a spot at the edge of the table that she can reach easily.
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If I don’t want more, I place my hand over the glass and shake my head. If I’m not speaking at the moment, I’ll mouth “no, thanks.”
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Server gets big tip.
If you honestly know someone who wouldn’t understand those signals, I’d be very surprised.
sigh You could try the whole “read something before responding” trick, too.
At home, I get my own drinks, as I’m not paying someone else to serve me.
At a restaurant, I said I tip better when my glass is kept full (see response to Springs1 for the process). I did not say that I get “pissed” or “furious,” when it isn’t full, nor that I gripe about the service. I don’t ruin anyone else’s experience. I’m really quite mellow in restaurants.
Actually, Springs1 is at least partially right here. There have been a number of times when I’ve ordered iced tea and gotten the powdered mix, which I don’t like. Every time, I’ve asked “can I switch to diet coke with the next refill?” and they’ve never batted an eye.
[mod hat]
Tone it down, Brown Eyed Girl. This is not the pit. You can disagree with her, but don’t call her names.
[/mod hat]
Well personally I am quite confidant that our Ms. Springs is playing us here, but she is fun and makes me laugh. I highly doubt she actually has the opinions she has stated here in real life. I like how when you can paint her into a corner she just disappears and when back just conveniently sidesteps the question.
And look at her posting record—42 posts and all of them posted in this thread. Out of all the threads on this board this is the only thing that interests her? Please.
But she is entertaining and has made me laugh out loud several times so what is the harm. I am like Really Not All That Bright in that I don’t want to report anything in case she goes away!
Springs Springs come back! We miss you. I want to subscribe to your newsletter!
I think it’s why we should go generally the European way. Pay a decent base wage, INCLUDE THE 15% TIP IN THE BILL AND LET THE CUSTOMER SUCK WIND and let customers tip whatever they want over that, if they feel like it.
Anyway, when we say “we” should do away with the tipping system, who is “we?” All the government can do is set the minimum wage. They can’t make tipping illegal. I bet if they did set a minimum wage, lots of people would still tip. Restaurants aren’t going to post signs saying “tipping not required” unless they have added 15% to the bill. That’s usually what they say in Europe: “15% gratuity is included in the price.” They don’t say “no tipping.” It’s up to the customer.
Wonder how Springs would feel about that?
She’d probably go off on another rant about how the restaurant is forcing her to tip when the server has treated her unfairly.
The government can require that restaurants honestly pay an hourly wage commensurate with other professions. Not $2.14 or $4.36 or $ridiculous low amount + tips, but the actual minimum wage, no tips included in that calculation.
I don’t think the tip should be included in the bill, at least not as some separate cost. Not unless the proprietor is also going to itemize the bill into lines like “Cost of food”, “Chef’s salary”, “Busboy’s salary”, “Rent”, “OSHA compliance”, “Bribe to health inspector”, etc. That’s a pipe dream though. We’ve gotten so accustomed to this accursed tradition, that restaurants would have to include that “15% gratuity is included in the price” note.
Pay a decent base wage. If people still want to tip, they can, but I don’t think customers should be obligated to tip. At all. Honestly, I always thought that tipping was, in fact optional. If you felt that service was above and beyond, you gave a little extra, and the standard for that extra was 15%, recently increased to 20%. But people have been treating tipping like it’s fucking mandatory. And that whole, “you must tip” attitude leads towards people like (the possibly insincere) Springs, who feel that since they are essentially paying a fee to their servers directly, on top of the actual bill for the dining experience, that they can be picky little psychos.
I say, screw the psychos, and screw the demanding food service personnel who obtained employment with variable rates of recompense and then bitch about “cheapskates”. Build a reasonable waiters’ salary into the overall bill, make tipping TRULY optional, and treat waiters just like service employees who don’t receive tips. If you (customers) don’t like the perfunctory service, dish out the money for the high-end places or STFU. If you (servers) don’t like not getting steady 15-20% tips, learn to fucking type or STFU.
I hope we find out!
Oh, and one thing- did (s)he ever actually gender identify, or is it just us (me definitely included) that is assigning her femininity?
