Bill O'Reilly, they should have fed you some of Shug Avery's pee

The BBQ Pit
61

[QUOTE=Wee Bairn]
Billdo couldn’t get over the fact that other people can’t get over the fact? To quote Jerry Seinfeld, “who arrre these people”? Where has even the most die hard racist opined that no black adults are not capable of civility in public? Isn’t that what you call a straw man argument? If this is the opinion of those with Bill’s ear, what does that say about him? I know some die hard racists, but none of them would have this opinion on the subject.
[/QUOTE]

Great god in a cardboard box, what DO you people smoke on this board??
Jesus H. Christ on a fucking pogo stick…
ALL I was saying was that Media Matters cherry-picked and edited what Bill said. I then provided an example of WHY it was nowhere NEAR as “offensive” as MM tried to make it, and ALL you can do is come back with “that’s a strawman” and “who are ‘these’ people”?? And then you move to, “If that’s what Bill’s audience REALLY thinks…”
Nobody said ANY of that…
Bill was making a case about society at large and stereotypes, and the (possible, but not necessarily proven) negative impact of persons he believe perpetuate those race stereotypes, namely, rappers, etc. His “beef” with rap music and rap culture is well-documented and has been a “staple” of his for as long as I can remember, and I don’t even follow the guy’s programs.
Get over yourselves, people. Just because you don’t like the guy, or don’t like what he has to say most of the time, doesn’t mean that MM is RIGHT on this one, just because Bill-O has a track record that you don’t like. Find a LEGITIMATE thing to complain about, you bunch of middle-school-mental-giants.

62

[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic]
It’s a load of crap that any significant number of white Americans think this way. Bildo was projecting.
[/QUOTE]

Dio, get off your reverse-racist high-horse you holier-than-thou racist jackass. I’m sick of your schtick. Nobody can say anything about “race” without you jumping in, you reverse-racist prick.

63

[QUOTE=DirkGntly]
Dio, get off your reverse-racist high-horse you holier-than-thou racist jackass. I’m sick of your schtick. Nobody can say anything about “race” without you jumping in, you reverse-racist prick.
[/QUOTE]

What the fuck is a “reverse-racist?”

64

[QUOTE=DirkGntly]
Great god in a cardboard box, what DO you people smoke on this board??
Jesus H. Christ on a fucking pogo stick…
ALL I was saying was that Media Matters cherry-picked and edited what Bill said.
[/quote]

No they didn’t.

Your apology failed. At best the defense only boils down to an assertion that Bill was only saying that most other white people are racist morons, which is just as stupid. I’ll make it simple for you. If Billo was surprised that aa restaurant in Harlem was not filled with “craziness,” then he is a racist and a moron. If he’s only saying that he thinks that “White America” would be surprised but not him personally, then he’s still a moron. He’s either a racist or he’s calling the rest of white America racist. Take your pick.

65

[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic]
No they didn’t.

Your apology failed. At best the defense only boils down to an assertion that Bill was only saying that most other white people are racist morons, which is just as stupid. I’ll make it simple for you. If Billo was surprised that aa restaurant in Harlem was not filled with “craziness,” then he is a racist and a moron. If he’s only saying that he thinks that “White America” would be surprised but not him personally, then he’s still a moron. He’s either a racist or he’s calling the rest of white America racist. Take your pick.
[/QUOTE]

I’m not sure he was even saying MOST of white America sees things this way. I think he was saying he doesn’t understand how SOME of America can still see things this way, UNLESS those persons are looking through a “rap-culture-filter.” Going back, again, to his own personal “crusade” against what he perceives as “rap culture” and how it, in his mind, engenders negative stereotypes in SOME of “white America.”

66

[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic]
What the fuck is a “reverse-racist?”
[/QUOTE]

You’re right…poor word-choice…

It’s probably more accurate to use “race-baiter” similar to SOME of what J. Jackson and A. Sharpton have to say. (Note I did not say ALL of what they had to say…but to say that they do NOT engage in some “race-baiting,” or at the very least picking and choosing “causes” that perpetuate race tensions would be disengenious. Race tension is something these guys NEED - it’s how they make their livelihood.)
Regardless, your “schtick” is to jump in and “stick it to whitey” no matter what the actual merits of the “racist” accusation being made may actually have - and it’s really, really, really old.

67

[QUOTE=DirkGntly]
Great god in a cardboard box, what DO you people smoke on this board??
Jesus H. Christ on a fucking pogo stick…

[/QUOTE]

It’s our fault. If we hadn’t jumped in, a few more “Yeah really LOL” caliber posts would have been added to the echo chamber and the thread would have died.

68

Caliber… chamber… died… are you threatening us?

69

[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic]
What does he celebrate that’s immoral?

[/QUOTE]

Have you listened to Ludacris and his peers or is this an attempt to annoy by being obtuse?

[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic]

I think Bill O’Reilly advocates far more immoral ideas than Ludacris does.

