British television scheduling

Factual Questions
21

Worrying as it sounds I can just make sense of that scheduling:

The game show is for the afternoon teevee set (the grannies, etc) after which the schedule switches to kids programming as they come home from school. I’d guess you then flicked channels to BBC2 where you can find all sorts of weird and wonderful programmes at odd times of the day. The educational stuff is generally tied in with another strange but successful Brit concept; (as you rightly identify) The Open University – poke that phrase into Google and you’ll discover adult distance learning is an old, old concept.

22

Someone, somewhere is going to pay for any news program you get, with the likely candidates being either state or business. Either one of them will, in turn, have raised that money from the viewing public. Either of them has an interest in influencing the viewing public.

The British system has two fairly good advantages. The first is that the Beeb has become a national instituion that is protected from government interference not just by charter, but by a massive degree of public fondness for the old dear. As London_Calling points out, even Thatcher received a rough time when she tried to interfere with it.

The second thing to point out is that it isn’t the only news source. There’s two commercially funded stations, and one partially commercial/partially national funded station, all producing their own news broadcasts. Then, on satellite and cable, there’s sky, CNN, and a bunch of other world news channels. Even if the state should interfere with the state sponsored stations, all that would happen is the viewing public would switch to another channel.

On the plus side, as the BBC is under less pressure to produce news that’s ratings friendly, it has (in my opinion) a lesser tendency to dumb down the news to the extent that CNN or MSNBC does.

23

Hint: check the date on the last credit at the end of each episode. I am pretty sure the whole lot spanned several years. Each series would originaly have been shown as a seperate entity, one episode per week. It would have been unusual to repeat the preceeding series right before the new one, though the trend now seems to be to repeat it, then have a short gap before the new one.

24

You found OU programming in the middle of the day? I’m amazed – usually it’s on in the middle of the night (for people to set their VCRs to). Daytime TV in the UK is just as inane as daytime TV in the US.

One thing that took me a while to get used to was the odd times programs were shown. While Channel 5 has adopted a “stripped” format where shows appear in the same timeslot each week and start on the hour/half-hour, the other channels often run programs that begin and end at other times (5 minutes past the hour, 20 minutes to, etc.). It takes some getting used to.

In addition, some weekly programs get moved around from week to week (as Channel 4 recently demonstrated by moving “West Wing” later and later each week – I like the show, but who wants to stay up until 1am to watch it?). Fortunately, I pretty much just watch whatever is on at the time, so I don’t get too stressed about when things are shown.

25

Jr8 – It has changed in recent years. He was talking about “several years ago”.
Just to refute a popular misconception:

I think it’s important to understand no ‘teevee’ is free to air – companies aren’t going to take (what they pay for advertising their products on teevee) out of their existing profits because no investor would stand for such a reduction in dividend or profit. The advertising money comes from additional profit, the bit we don’t think about when we’re at the supermarket.

The last time I looked at the relative income levels of the BBC and commercial teevee, the latter main channel had an income (from advertising revenue) of 1 ½ times that of the BBC. With that they provided a much more limited service (quality being a question of taste but enjoying similar teevee ratings) and also provided their own investors with a healthy profit margin.

What the BBC does it take the money directly and any profit from sales of programmes and books, etc. gets ploughed back into the system without any need to satisfy investors (beyond the public – as ‘investors’ - acceptance of the broadcasting).

26

Gary and London:
Thanks for the responses. Your opinions on the matter are more important to me than charters and agreements - I was curious about how you British folks perceive the reality. As the Germans say, “Paper is patient.” The charter exists, and the people perceive it as being followed. To me this means that it most likely really is being kept. Thanks again.

Mort Furd

27

The freedom from government interference over the BBC was established very early on its it’s history. In 1926 , before it was a public corporation ,(when the BBC was a private company owned by the radio-set manufacters) the government ,in the shape of Home Secetary Winston Churchill,
tried to use the BBC to break the General Strike. The Head of the company ,Reith, told the government in no uncertain terms that he was no government tool and he would broadcast what he liked. He even let the strikers have their say. After that the BBC was left well alone. I think Churchill tried the same trick in WW2 and he got the same answer.

28

I now submit my WAG that there is a thriving illicit business in the UK for techie types who remove this thing from tv sets.

29

Any unit that receives a signal emits a little signal, too. It’s the nature of the beast.
Call it a licensing fee if you want. It is a tax, and it will be collected with the zeal almost any state anywhere collects taxes.

Nemo referred to Blackadder. I recall when the Sherlock Holmes series starring the late Jeremy Brett was picked up by PBS. The show was an instant hit (at least, by Public Broadcasting standards). In a short time PBS burned through a couple of years of BBC product. When the latest Sherlock Holmes series started we discovered that there would be 13 programs. At the time we were told that on the BBC 13 programs were a “Season.”