Shit, now you boneheads probably scared her away.
(thinks about the right bait to use…)
Springs1?
You there, Sweetheart?
Could you please go over the part where you say that mistakes take top priority over everything else, but you should still be served first if you ordered first, no matter what?
Is that a mistake? If so, does it come first, no matter what? Or does it come first after everything else?
Thanks!
(carries keyboard back into forest; peeks head around tree trunk)
Why should the tip be itemized? The tip goes to the server, it doesn’t go to those other people. The food you buy pays those things.
We already include the gratuity to parties of 6 or more, in lots of places.
I remember this one time this guy tried to pull a scam. A party of six came in, but this one guy would get up and go have a drink at the bar, then go back. He was served his food with his friends, ate with his friends, but would then go sit at the bar and have another drink.
I added the gratuity to the party of six. He started screaming they didn’t have to pay, because, see he sat at the bar, too. I had to get the manager who agreed with me. I almost thought we were going to have to call the cops. They were angling to just have the entire meal comp’ed and get thrown out if they created a huge enough scene that was disrupting the whole restaurant. Customers can really be amazing at times.
Last week I was sitting at the bar at Outback and some guy came up to order a drink; he had a poker chip, which Outback used to use to indicate that happy hour customers had another drink coming to them. Outback, however, stopped using the chips a long, long time ago and stopped honoring the chips shortly thereafter. Moreover, the whole happy hour deal is supposed to be that you get the free drink during the same visit, not just save them up for whenever you feel like it. The guy insisted that he had a RIGHT to his free drink, dammit! The bartender explained the policy to him (the manager on duty was actually listening in on the whole conversation as he was voiding a credit card charge at the computer right next to the customer) and the guy was LIVID. “What the hell kind of happy hour is it if I can’t get my free drink? I PAID FOR IT!” To which the bartender replied, “I’m just informing you of the policy, you can discuss this with a manager if you’d like.” His response? “Manager, schmanager! I paid for the drink, I have the chip, GIVE ME THE DRINK!” At which point the manager/schmanager turned to him, introduced himself, and talked to him.
I wish this story had a happy ending. It doesn’t. The manager decided it wasn’t worth the headache, so he just gave the jerkwad his free drink. Instant facepalm. I really, really wish he would have backed up the bartender on this, because she was very polite while enforcing the store’s policy. Is it really worth it to placate one dickhead at the expense of your employees?
Unfortunately, that’s common. “Customers” know they can get free stuff if they make a big scene, and there are scammers who do it all over town.
I think managers are trained that if the scene is bad enough, it’s better to let them go free without paying than risk other customers getting upset.
Why on earth would she bother to come back after that wonderful welcome you dudes gave her?:rolleyes:
“You Dudes”?!?
I make one post in a 9 page thread, and suddenly I’m one of those “You Dudes” types?
Tut tut, Sirrah.
Bless your heart.
As I said ‘way back in post 150 of this thread, I’d personally handle it with a big sign that says “NO TIPPING REQUIRED: WE PAY OUR EMPLOYEES A LIVING WAGE.” All the prices would be a bit higher, and the exact method for providing incentives to the staff wouldn’t be the patrons’ problem (or the patron’s business).
I think people would be drawn to a restaurant that was promoted that way.
Dude, often here (especially when the reply is addressed in the plural) the reply is meant for all.
Many of the posts attacking/harassing Springs are about on the 5th grade level, if that. They are mean, petty and childish, suited more for the playground than a board hoping to Fight Ignorance.
I understand. I include myself in those being childish-
but I think Spring1 had the opportunity to have the ignorance fought before people started throwing licks in earnest…
This. (or should I say THIS!!!)
Duly noted. I do apologize. It was wholly unnecessary for me to textualize that observation.
True, you make a good point.
I certainly would. In fact, I might start patronizing it to the exclusion of all others, particularly if it was reasonably close.
New business model? You heard it here first, folks. Well… probably on The Simpsons, actually.
If you read the whole thread, or even just the last half-dozen pages, you’ll quickly see that the posters involved were paddling desperately just to keep their heads above the ignorance. I don’t think they’d have been fighting it was ever much of an option.