If you’re among the people who have decided that the accusations are false, I’m not asking you.
This is for the people, like myself, who 100% believe the accusations made against him, especially by Wade Robson and James Safechuck in the documentary Leaving Neverland. (I think it’s kind of fascinating that Jackson appears to be among the “truest” pedophiles I’ve ever heard about, in that he wasn’t simply using kids, he genuinely fixates on children as love and sex objects. The biggest proof of that for me were the hours long telephone calls with a little boy in Australia. You don’t talk with a little kid for hours if you just want to get in his pants, you do it because you have inappropriately replaced normal healthy adult love objects with children. Which is tremendously sad, but not as sad as the resulting behavior.)
I just came across an essay from somebody stating that when it comes to jackson they cannot appreciate his art anymore because of his behavior. Right after I watched leaving Neverland, I went through the same thing. The minute his music came on I would get mental pictures of what he had done as the two men accusing him had described, and as you might imagine that somewhat spoiled my ability to appreciate his music. It wasn’t a choice I was making for any reason other than that… My brain just painted pictures I didn’t really want to see while I was listening to some music.
But I’ve always been a huge fan of much of what he did, and as the years have passed that tendency to have that mental picture has eased And I can again enjoy his music without painting those pictures in my head. For which I’m grateful because I really do enjoy so much of his music.
What about you? If you’re a fan of his music, has it been spoiled by learning the lurid details of what he did?
I was never a huge fan. I owned a copy of Thriller, but I think that 80% of Americans at that time did.
Certainly, the entirety of what Jackson was about always is present in my mind when I hear his music. Though his clearly unwholesome interest in boys was/is inexcusable, what also is in my mind is just how messed up his own childhood (and self-image) was, and the extent to which what he was as an adult was the product of being a child star, with an abusive family – and that’s all pretty sad.
I still enjoy Beat It, but at this point, what I enjoy about it the most is the guitar work, by Steve Lukather and Eddie Van Halen, more than anything else about it.
I still enjoy many of the songs from Bad and Thriller. IMHO Beat It, Thriller, Billie Jean, Human Nature, Bad, The Way You Make Me Feel, Dirty Diana, and Smooth Criminal represent his best work. His stuff from the '90s and 2000s is not to my taste. It’s not that I no longer like his later work, it’s that I didn’t like them even back when they were being released.
ETA: I don’t think it’s a coincidence that his music became worse around the same time that he “got weird”.
I never like Michael Jackson, (never owned or even listened to Thriller) but I like enough other offensive people that I could safely say I’d still like his music if I did before. I like some Ted Nugent songs and Bill Cosby comedy albums.
I wouldn’t say it’s anything more complicated than, I like their stuff. There are a lot of non-sex offender artists that I like their works and would hate them if I met them in real life.
eta: I wouldn’t buy anything new, but stuff I owned from before we knew how bad they were isn’t giving them any new money. And burning my CDs in a public bonfire doesn’t have any effect on the artist.
I cannot imagine giving two shits about whether he was a saint or a devil.
The musical performance is by a character played by the man. The man may or may have been be a sex offender. FTR I’m pretty convinced he was both a sex offender and a drug addict. Good bet he cheated on his taxes too.
But the character had talent and can be appreciated for that. And IMO should be appreciated for that talent.
I heard him.
Never bought anything by him(I acquired albums by swiping from my siblings and listening to free music sources).
I never have liked Jackson’s voice but the beat of his tunes is addictive. You can’t help but want to move to it.
So, yeah I can enjoy it.
I believe he was a disgusting pedo. Drug addict. Plastic surgery addict. And no telling what other mental illness.
I think I know what you are trying to say here, and I agree with the sentiment. But not the wording - lumping “mental illness” in general together with his criminal behavior is unfair to people diagnosed with various mental illnesses. Just because someone is bi-polar, schizophrenic, etc. is no reason to ostracize them or assume them capable of sexual assault or other violence.
I don’t think you meant to imply that it IS a reason; it’s just the way I read it, so I couldn’t help but speak up to clarify. (My mother was a clinical therapist; issues of fairness and compassion toward the mentally ill were very important in my family while I was growing, so I’m probably oversensitive.)
ETA: To answer the OP, I’m fine with enjoying his music but not with enriching his enablers. I suspect the line is a bit blurry at the moment because victims have claims against his estate.
I can’t enjoy his music any longer. I believe the allegations, and while I try to separate the man from the art, I can’t do it in this case. Child molestation and child rape are too far down the line for me to ignore.
I’ll concede that this has occurred as I’ve gotten older (early 60s now) and even 10 years ago I didn’t care. There are only three people I put in this category, Jackson, Simpson and Albert Speer (which is an odd member of this group I’ll admit). But while once enjoyed their art and or accomplishments, I can no longer do so.
Ok let me explain that. I’ve never liked pop music of any era. I certainly didn’t like Michael Jackson. But old age brought some wisdom. Or maybe it is just nostalgia. I’ve come to appreciate that crafting a good pop song takes a lot of talent. What percentage of that talent was Michael’s and what percentage was Quincy’s I don’t know. I appreciate it more now even though I still don’t like it.
I know we’ve had threads before about enjoying artists whose beliefs and/or politics go against your own. I’m on the “I can’t enjoy or support (even indirectly) people who disgust me” side of the fence.
I was never a big fan of the music Jackson made when he was an adult, but I love me some Jackson 5. Does anyone make a distinction between stuff he did when he was an adult, versus the stuff he did when he was a kid?
I grew up in the 80s which means two things. One, I was a massive fan because everyone was back then, just about, and you couldn’t help it. Two, I was so oversaturated with him and his music that I got sick of it after a while. So because of all that, no, I do not enjoy his music. I can’t be objective over it.
On the other hand, I still marvel at his dancing during the Motown 25th Anniversary special. It might have been the best dance routine ever televised.
I don’t quite fit the OP’s conditions because I did not believe the two men who made that television show, or at least one of them (the other, to my eyes, felt sick about what he was doing). I do believe Jackson was mentally ill and that part of this illness was his inability to feel romantic and sexual attraction to adults. (Male or female.) I believe he was fixated on young boys and did things that are illegal. However, I don’t believe the portrait painted in that television show of Jackson as a flat-out rapist.
Again, I do think some of his behavior violated laws as well as decency and morality. But his personality simply was not that of a rapist. I’m sure he believed that what he was offering was love.
I think this view I hold comes from my observation of him, and not from wishful thinking, due to my wish to go on enjoying his music. But of course that’s not for me to say.
Like other troubled people throughout history, he was a genius. (Not every genius is troubled and not every troubled person is a genius. But human brains do seem to work that way in a large number of cases.
In short: I still enjoy his music and marvel at what an original he was, and how much he’s contributed to world culture.
I judge/enjoy media on its own merits, not on if the media creator shares the same politics and morals that I do. I’d be able to enjoy Hitler’s paintings and Charles Manson’s songs if Hitler had actually made good paintings and Charles Manson had actually made good songs.
Me too. I can justify J5 stuff because he was a child then, not that I listen to to all that much.
If you all will allow a second hand story… The (late) uncle of the first victim was a good friend of a friend of mine. Uncle couldn’t wait until the trial was over so he could publish a book and make millions. He did publish a book and it flopped. Anyway, years ago I heard a lot of anecdotes.
My opinion: That family was scum. They set MJ up. MJ really did it but they intentionally put that kid in that position so that they could benefit knowing damn well that something was likely to happen. Maybe an acting gig or maybe sexual assault and a huge settlement. It’s all good.