30

Well, no. You can’t remove the local oscillator. It is a normal part of the circuitry of the receiver. It is not something that is added in to just to track the TVs. Every radio and TV every where in the world has a local oscillator. Take out the LO, and you haven’t got a receiver anymore.

31

Sherlock Holmes was not a BBC production. The series was made by an ITV company (I think Granada or Thames). Don’t forget that there other TV stations in Britain besides the BBC.

32

To illustrate the variety in scheduling, here are some excerpts from next Monday evening. Not all of these are consecutive, but notice how they don’t all start on the hour/half hour. Taken from the Radio Times (the italicised words are mine):

BBC1
7.00 The Horror of…
Third of five programmes in which David Schneider takes a light-hearted look at the gruesome horrors of life’s stages…
8.00 EastEnders
(Soap, just increased to four editions per week including an ‘omnibus’ on Sunday that gives an abridged rerun of the previous week’s episodes – this show is only likely to end the day after they abolish the tax on snowmobiles in Hell)
8.30 Mersey Beat
Continuing the ten-part police drama series… (No.5 of 10)
10.35 Hot Wax
Fashion. Ruby Wax hits Paris for Fashion Week, … (No.3? of 6, this was replaced last week by the World Athletics Championships from Edmonton, Canada.)
11.05 Parkinson
This fourth of ten repeats from the series shown earlier this year features comedian Victoria Wood… (talk show, don’t know if there’s a new series planned)

BBC2
7.10 Conquistadors
The second of the four-part series in which historian Michael Wood charts the Spanish conquest of the New World. (This is from last week’s schedule – this week it’s replaced by action from the World Athletics.)
8.00 University Challenge
(Our version of your College Bowl, No.4 of 27 IIRC – 12 first round games, 8 second, 4 quarter-finals, 2 semi-finals + final)
8.30 What the Romans Did for Us
Penultimate episode of the repeated six-part series. (repeat only – they don’t have another series planned as far as I can tell)
9.00 Have I Got News for You
(Satirical/comedy news quiz, this edition was No.8 of 8 when originally broadcast, but they may be playing them out of sequence. The last series ended in June – another will begin in the autumn. There have been 21 series of this show, most have had 8 episodes, but three had 10 and one had 9!)
9.30 The Office
Penultimate episode of the comedy set in the Slough branch of a paper merchants. (No.5 of 6, and very funny IMHO)
11.20 Islam: Empire of Faith
The first in a new three-part series, being shown on consequitive nights…

ITV1
7.00 Emmerdale
(Soap, five nights a week Mon to Fri)
7.30 Coronation Street
(Soap, recently increased to four nights per week incl. Sunday – this show has already been running for over 40 years!)
8.30 The Darling Buds of May
(Rerun of) The third series of the comedy drama, first shown in 1993… (No.3 of 6. Catherine Zeta Jones played one of the main characters but isn’t even credited in the magazine!)
9.30 Take Me
Fourth of a six-part thriller. (This began with a double episode last Sunday followed by No.3 a day later)

Some other shows listed are also series but I don’t know how many editions there will be. So as you can see, the start/finish and duration of series are very variable and subject to interruption by special events – especially sports events. Our TV year is not evenly divided into 13-week seasons, even the on the commercial channels.

33

i love british tv!

i mean, you get all the good US stuff (star trek, B-5, Malcolm in the middle, friends, the west wing, simpsons etc) without all the crap. lovely old films on channel 4 during the day, and education at 3 in the morning on BBC2 with the OU.

to be fair you also get strange “local variations”, such as the diabolical Town Challenge in northern ireland (2 towns run around on bouncy castles etc. and get covered in gunge for the prize of a t-shirt or something), which make you feel like tearing out you hair and screaming.

the news is generally fair and even handed, and you can choose, the establishment BBC, tabloidesque ITV or faintly socialist Channel 4…or if you want torture Channel 5.

Channel 5 shows wall-to-wall made for tv or straight-to-video movies, sunset beach and the bold and the beautiful…it did a memorable all nude adventure game show…and showed “Emmanuelle” as the christmas movie.

irish TV is great too…but i’ll save that hijack for another time.

By the way, the BBC saves money by repeating shows constantly. we get Dad’s army, Porridge, Monty Python, Blackadder, One foot in the grave, Fawlty Towers, Ab-Fab, Last of the summer wine et al, at regular intervals.

also, we get more violence, sex, nudity and swearing and more “adult themes” than most american networks would be happy with.

as a note, over 65’s don’t pay for their TV licences. as my 86 year old grandmother lives with us, our licence is in her name, hence, no licence fee.
what a slogan
“free tv - adopt a pensioner!”

