Building peace between the Jordan River and Mediterranean Sea

I haven’t been able to find an official BDS position on the number(s) of sovereign states that they would accept as part of the achievement of their goals. (As a movement, BDS isn’t entirely monolithic, which further confuses the issue.) Those goals are, AFAICT, the ending of the occupation of the territories, the removal of the separation border, full equality for Jewish and non-Jewish Israelis, and Palestinian refugee right of return. AFAICT those conditions could exist in the context of either two separate sovereign states, or a single bi-national state, or a single-state democracy without official categories for Jews and Palestinians as national entities.

To what extent any of those hypothetical contexts and/or any of the specified BDS aims is realistically possible, of course, is another matter. So again, it’s hard to see where this fits in the category of “building peace” per se.

I’s the very nebulousness of their goals that lets them claim that they’re in favor of whatever the listener wants them to be in favor of. The only thing we know for sure about BDS is that they don’t like Israel. Disliking Israel may be a commonly-held belief, but it is not a belief that in and of itself has contributed much to the cause of peace.

Peace means compromise. You can’t get everything you want and still have peace.

:dubious: They seem to be pretty consistent about not liking Palestinian suffering. I would never claim that there is no anti-Semitism whatever in the BDS movement (or in pretty much anything else, for that matter), but I think it’s unfair to insinuate that they have no genuine concern for Palestinian rights.

However, none of this is specifically addressing the OP’s question about who is building peace.

The same thing needs to happen there that happened in Northern Ireland. The fight in Northern Ireland between the Catholics and the Protestants never went away - Catholicism and Protestantism (as significant components of people’s lives) went away.

When Judaism and Islam have essentially disappeared from the area in question, there will be room for peace. Currently, religious demands from both sides are what is really stalling the process. If you don’t believe me, go and offer to the Israelis a new luxurious and much more spacious area of prime land to call home, remote from their current location. Offer the state 10 billion dollars a year in compensation. They won’t go.

Of course we wouldn’t - we’ve put a lot of time and effort in this place, and managed to turn it into a pretty awesome country. We’re not going to start again from scratch.

But as usual, you’re overstating the importance of religion to the conflict. Remember, Israel was founded by atheist Jews, and many Palestinian leaders have been Christians. The conflict is about nationalism, not religion (although I agree that it would be nice if religion stopped butting in and making things worse).

They may have concerns, but they don’t offer any solution more constructive than “fuck Israel”.

But I agree. We’re digressing.