Can the benefits I get from state services be quantified in monetary terms?

[Markxxx]

I know a guy who won’t apply for food stamps though he is qualified to get them. In Illinois he’d have to work for them. But he won’t apply, I told him, “It’s not charity, they will make you give you a job or community service and you’ll work them off.” He won’t do it. But he WILL take a discount half price bus/train pass.

That isn’t charity that he rides the bus for half price. Why that isn’t charity, I don’t know.

So you see the problem? Another is services. Let’s say you never called the fire department. You’re taxes pay for that. So is not using a service a waste? OR are you not really paying to USE the service but instead are you paying TO HAVE IT AVAILABLE when you need it?

I think we’ll all agree a large portion of our tax money is wasted. In the City of Chicago alone you got tons of waste through inflated salaries. City workers get far more than they’d get on the “free market.”

But that’s politics

[Hellestal]

@Der_Trihs

I’d say that the answer to the question is “everything she has.” Because without the government everything she has would be worthless or stolen, and she’d likely be dead or wishing she was. It’s the government that prints money, keeps order, maintains much of the infrastructure, restricts fraud, and in general provides a major and absolutely vital portion of what keeps society - including the economy - up and running at all.

I pretty much agree with this basic argument, but it still leaves open the marginal benefit of government services.

A stable functioning government that provides some essential public services is the required minimum for civilization. Right. But there’s still a problem of figuring out what extra benefit exists from spending extra money on top of the minimum civilization upkeep costs (something we don’t even know anyway). What’s the added benefit of an extra dollar of public services? There are a lot of variables, and so this is where ideology steps in. Liberals would generally say the benefit of an extra dollar of spending is likely to be more than its cost, while conservatives would generally say the opposite–with notable exceptions like military spending, which highlight the ideological divide even more sharply.

There’s no way to untangle this in an objective way. Not right now, and maybe not ever.

[foolsguinea]

@Shodan

This, I don’t know about. I think what the OP is talking about is receiving benefits you haven’t paid for. Certainly any employer benefits from the labor of others, but he pays for that labor or he doesn’t get it.

I was talking about investors–bondholders, stockholders, owners–more than managers & proprietors in general.

If you mean that employees value their wages more than the time spent at their jobs, sure, but that is true of every uncoerced economic exchange or it wouldn’t happen. The only reason I am willing to sell my widgit, or my time, is that I want the money I can get in exchange for either more than the widgit or the time itself.

Um, no, that’s not at all what I was trying to say (thanks for reminding me of the first day of macro, bro :rolleyes:) & I don’t know quite where that came from.