Cars waiting overlong for pedestrians/bikers at intersections

In My Humble Opinion
1

I’d appreciate the experiences and opinions of folk who have experienced the scenario below either as drivers or as bikers/pedestrians.

Early this morning, my wife and I were walking the dog. Little to no pedestrian or vehicular traffic. We approach an intersection. The cross street has a stop sign. The car on the cross street stops, and would have plenty of time to start again and clear the intersection before we even got within 10’ of the street. (Given the quiet streets at that time of day, a rolling stop would have been entirely expected.) We would not have had to slow down at all. But instead, the car sits there, waiting for us to walk in front of it.

Not a huge deal, but a VERY mild discomfort. We’d prefer to walk BEHIND a car moving away from us than in front of a car. And it just introduces a mild bit of uncertainty. Instead of just assuming the car will stop and go as generally expected, we have to wonder, “Is it waiting for us? Are they checking their phone and will they start when we are in front of them?”

My sister and I often encounter a similar situation when biking. We will be approaching an intersection with a 4-way stop. A car is stopped at the cross street or approaching its stop sign before we will get to ours. We understand that on the roads we adhere to the rules of the road, so we presume the car will stop, then start and clear the intersection before we do. (To be honest, on our bikes if there is no other traffic, we generally do not come to a complete stop at stop signs. Hell, if I’m being honest, I rarely do so in my car! ;)) But instead, the car will sit there. We generally slow, expecting the car to follow traffic rules and clear the intersection so we can proceed. Perhaps the driver is waving us to cross, but unless the light is perfect, we often cannot see them through their windows. So we slow more and more, still uncertain of the car’s intentions. Often, when we are nearly stopped and the car still hasn’t moved, we decide to go in front of it. Not only is that uncomfortable, but we often have not geared down sufficiently such that it is difficult for us to get going quickly from having slowed so much. So if the car DOES decide to start at the last second, we are less maneuverable in an inappropriate gear.

Often when we do get a glimpse of the driver, we’ll see them smiling broadly and waving as tho they did us some big favor, instead of realizing that they actually inconvenienced and discomforted us.

When I’m driving, I’m HUGELY aware of bikers and pedestrians. I give them wide berth and always slow/stop to allow them to pass in frot of me (even/especially when they are looking at their phones, crossing in the middle of a block, etc.). But if I am at a marked intersection and I can stop and clear before the pedestrian/biker even gets to the intersection without causing them to alter their pace, I do so. And as a biker/pedestrian I never think ill of a driver doing that.

Thoughts?

2

I’m not going to complain about people driving politely and giving consideration to others. A few people are engaged in a form of narcissism that results in an a show of allowing others to go first, but more often the driver is not in a hurry to go. The driver might have a good reason to hesitate for a moment and doesn’t want to act out a dance with a pedestrian who could suddenly try to rush across the street. This is not at all a problem in comparison to drivers who try to get through an intersection before any pedestrian has a chance to step on the crosswalk.

3

I guess I kind of think it an instance where someone thinks they are doing something polite, when they are actually causing discomfort or introducing uncertainty. Sorta like the person holding a door for you when you are well away. Do you hustle to get to the door?

Yes, I have experienced it when pedestrians - IME most often runners - will speed up at an intersection to dart in front of a car. Maybe I did the same when I was much younger and felt bulletproof. And there is the al-to-common airhead looking at their phone, oblivious to traffic. But, as a general rule, I think it best when all forms of traffic act in predictable manners. And, in the instances I’m describing, the biker/pedestrian is clearly looking directly t the car, trying to ascertain the driver’s intentions and align their actions with the car’s.

And, yeah - some drivers are dicks. IME especially when turning, being oblivious to pedestrians/bikers who may have the right of way. I’m sure we could identify any number of other actions which are worse that the ones I described.

4

Not sure if this applies to your post, but in some jurisdictions you can get a ticket for entering a crosswalk if a pedestrian is anywhere in it. I once got a warning in Seattle when I turned left and a person had just stepped off curb. They were on my far left and I was crossing the right side of the crosswalk, so nowhere close, but I still got the warning.

5

I don’t think it does. I was describing a situation in which the pedestrian has not yet stepped off the curb.

