[QUOTE=Colophon]
Because the UK government imposes a huge tax* on vehicle fuel. They claim it is to discourage people from driving and get them onto public transport; an argument which would hold more water were public transport less comprehensively shit.
: : :
This is why I now commute by bicycle.
[/QUOTE]
So…their cunning plan is working?
[QUOTE=Colophon]
Currently 50.35 pence per litre, or almost exactly $1. And then 17.5% VAT is added to the total cost of the fuel including tax, so something like 70% of the pump price is actually tax.
[/QUOTE]
At least these days they’re nice enough to evaporate off the tax before you pump it. Before they did that my car only went about 10 miles between fill-ups, and it was hell getting all the burnt-on tax out of the carburettor.
[QUOTE=control-z]
-Income tax. Jumpin’ Jesus on a pogo stick, why the fuck is this shit so complicated? The math isn’t bad, but the rules sure are. If I make $40,000 a year, tax me 20% (or whatever, hopefully more like 10 or 15%) and leave me the fuck alone. If I make $100,000 a year, tax me 20%. If I make $10,000, tax me 20%. Doesn’t matter whether I’m self employed, am a farmer or a fisherman, had alimony payments or whatever, just tax me on what I earn and everyone will know exactly what to expect. See how simple that is?
[/QUOTE]
(Bolding mine.)
This is a red herring. Figuring out the tax rate is simple, just one line on the form. It’s that bolded phrase that’s the killer. The most complicated part of figuring your income tax, about half the form, is figuring out how much money you “made” during the year. What with salary, tips, interest, capital gains, farm income, minus deductions, expenses, etc. They could change to a 20% tax and not change the forms one bit. They could streamline the rules for “taxable income” and leave the rates as they are.
People who advocate a flat tax because it would be simpler are lying.
[QUOTE=Colophon]
Aren’t stocks priced in 1/8 of a dollar increments, too?
[/QUOTE]
Not for around 10 years, in America, at least. It’s been priced in pennies for awhile now.
ETA: of course if America gets rid of the penny eventually someone will grouse that things are priced in pennies, a unit you are unable to pay in 
[QUOTE=Finagle]
So…their cunning plan is working?
[/QUOTE]
Last time I looked, my bike wasn’t public transport. Actually it was more the cost of parking plus the finance on a car that finally persuaded me to get rid.
[QUOTE=Colophon]
Last time I looked, my bike wasn’t public transport. Actually it was more the cost of parking plus the finance on a car that finally persuaded me to get rid.
[/QUOTE]
I’m with you. When my car got totalled, I decided not to buy another one. I guess if you live in the sticks/suburbs it’s more difficult to get by without a car, but we’ve got a subway system and decent public transportation, and where I live we’ve got Zipcars (like City Ride Shares in other places - basically, you can rent a car by the hour, and there are about 8 parking lots with Zipcars within easy walking distance) which I use when I need to go grocery shopping or whatever. Not only do I save on gas (which Zipcar pays for) and insurance/registration, I save money by not being able to hop in my car and go pick up to-go food whenever I feel like it. I didn’t think I’d be able to live without a car, but I don’t miss it at all now.
[QUOTE=control-z]
-Income tax. Jumpin’ Jesus on a pogo stick, why the fuck is this shit so complicated? The math isn’t bad, but the rules sure are. If I make $40,000 a year, tax me 20% (or whatever, hopefully more like 10 or 15%) and leave me the fuck alone. If I make $100,000 a year, tax me 20%. If I make $10,000, tax me 20%. Doesn’t matter whether I’m self employed, am a farmer or a fisherman, had alimony payments or whatever, just tax me on what I earn and everyone will know exactly what to expect. See how simple that is?
[/QUOTE]
Amen. Let’s get rid of all deductions; no mortgage interest deductions, no medical deductions, no deductions for dependents, no business expense deductions, no capital loss deductions.
That’s what you had in mind, right?
[QUOTE=Fear Itself]
Amen. Let’s get rid of all deductions; no mortgage interest deductions, no medical deductions, no deductions for dependents, no business expense deductions, no capital loss deductions.
That’s what you had in mind, right?
[/QUOTE]
Yes, yes it is. Therein lies part of the complexity.
[QUOTE=Colophon]
Last time I looked, my bike wasn’t public transport. Actually it was more the cost of parking plus the finance on a car that finally persuaded me to get rid.
[/QUOTE]
Well, if you buy their whole “we’re taxing you for your own good” story, they don’t actually care * how * you get there, as long as you’re not taking a personal auto. So yeah, a bike counts.
Hell forget the flat tax and just let me write off the interest from credit cards and my fucking car loan like my parents used to be able to. Why is my house loan so much different? You want to increase consumer spending, take away the interest penalty for a year or two you stupid fucks.
[QUOTE=Colophon]
Anyway, I have no sympathy for Americans who complain about gas prices. We pay the equivalent of nearly $2.20 a LITRE.
[/QUOTE]
yeah, but you run around in those little elf cars that get 100 kilometers to the “litre” (is that a real metric measurement, or did you make it up?).
'Sides, we gots enough gas lying under North Dakota to keep us going at least till 2009. No way we should be paying 9/10 per gallon and not even get our windows washed too.
[QUOTE=buttonjockey308]
Plus, a pony would sure be nice.
[/QUOTE]
Naw, all those fuckers do is shit and eat cash right out of your wallet.
I do want the government to do something about the crying children problem, though. Every fucking public place I go, somebody has a crying child. In the airport, at the restaurant, in the bookstore, everywhere. If I were in charge, crying babies would be made a criminal offense punishable by no less than 12 years in prison. Why won’t someone think of the children?
Stranger
What is the answer to this question?
[QUOTE=Liberal]
What is the answer to this question?
[/QUOTE]
Start drinking heavily.
No - That’s ridiculous, it just raises the relative rates for the poor, who are going to end up needing even more benefits to sustain, which means more taxes, which means…
Yes.
No - So we shouldn’t be able to buy two candy bars for 99 cents, either? Ridiculous.
Yes.
Yes.
Maybe. Half the point of the civil war was state’s rights. If you don’t want the needs of people in less populous states to be addressed, then by all means, go to a straight popular vote. Ridiculous (although I admit that the dem’s primary rules are overly complex).
3.5/6 = 58.33%, almost passing… unless we round it up to 60 instead of down to 58. 
As other postes have said, much of the “Flat Tax” buzz is from people who want to screw the middle-class. Once you know your income, figuring out the tax is simple. You just look it up in a table. hell, you could use a logarithmic function and it would still just be a table lookup.
The problem is figuring out your income. If you are paid wages, have no tips, and no business expenses it is easy. But what if you are self-employed? You can deduct businesses expenses like travel, advertising, space you use for business, tools, supplies, etc.
If you sell stocks you need to figure out the basis to know if you had a gain or a loss. Same with real estate.
Now some things could be easier: for example, treat capital gains and earned income the same (why in God’s name do people put up with a system that taxes profit from sals of stocks at a rate LESS than salary?).
Getting rid of mortgage deductions would be simpler and fairer, but would cause major problems for people who count on it now.
The prroble I see, are the loopholes created specifically for certain industries like the oil depletion allowance
no, yes, yes, no, no, no
Less than 50%…this means war.
[QUOTE=control-z]
And baseball, what’s the appeal of baseball? A bunch of men on drugs wearing tight pants hit a ball with a stick and run around stepping on beanbags, and fans sit there for 9 innings watching it?
[/QUOTE]
ok…yes…but you’re still less than 50%. Still war.