at
http://freepages.military.rootsweb.com/~batsto/soldier.JPG
there is a photo of a soldier and I need to know if it is possible, based on either his uniform or the type of gun he is holding, to figure out an approximate date for the photo? Does anyone know where I would find that information? It’s an old family photo, and supposedly it is from the 1920 or earlier but I am not certain.
I’m not an expert on that type of firearm, but it looks like an M1903. If it is, you might find some information at the forum at http://m1903.com/
I’m guessing the uniform is U.S. Army? Pre-1920 looks fairly close.
Interesting foliage in the photo. When did we invade Nicaragua? Did we use the army, or the Marines?
Depicts a 250 year chronological history of U.S. Army and U.S. Marine Corps uniforms in 1/6th, GI Joe scale. From 1747 to Present.
Good Luck =)
We did invade the Phillipines during the Spanish-American War, or your relative could have been in Panama during the building of the canal.
The uniform looks circa WWI doughboy-type to me.
Oops, forgot to mention.
There’s an Armyman behind me, swearing that’s a canadian hat.
But as Johnny L.A. noted the foliage (LoL @ Invading Nicaragua)
I don’t see how Canada would be possible with a banana tree in the background.
The hat made me think of Pershing’s men in Mexico c. 1916, but I couldn’t find a picture that exactly matched the tunic. I’m pretty sure it’s U.S. Army around WWI.
Wild guess, based on rifle (1903 Springfield, not the 1918 variant) the scenery and the campaign hat, is Panama or the Phillipines any time from 1900 to early 1930s. I don’t recognizee the badge on the hat. It certainly is not USMC. Also the pocket on the blouse is a teaser–US Army blouses had a pleated breast pocket–the one shown in the photograph is flat. Maybe Canadian but I doubt it. Maybe some sort of police, like the Phillipine Constabulary. It is not regular US Army, based on the blouse.
He does look in ernest, though.
Most certainly not a Canadian hat; it does bear some resemblance to the stetson as worn during the same period by the Royal North-West Mounted Police, and some cavalry regiments, but the other uniform items and rifle are certainly US–as Johnny L.A. hit it on the head with the ID of a 1903 Springfield; the Mauser-type action is a dead giveaway.
It sure looks to me like our doughboy is wearing the M1911 Campaign Hat:
http://www.worldwar1.com/dbc/camph.htm
Here’s a better look at a replica of an early WWI Campaign Hat:
http://yd102.tripod.com/campaign.htm
I think that the vent hole at the front of your b/w photo matches up pretty well with the (exact) repro. Unfortunately, we can’t see the stitching of the hat in the b/w photo. The same page makes reference to very similar hats still being worn in WW2!
Can’t really see if he is wearing any campaign ribbons (which would help date the photo somewhat). He could be in the Philippines, as fighting went on there until 1913; could be Mexico 1916-17; Dominican Republic 1914; Haiti 1914; Cuba 1917; Honduras 1919, Guatamala 1920; could even just be in Florida or, as someone mentioned, the Panama Canal (1918-20).
He’s no spring chicken, yet has no stripes that I can see on my screen–can you make out the collar insignia, batsto?
That rifle looks like a Springfield 1903. The uniform looks like it’s from WW1 or earlier (thanks to brandiwine). The hat is a M1911 field service hat. I think postcards got it right - it’s either the Philippines or Panama.
I’ve managed to dig up a few images from colonial Philippines:
http://scriptorium.lib.duke.edu/scriven/phil1.html
http://www.phil-am-war.org/Battle_BudBagsak.htm
I googled “doughboy” and landed at:
http://members.tripod.com/~Fbg_mem_museum/uniftalk/unipat2.htm
Which confirmed I’m not losing my mind: I’d vaugely remembered the bellows-pockets in the OP’s photo as being replaced in WWI with flatter patch pockets. That’s not to say that the photo is pre-WWI: then, as now, the old gear was handed-down to National Guard outfits long after the regulars get the new stuff. And, a lot of sleepy garrison posts (like the Phillipines) are turned over to Natl. Guard units when the regulars are sent to the battlefronts.
One thing: the cords on his cap kind of look to be too big for infantry, so, even though he’s not holding a carbine, I’m thinking he’s cavalry. This would still be consistant with service in the Phillipines: Clark Air Base, like a lot of air fields, was originally laid out on the old parade grounds of a cavalry post.
(BTW - I not-so-fondly recognize that rifle. Uncle Sam kept thousands of them after they went obsolete, poured lead down the barrels, and made kids like me beat the shit out of ourselves with them in Navy boot camp)
however, something that might point towards the Canal Zone, away from the Phillipines, is the blouse he’s wearing. The tucked-in khaki shirt that was the staple of the US Army for so many years was informally adopted for the heat of the Phillipines, while everywhere else the Army was still wearing tunics.
Also, I’m pretty sure, because of the lack of an anchor & globe cap device, he’s not a Marine. That would rule out Nicaragua or Haiti.
Actually, the U.S. did invade Nicaragua in 1912 and occupied the country until 1933. But as Slithy Tove said, that was the Marines. (I didn’t know if any army were involved, but after a quick search it appears it was a Marine operation.)
I sure mean no offense, especially given the erudition of the rest of Rodd’s post, but I’ve seen lost of guys in their TWENTIES in the service who looked worse than this guy.
One time in our berthing comparment, a 2nd class Aviation Boatswain’s Mate flashed his yellow eyes and yellower teeth at the kids out of boot camp and dared them to guess his age. They guessed forty plus. He was 27. Landing aircraft on a pitching flight deck all night, then drenching your nerves with alcohol throughout the following night, for ten years will accellerate the aging process. I don’t doubt that the old army had a similar system in practice.
…and no offense taken, Slithy !
I thought that he looked to be in his late 30s-early 40s, and that might have implied long(er) service, but there were no visible rank stripes, or more to the point, service chevrons (I’m a little out of my depth on this, though, as my area of knowledge is more in the UK/Empire unforms of the time). Did the US Army/National Guard wear ‘hash marks’ at this period? But you’re quite right: beer, cigars, and pickled pigs’ feet could add a lot of mileage to a guy, let alone running around places rife with malaria, etc.! And, true, there are a lot of older soldiers who never rose from the ranks (and some who reverted to private on more than one occasion!). Certainly the average age of the British Regulars in 1914 had to be pushing 30.
How about those collar badges, batsto ?
http://members.tripod.com/~Fbg_mem_museum/uniftalk/unipat3.htm
thanks everyone for your help…I knew I could count on the Straight Dope for help with this!