In our neighborhood there are sidewalks with approx. 10’ parkways between the sidewalk and the street. We had not yet reached the intersection of the sidewalks, so we were >10’ from the curb at the time the car had stopped. It was also the situation as you describe: we were walking south on the west side of the street, and the car was headed east. So in addition to the >10’ of sidewalk we had to traverse before getting to the curb, there was a full lane-width between us and the car. We are a couple in our 60s (clearly showing our age) walking not rapidly with a dog on leash. I suggest the chances of us suddenly darting out into traffic would generally be perceived as rather slim.

I’d imagine the situation you describe in Seattle might be more important in a city or on busier roads than the pretty untraveled suburban streets on which I most often experience such behavior.

6

I motion for the car to go and wait until it does.

7

When I on my bike it actually annoys me when drivers are too polite.
Example. I’m sitting at a stop sign with my foot on the ground (that is completely stopped) with cross traffic a busier road that does not have a stop sign. If a car stops for me I find it annoying because I have no assurances that cars coming from the other direction will also stop.
Or at a 4-way stop a car arrives before me and is on my right – don’t stop! just go!
yes, sometimes I have to wave them to go

Now if it a case of a car moving over to give me more than the 3 foot legally required or give me the right of way when it is a close call that’s another story.

Brian

8

I don’t like it either. If I’m 10 feet from the intersection , there’s no way the driver knows if I’m even planning to cross the street. Maybe I’m going to go into a building or turn the corner. And even if I’m planning to cross the street, I feel like I have to rush , just like when someone is holding the door for me.

9

Just wave the car through. I walk a LOT in suburban areas where we have very few pedestrians. I’m often crossing two lane roads with no sidewalk and no crosswalk (or the nearest crosswalk is literally miles away)

If a car stops for me, I still need to worry about traffic in the opposite direction and I need to worry about the asshole driver behind the stopped car overtaking it, honking and screaming.

I prefer to decide for myself when it’s safe.

Where there is a crosswalk without a signal, cars that stop for me when they see me even if I’m a couple yards away from the roadway are very much appreciated. There’s no way I’m stepping onto the roadway and expecting cars to see me and stop. Too many drivers on phones and too many just assholes.

If there is an intersection with a pedestrian signal they usually stop traffic in all directions on the “walk” signal. And I will insist on waiting for that, which in some cases may be 3-4 minutes, because it doesn’t give the walk signal even for every cycle of lights, depending on the volume of traffic.

As you can tell I live in a very car dependent and car friendly area. You gotta adapt. I walk 1.1 miles each way to get coffee, and sometimes bike 2.5 miles each way to get groceries. When I first moved into this neighborhood 10 years ago neighbors assumed that I had lost my license and kindly offered me rides. People do run and ride bikes. But in the proper attire and not with backpacks to carry food or with coffee in their hands!

10

There is definitely a distance at which it is uncomfortable. I walk my kids to school and it’s not unusual to have a car wait a stop sign when we are at least 20 yards away. I’m not going to make my kids run, so they end up sitting far longer than they would be if they just drove normally.

The related pet peeve I have has to do with turning on/off a busy street. The smaller street I live on empties onto a much larger multi-lane street with no light or traffic control. The larger street has a turn lane (a lane in between the two lanes of traffic that run in each direction) where cars that are turning left OFF of the large street into a smaller side street can pull out of traffic to wait for a chance to cross oncoming traffic.

I was always taught that when turning left from the small street onto the larger street, you must be able to enter the traffic lanes, not the turn lane. That the turn lane is only for cars exiting the major street.

OK, now to the pet peeve. It is not unusual for a driver that is waiting to turn OFF of the main road to attempt to let me, as a driver turning ON to the main road go in front of him. This is completely wrong, as he has the right of way and drivers entering the roadway should yield to him. And often in order to take that driver up on their “kindness” I have to turn into the turn lane rather than the traffic lane (because that lane isn’t clear, or I can’t confirm it is clear because the turning vehicle is blocking the view), which is not correct. But if I don’t take them up on their offer then they will just sit there blocking any other cars trying to turn off the major road. Ugh, just drive normally, people.

