Simply contact a traffic lawyer in your jurisdiction. I am sure they can answer this question for you during a 3-minute consultation.
The alternative is getting your day in court and being laughed out of the courtroom, because your case hinges on a technicality that is, in all likelihood, nonexistent.
So what happened? Did you find out what the deal is?
So I assume this is a hit-n-run thread.
Call or go to the courthouse or clerk’s office in the township where you were ticketed, and ask them to clarify.
How certain are you of the township boundaries where you were ticketed?
It has always been my understanding that from a technical standpoint you don’t need to be a police officer to issue a traffic ticket, and that anyone can issue anyone a ticket. (The local DA could then decide if they want to prosecute or not, just as if a cop issued the ticket, though I assume they’re more likely to do it in the latter case.)
If this is correct, then it would seem that jurisdictions are irrelevant to traffic tickets, as you don’t need any particular status to issue the ticket.
Wha…?
Do I understand you to say that an average citizen could hand someone else a piece of paper saying it’s a traffic citation and they have to pay a fine, go to court, etc…?
Because it doesn’t work like that.
Just out of curiosity I’m wondering what the OP found out. But it looks like this is a hit and run thread and they’re not returning.
It seemed like an interesting question, so I had a look in my jurisdiction. My university can write speeding tickets, and there doesn’t seem to be any restriction: if they wanted to, they could walk out on the street and start issuing speeding tickets. They’d have to go to the infringements court, where the costs normally exceed the recoverable costs, so they’d have to pay for the privilege. They may be willing to do that to enforce speed limits on their own grounds, but it’s unlikely they’d move out onto the public roads.
And I /think/ that because my law creates a class of agencies that can write tickets, I’m excluded by default. In general I can’t launch a private prosecution where there is a restricted class, and I /think/ that rule applies here.
I /think/ that in the old system, if I represented a credible agency, I would have been permitted to prosecute a speeding ticket: the city councils had people who were authorized to write tickets, but I don’t think the courts had rules that excluded other people.
Only a ‘credible’ agency because if a magistrate had refused to hear my lawyer, my only recourse would have been application to a much more expensive court.
You’ve understood correctly, and that is in fact what has been my understanding.
Now that you’re questioning it, I looked around a bit. Not a lot about it. But here’s an article describing how it’s done in Oregon. How to write a citizen's traffic ticket in five easy (but time-consuming) steps - oregonlive.com And here’s a guy who actually got such a ticket from his neighbors http://community.lawyers.com/forums/t/29351.aspx
Seems like my understanding was correct.
No, it wasn’t and my incredulousness was because in most areas of the country it doesn’t work the way it appears to in Oregon. And as far as Alabama goes, signing an affidavit or complaint is not the same as issuing a citation to someone as a peace officer does.
And in those instances unless the complainant has video, multiple witnesses, or other evidence, such a case would get bounced out pretty quickly. “Yes you did” “no I didn’t” arguments are usually only tolerated by small claim judges.
Do you have a source for your claims?
I appreciate that (IIRC) you yourself are a police officer, but I would think that would make you something of an expert on police rules and procedures, rather than on rarely-used civiliansones.
A simple search online will show you these things aren’t common. No expertise needed. In most states you can certainly make a complaint, but it would be investigated by authorities and citations would be issued by them. Just like if a shoplifting dick catches and thief, they can hold them for police but it’s not them issuing the actual charges. Your examples are exceptions not norms.
The P is within his rights to ask if the officer was within his jurisdiction. Every state gives peace officers their power either through statute or constitution. One state may allow officers to charge anywhere in the state, others may only allow an officer to charge a felony outside his jurisdiction but not lesser offenses.
Perhaps you can do a “simple online search” and share your results. I keep finding the opposite to be true. For example this one
(emphasis added.)
Your cite gave no cites. It showed no evidence that this was the case in any state, much less most. What it did do was show multiple reasons why someone trying to use an archaic law, even if they got past the system laughing them out the door, would probably end up looking like an ass in the court room.
Most of whats on the web has to do with citizens arrest, which entails holding someone for a LEO, not doing the paperwork yourself.
You are aware that in most states the system is not going to tell you who is the owner of a vehicle by license plate? The days of that information being available to the general public are pretty much gone.
The fact remains that in every state an officers jurisdiction is set by state statute or constitution. I cannot drive my squad car to Madison and write traffic cites, unless mutual aid has been requested. So your contention that an officer can write a traffic cite anywhere is patently incorrect.
In the case of the OP I’m willing to guess that the officer involved had authority in multiple townships. All I can do is guess as the OP hasn’t returned with his results.
Understood. But the point is that neither did you. You’re a cop and the guy who wrote that post is also a cop. Seems like an impasse, at this point.
My original claim here has been about what’s valid “from a technical standpoint”. I certainly agree that as a practical matter a civilian is less likely to prevail than a cop would.
And in that context, I should note that the cite in my most recent post was specifically about a civilian giving a traffic ticket to a cop, not to another civilian. I don’t know if there’s a technical difference between the two situations, but if you’re discussing “the system laughing them out the door” it’s certainly a lot more likely in the former case than in the latter.
I’m not an expert in every state. Why would I? But in my state any citizen can sign a traffic summons. They don’t hand a piece of paper to anyone but they can come into municipal court and make a citizens complaint.
As someone who works in New Jersey I could answer the OP’s question but it was written so poorly that I have more questions than answers.
Yes, but making a complaint and signing it is not the same as issuing the cite themselves. Making a complaint has fail safes involved before anyone gets any charges issues against them.
It also doesn’t prove the statement that an officer could write a cite outside of his lawful jurisdiction. The only thing that could determine that would be each individual states laws.
I’m curious as to whether my guess was correct about the OP’s officer working for several townships. We do that here. When my parent department cracked down on overtime I took a job with a township part-time to make some extra bread. We had authority/agreements with 3 separate townships and 1 sanitation district (lake patrol). When cites were issued there was a small "so you got a citation and you’re probably unhappy about it" paper that explained what to do about it. It also explained why there were multiple townships listed on the ticket.