[/QUOTE]

Umm-hmm.

[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic]

I have no idea what you think any of this means. Could you say it again in English? What do you mean by “singling out blacks” to talk about “alleged oppression?” (You really think it’s all merely “alleged?) What are the “statistical and demographic issues of black vs white behavior,” and what the fuck does any of that have to do with Bill O’Reilly being an insulting prick who presumes to lecture black folks on how they need to act?”
[/QUOTE]

Let me try again. According to PC canon, it’s fine to refer to blacks as a separate community when you refer to a perceived or real injustice. However, you are not allowed to refer to them as a collective community when you talk about negative behavior like illegitimate birthrates, incarceration rates, homicide rates or any other negative statistic. If you do that, you are condemned as a racist and commanded to refer to them as individuals.

What it has to do with O’Reilly is that he dared to speak about blacks at all when there are people out there hanging on his every word in an attempt to misrepresent them.

70

[QUOTE=Vinyl Turnip]
Caliber… chamber… died… are you threatening us?
[/QUOTE]

Yes. I’m to the right of Russ Feingold. Fear me.

71

OK, I have been walking by this repeatedly, avoiding it (much like the box of donuts in the break room). However, my self-control is now gone.

I ask:

Take Bill out of the equation. Replace the name with a generic white dude who happens to go to Harlem on a whim and eat at Sylvia’s.

Now, for a shit load of white America, there is minimal daily interaction with many blacks. There might be one in their company. There might be 1-2 that they see on a daily basis, if that. That means that their ENTIRE perception of black America is based on media. Now, what does media give them?

Musicians (the rap singers who show a certain style of interaction)
Sports stars (can be good or bad - with Vick right now it is bad)
Katrina victims (again, can be spun in a couple of ways according on what channel you watch)
LA style rioters (not been in the media for awhile I admit)
Comedy performers.

NONE of this is an accurate depiction. HOWEVER, it IS the majority of the imagery that many whites are exposed to.

Now, we take this generic white. We pretend that he is not very eloquent. We ask him about eating at Sylvias. He responds much in the way of Bill. We can now do two things:

  1. Say, “Yep, ain’t those stereotypes a load of horseshit!”
    or
  2. Say, “You ignorant racist fuck, even though you have just admitted that the stereotype was wrong, for even admitting that it existed we are going to crucify you!”

One of those will help bring someone along the path of enlightenment. The other will send them further down the path of joining the Klan.

72

[QUOTE=Evil One]
Yes. I’m to the right of Russ Feingold.
[/QUOTE]

Ah. That would explain the slogan and arrow on his t-shirt.

73

[QUOTE=An Arky]
Heck, I had a kind of strange experience going to a “soul kitchen” in DC right after I moved here…I thought that it was going to be a different experience, but upon looking at the menu, and especially after eating, I found that, being a country boy from Arkansas, the food was exactly the same as what I grew up on in my lily-white family. At first I was surprised, then after a few minutes, I was all . Duh! Soul food = Southern food.
[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=pizzabrat]
I’m glad you’re acting so glib about that revelation; it’s really not as “duh” to most people as it should be, though. “Soul food” is just one of the many BS racial concepts to come out of the post-Civil Rights era.
[/QUOTE]

I’m sorry that sounded glib…there’s really no good way to express the sentiment.

I didn’t have a revelation, per se, that black folks and white folks from the south eat the same things; more that up here, my suburban yankee white friends thought of it as “soul food”, something exotic and different, when it wasn’t at all that way to me. Then a lot of things kind of clicked for me…like, hey, the food’s the same, the attitude is the same (more laid back), the concept of using humor liberally in everyday conversation, the sit and shoot the shit awhile before getting down to business, etc. was all the same as what I knew growing up.

It took being surrounded by suburban white yankees to realize that I had more in common, in many respects, with blacks than with suburban white yankees. Yeah, it was a duh! thing, but it really changed the way I thought about things, for the better, IMHO. Don’t know where I’m going with this, exactly, just wanted to clarify a bit. And I think O’Reilly’s a total dick, FWIW…

Again, I don’t mean in any way to sound untoward… :o

74

[QUOTE=Evil One]
Let me try again. According to PC canon, it’s fine to refer to blacks as a separate community when you refer to a perceived or real injustice. However, you are not allowed to refer to them as a collective community when you talk about negative behavior like illegitimate birthrates, incarceration rates. homicide rates or any other negative statistic. If you do that, you are condemned as a racist and commanded to refer to them as individuals.
[/QUOTE]
And is this really a headscratcher for you? You must be a stupid fuck.

Even Bill O’Reilly, in the audio clip that is the subject of this discussion, acknowledged that it’s likely every single black person in America has experienced some hostility based on the color of their skin alone. So yeah, it makes sense to talk about discrimination against a group, rather than against an individual. (Apart from that, now that I think more about your position here, it makes no sense to suggest that people are prejudiced, when they are, against the individual independently of the group. How would that even work? Or are you suggesting that lynching victims brought that shit on themselves?) Black people are prejudiced against because they are black.