34

This reminds me of a comment I heard recently, namely that British TV channels generally have a stronger ‘brand identity’ than in other countries – you know roughly the sort of program to expect on each channel. Would any other Dopers agree/disagree with that?

Bring it on! I’m ashamed to admit that I know nothing of Irish TV other than the occasional imports like The Late, Late Show.

I agree. This causes arguments all of its own, of course. There is a ‘gentlemen’s agreement’ that adult-oriented programming should be kept until after 9.00pm but you still get people who use the TV as a baby-sitter whining about swearing and bare bums at 9.05. I’m tempted to open a whole new thread about that.

As previously posted, the cut-off age is 75 at this point. Maybe your gran should have charge of the remote control? ;).

35

my gran has her own tv. you think we live in the dark ages here?
seriously, you DO know that

BBC 1 is:
costume drama, Eastenders, Neighbours and whatever else happens to be on.

BBC 2 is :
Documentaries, Newsnight, OU, alternative comedy (League of Gentlemen etc), star trek, Lifestyle programmes and the Simpsons.

ITV is :
Corrie, Emmerdale, Greg and Dharma, Family Fortunes and Supermarket sweep.

Channel 4 is:
Horse racing, Watercolour challenge (3 people painting a picture and the winner gets some paints, cult viewing for students…judge for yourselves the weirdness), frasier, west wing, friends, 80 raves around the world, Bollywood movies and anything mildly offensive

Channel 5 is:
Terrible reception, terrible programmes. Bad US soaps, soft porn, a documentary about wifeswapping, anything channel 4 won’t show, a bad made-4-tv movie (preferably with lots of sex and nudity)

36

If by sort you mean genre, then broadly no. All five channels carry dramas, game shows, sitcoms, documentaries, films, news etc. What is different is the relative proportions of these and when they’ll be on. Game shows on BBC2 (e.g. The Weakest Link) and Channel 4 tend to be shown late afternoon/early evening. On BBC1 and ITV, their equivalents would be in a main evening slot. These two channels often carry feature films starting at 8 or 9 pm, but BBC2 rarely does. It shows its films in the afternoon and late at night. ITV rarely shows serious documentaries these days and when they do they’ll be on late.

There are exceptions. Thus BBC2 doesn’t have a soap. And only it and Channel 4 are likely ever to screen classical music concerts. And I suspect BBC1, ITV and Channel 5 have never run a foreign language film between the three of them.

This is a consequence of the fact that there are differencies in the channels’ style/level/target audience. Thus what they’ll run in prime time tends to reflect this. The other patterns follow from this.

Myself, my tastes run to serious documentaries, good comedy and current affairs and most of what I watch is in primetime. I therefore regularly watch BBC2 and Channel 4, BBC1 occasionally, ITV rarely and Channel 5 once or twice.

37

I’d agree with all your comments bonzer (including the final paragraph), but I wish I could remember the source of the comment I quoted. I think it was a group of TV execs and journalists late on BBC2 (so you get the picture), but they were comparing British channels with overseas ones. I was hoping for replies from Dopers with experience of watching TV in more than one country.

My own experience is limited - I don’t tend to watch TV when I’m abroad - although I’d say French TV roughly resembles our own, both in terms of overall quality and scope/predictabilty of channels. In Holland and Belgium I’ve only watched BBC (for sport). Danish and South African are barely watchable.

The trend to channel branding seems to be more prevalent on cable/satellite.

38

true, true, but i’m pointing out the broad classifications here.

as to irish tv.
4 channels.
RTE 1
think BBC 1

RTE 2
BBC 2 clone

TV3
cross between BBC 2 and Channel 4

the piece de resistance is TG4…the irish language channel.

it is, to say the least, bizarre.

argentinian film dubbed into irish, with english subtitles anyone?

a documentary about new zealand body builders dubbed into irish, any takers?

a 2 hour documentary about the cult of St Brigid having it’s roots in ancient mother goddess worship, in irish, without subtitles? no?

still not tempted? what about “Survivor” dubbed into irish?

the best programe on irish television has to be Wanderlust.
it’s a dating game on acid. the contestants compete in the studio, and then go on a date in some exotic location. they get drunk, go clubbing and have sex. and basically, anything goes. including gay and lesbian dates…not very Cilla Black.

the TG4 version of the dating game has kids from the Gealtacht trying to look proud to speak irish,and failing because they’re terrifed as the poor contestant’s mother is choosing their dating partner. and the location is somewhere glamourous…like Donegal.

39

Jeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeezzzus!