Interestingly enough I had no calf soreness whatsoever but did wake up with sore glutes today.
Now it must be noted that I am not a typical “runner” - I run, but moreso I am a crosstrainer to the extreme. I jump rope, swim, bike, do the elliptical in my basement in my bare feet, balance disc work barefooted, weight training and calisthenics same. My body is not efficiently adapted, well for any particular thing, and certainly not to running with a particular stride, just inefficiently adapted to plod on my heel. It may be that for me the other things I do have prepared my calves and ankles just fine, but the more consistent midfoot stride hit my less prepared glutes more. But yeah, a good soreness of knowing that you’ve shocked your muscles some, which is always the goal of those of us committed to committing to no particular exercise or routine. Tomorrow I may try to fit in a longer run …
Okay, didn’t read the whole linked article. But THIS appears to support that they had trouble only when they went back to “real” shoes, not while wearing flipflops.
Oh Cisco, thanks for the link on the shoes, but even for cheap ones I like to try on first. For the NB MT100’s for example, I had to move a whole size higher than my usual to have the right fit.
This may also interest you. The gist is that for the same amount of energy burned by the subject (“internal work” in the terms of the article) fore foot strikers (FFS) accomplished more movement (“external and mechanical work”) than do rear foot strikers (RFS).
The articles often mention stored elastic energy as the reason for this potential increased efficiency of the mid foot strike but I wonder if some doesn’t just have to do with body position. Walking and running are, afterall, ultimately just (to steal from Buzz Lightyear) “falling … with style”. When I think about it a rear foot strike has a body spending energy pulling itself over the heel down to mid foot and then up on the forefoot again before it falls forward anew - much of the energy of that fall is then lost to the ground rather than converted into forward momentum and energy is used to create a new fall forward each strike. In a mid foot strike the center of mass, by necessity, is more forward at the time of foot strike, more of the energy of the body’s fall is converted to horizontal forward motion without having to pull it over the heel to get to the fore foot - IOW instead of creating a new falling forward each stride, a mid foot strike keeps the body in one long controlled fall forward just constantly nudging it on.
I imagine that the various other issues involved in having worn out shoes would surface long before issues of foot positioning or whatever. For example, the extreme annoyance of not having a completely smooth surface to rest your foot on. Even relatively small tears in the fabric bother me much more than any issue of how much padding there is. Or asymmetry in the wear.
No, it says it’s what caught their attention, such that they further studied how you’re actually walking when you’re wearing flip-flops. That kind of soreness can easily be from underused muscles, which I think is the point.
Today I did a 12 mile run in the minimalist shoes. In terms of getting me to use a mid foot strike and shorter stride - success. During the last run I was thinking about each footfall; this one had those periods of zoning out with mind drifting and then becoming aware of how my strike was while doing that - it had stayed mid foot. And also a success in term of no knee pain at mile eleven, which I normally get. Also no calf or foot pain but we’ll see how I feel tomorrow morning. Will it make me faster? I doubt it. But it will allow me to run longer than 11 miles when I want to without worrying about my knee acting up and that’s enough for me. (Somehow I still doubt that I “glide” like those I envy though.)
BTW, what’s the concept behind having the individual toes in the VFF? Really, is there any advantage to that over an aqua sock? Even theoretically?
Remember that VFFs weren’t designed for running-- they were actually designed for yachting. And I think their best application is probably parkour. I got mine today, though, and will be trying them out and reporting back over the next few days.
What I like about the toes-holders: they allow for full range of motion (I like to spread my toes way out and I have a square foot when I do so, isn’t comfy in swim shoes) and gripping while still providing protection for my soles and the tips of my toes; and my feet don’t move around in them at all. I really hate the sensation of my feet sliding and my toes jamming up against the fronts of hard footwear. They’re unlike all other footwear I’ve tried in this way.
I don’t usually wear my VFF for running - mostly for clambering over slippery rocks. Not that they’re not good for running, but since I do it on cement if I need footwear I might as well stick to home-made huraches which aren’t $80, and save the soles of my VFF for adventures.
-After trying 4 pairs, I’m sure that they don’t make a pair that fits me well. Ones big enough in the toe area are far too big in the heel.
-They’re not nearly as comfortable as they look. Maybe that will change after I get used to them.
-This picture has got to be photoshopped, because I can’t even get close to fitting my fingers between the toes.
-There’s nothing here, as I suspected, that justifies an $85 price tag. Some competitor is going to start cranking these out for half that and blow VFFs off the map.
I’m grateful I got these as a gift, and will keep trying to break them in and find useful applications for them, but I’m glad I didn’t buy a pair.
The first size that wasn’t painfully small in the toes was a men’s 46. I don’t think they make women’s sizes that big. And what could the sizing charts possibly tell me that actually trying on the shoes couldn’t? (And by the way, I have looked at them.)
Isn’t that what I said?
Other than a [very] slight case of Morton’s toe, though (maybe 2mm), I think I have pretty normally shaped feet.
Out of curiosity, do you remember where? Everything I’ve seen was sailing/climbing.
They don’t use typical sizing, so if you weren’t aware of how they do size their shoes, it could have been useful information for directing you to a size that might fit better.
No, you just said they weren’t as comfortable as they looked. I just wanted to share that it’s not a universal experience.
I’m guessing that one of the biggest issues with VFFs is that they’re so fitted that anybody who deviates too much from the pattern they’ve used for any given size is going to find them uncomfortable, if not impossible to put on (in the cases of people with things like syndactyly).
It was almost certainly either in Born to Run or on the internet. There’s a very slight chance it was in something like Men’s Journal or Men’s Health. The reason I’m :dubious: about climbing is that I have some friends who climb, and I know specialized climbing shoes are both better suited for the job and usually cheaper. I’m :dubious: about “light trekking” because the story I read had the makers completely clueless about “barefooting” or minimalist running/walking. They were simply made to do one thing and one thing only, and that was to grip the deck of a sailboat really well. Users “hacked” them for other purposes, they realized there was a much larger market for these than they realized, and they retconned their own origin story. And, hey, maybe that’s wrong. I honestly cannot remember where I read that, but I didn’t dream it up.
Yeah, I don’t think they were for climbing-climbing as much as scrambling-around-over-boulders-climbing. That’s my impression by the way things were phrased, anyway.
Please let us know how you like them with use. Meanwhile I am glad that I went with the less out there NB MT100s. Though I did buy a few pair of five toed socks and I really do like those!
I literally just now took them off after wearing them all day. Ups and downs so far. They do feel nice to walk in, especially over “interesting” surfaces.
I just recently watched a TV programme where in passing they cited a doctor of medicine who discovered barefoot running when looking at injury rates. They referenced the (already mentioned) hi-speed cameras and difference in impact between heel-first strike and flat-foot strike (additionally with smaller strides) which lessens impact. The doctor has been running barefoot for several years on city streets (I don’t know how he deals with cold feet - most times I would get cold feet walking barefoot, plus all the glass shards you might find in a city).
(I don’t know if I can find the German TV report, it will take some time)
However, my personal advice (IAMNAD) about this is: from what’s been posted so far, evidence is thin because proper studies are just starting. Plus, if the difference is also a different running method, people need time to learn this technique, so putting the same athlete on a treadmill once with shoes, once without in the span of 10 min. is not a good result.
Additionally, in medicine/ human body, you have to remember how many variables are there. Even if there is a study that shows that 80% of people do benefit from barefoot running, that doesn’t help you personally, because only if you try it can you find out if you are one of the 80% or one of the 20% who don’t. (Or vice versa!)
Therefore, with summer around, I would take the time to try it out, bearing in mind to take it slow both to build up underused calf muscles and the calluses on the sole of the feet, and to learn the different technique. Also, to listen to your body - if there is serious pain, not muscle soreness, you might have a medical condition that is getting worse. An orthopedist would be good to see for that.
For what it’s worth, my own orthopedist, along with the main opinion now, has advised me to walk barefoot (which is a different thing in terms of technique) as much as possible to counter my flat-foot tendency. In the 70s and 80s, standard method of treatment were supports of the arch; now, the doctors recommend barefoot walking as much as possible, because that strenghtens the ankle muscles and tendons, preventing flat foot in the first place, where the modern firm shoes give too much support, leading to muscle loss. So this goes into a similar direction.
Almost a week now wearing the VFFs. I really like the feel of walking around in them. I’ve found myself unconsciously choosing them over normal shoes almost every time I’ve left the house. I kind of liked running in them, but I got a blister. I don’t really like all the looks and comments I get. I’m not a big grump about it or anything but it gets old. Still disappointed that I had to get a pair so big in the heels just so they’d fit in the toes. I mean I’m 6’4, 190lbs. Not the bodytype that makes you think “fat toes.”