11

I think sometimes this applies to the OP’s situation.

12

I much prefer a driver who follows the rules instead of one who’s trying to do people favors. It’s far more predictable and safer. Sure, if you have a loaded cart in a checkout line and you see someone with two items come up behind you, offer to let them go first. Knock yourself out! But when you’re surrounded by a ton of steel, just do what the driver’s manual says.

13

I would find that situation mildly annoying, and I would make sure I had eye contact with the driver before walking in front of the car, while keeping my dog (if I had one) well under control. I don’t blame the driver for being extra careful, even excessively so, there are too many erratic and unpredictable pedestrians (as well as drivers) out there for a driver to take anything for granted.

14

Generally, if I’m on two feet or two wheels, I want the vehicle to get past me me and be moving away from me rather than pointed toward me and on a course that could intersect me.

I feel like I have a skosh more control and safety that way.

If I accept the motorist’s ‘friendly gesture,’ then a moment’s inattention on their part – a slip of the foot, the sudden realization that a car behind them isn’t slowing down, etc., – puts me in severe peril.

I’ve yet to have somebody drive by me and then put it in reverse in order to mow me over. Not that I rule it out, but …

They’re also basically forcing me to move on their schedule (to avoid being discourteous to them), when either I or – far more likely – my dog isn’t done with that particular spot just yet.

I’ve had the issue become such a (calm and convivial) standoff that I’ve turned on my heels and gone the other way in order to force the motorist’s hand.

15

I encounter this a lot while walking my dog. I simply wave people thru and stop to wait for them to move on. Sometimes we wave back and forth but I always win by just standing there until they move thru (and they end-up annoyed with me). As someone else mentioned upthread, I want to cross when I’m ready, and at my own pace. It makes no sense for me to rush across the street because a single car is waiting for me when I can just casually walk after they have passed. I know they are trying to be courteous, but when there is no other car around it’s not necessary, especially when I am waving them thru.

On my bike I am extra careful with this - an assumption on my part can get me injured or killed. I always look for eye contact before rolling in front of a car at an intersection, even when I have the right of way. And many cars these days have tinted windshields and windows, which makes it harder to determine if the driver is paying attention. I’d rather wait a few extra seconds to determine with certainty the driver sees and acknowledges me before making a move in front of them. But, I will often wave drivers to pass in front of me at intersections, same as when I am a pedestrian/dog walker.

16

It might not be giving favors. I see far too many cyclists just blow through stop signs and even lights without a care for traffic.

17

I haven’t experienced the situation described in the OP. As others have said, I’d just wave the car on. What state is this in?

18

I encounter a variation on this almost every morning. My kid waits at the end of my driveway to cross our residential street, so an extremely long wait could be 30 seconds. Often one of the cars will stop to let my kid cross.

How am I supposed to teach my kid to safely cross the street when the cars keep stopping? So much of this is the advanced lesson of judging if a car is far enough away to cross in front of, and that is totally defeated when cars stop.

Also, it’s not safe unless the cars in both directions stop. If one way stops, usually the other will, but we always wait for both to stop (or the other way is clear). That means one direction can be sitting there for a bit waiting for the other direction to stop. Almost always, if the cars had just kept going, we would have been able to cross after them.

In my car, when turning out of my work parking lot I always make eye contact with the bicyclists and pedestrians who are going to pass in front of me. I have a stop sign, and they don’t, and I want them to know I intend to respect their right of way. If I don’t make eye contact, it’s because I don’t see them (talking about you, bicycle moving fast the wrong direction).

19

The most awkward part for the pedestrian is figuring out just how fast to walk while the driver is politely waiting. Normal pace? (What is normal?) Slightly faster? Hustle, so you huff and puff to get out of their way quicker? Go just a tiny tick slower than usual, just to avoid looking like you’re rushing? What if you normally walk fast, but happen to be walking slower than usual that day? What if the opposite?

I tend to overthink things…

20

This! I don’t like when folks try to help me through intersections as it often makes it more dangerous.

Around these parts, I can treat stop signs as yields and treat red lights as stop signs (stop then go before it changes). It’s called the “Idaho stop”. That doesn’t mean you can do so in a dangerous way, but it is legal in some states.