But yeah, if you turn it around and say “black people commit homicide because they are black,” yeah, you are a stupid racist fuck.

You still don’t seem to get what might be the problem with O’Reilly feeling that he needs to tell black people that rap music condones undesirable behavior.

Finally, I cannot resolve the backpedalling position that O’Reilly was talking about the biogtry of the unwashed white masses, and not himself, when he said “I couldn’t get over the fact that there was no difference between Sylvia’s restaurant and any other restaurant in New York City. I mean, it was exactly the same, even though it’s run by blacks.”

He’s not saying, “people would be surprised.” He’s saying “I couldn’t get over” it. Where’s the attribution of this surprise and amazement to the other racist Americans?

If I don’t get my mutha fuckin iced tea, y’all gonna make me lose my cool up in here.

75

[QUOTE=Algher]
OK, I have been walking by this repeatedly, avoiding it (much like the box of donuts in the break room). However, my self-control is now gone.

I ask:

Take Bill out of the equation. Replace the name with a generic white dude who happens to go to Harlem on a whim and eat at Sylvia’s.

Now, for a shit load of white America, there is minimal daily interaction with many blacks. There might be one in their company. There might be 1-2 that they see on a daily basis, if that. That means that their ENTIRE perception of black America is based on media. Now, what does media give them?

Musicians (the rap singers who show a certain style of interaction)
Sports stars (can be good or bad - with Vick right now it is bad)
Katrina victims (again, can be spun in a couple of ways according on what channel you watch)
LA style rioters (not been in the media for awhile I admit)
Comedy performers.

NONE of this is an accurate depiction. HOWEVER, it IS the majority of the imagery that many whites are exposed to.

Now, we take this generic white. We pretend that he is not very eloquent. We ask him about eating at Sylvias. He responds much in the way of Bill. We can now do two things:

  1. Say, “Yep, ain’t those stereotypes a load of horseshit!”
    or
  2. Say, “You ignorant racist fuck, even though you have just admitted that the stereotype was wrong, for even admitting that it existed we are going to crucify you!”

One of those will help bring someone along the path of enlightenment. The other will send them further down the path of joining the Klan.
[/QUOTE]

Come on, Bill O’Reilly is no Joe Smalltown who’s been living in Bumfuck so long he’s only seen one or two Real Life Black People. I’m convinced he was making a joke predicated on the fact that these stereotypes exist. “Why, I didn’t see one single person in the restaurant with a bone in their nose, ain’t that a hoot?”

76

[QUOTE=Vinyl Turnip]
Ah. That would explain the slogan and arrow on his t-shirt.
[/QUOTE]

Good one!

77

[QUOTE=An Arky]
I’m sorry that sounded glib…there’s really no good way to express the sentiment.
[/QUOTE]
I wasn’t being sarcastic - I was really glad. I didn’t mean “glib” pejoratively.

78

[QUOTE=Evil One]
Have you listened to Ludacris and his peers or is this an attempt to annoy by being obtuse?
[/QUOTE]

I’ve never really listened to any Ludacris, but I am interested in cultivating a greater understanding of hip hop and rap. What albums by Ludacris would you recommend I listen to? What’s most representative of his music? What’s his most popular album? What’s his best album, in your opinion? Any singles I should seek out in particular?

Thanks in advance for sharing your expertise.

79

Jesus, this is not 1947- there are tons of black people in Iowa in for Chrissakes. Even if you personally don’t associate with blacks, you have definitely seen them in stores, schools, churches, etc., not acting like savages or gangsters. This is NOT a relevation to anyone but Bill and his ilk, trust me. And agree, the bullshit that he was referring to other people was made up after the shit hit the fan. In his Archie Bunker sort of way, he thought he was paying blacks a compliment.

80

[QUOTE=Miller]
I’ve never really listened to any Ludacris, but I am interested in cultivating a greater understanding of hip hop and rap. What albums by Ludacris would you recommend I listen to? What’s most representative of his music? What’s his most popular album? What’s his best album, in your opinion? Any singles I should seek out in particular?

Thanks in advance for sharing your expertise.
[/QUOTE]

Information on the five albums (so far) by Ludacris can be found here..

Your painfully obvious point that I am not a fan of his is correct. I chose a “song” at random for a lyrics example. The full lyrics of “Move Bitch” can be found here.

Here are some highlights:

“I’ve been drankin’ and bustin’ two
and I been thankin’ of bustin’ you
Upside ya motherfuckin’ forehead”

“I’m doin’ a hundred on the highway
So if you do the speed limit, get the FUCK outta my way
I’m D.U.I., hardly ever caught sober
and you about to get ran the FUCK over”

“Grab ya four, start a fight dog, ruin the party
So move bitch, get out the way hoe
All you faggot motherfuckers make way for 2-0”.

Pure poetry.