Cite?
Seriously we do tell people this all the time. We just don’t come out and say it. What percentage of professional baseball players do you think are using a PE drug? How about football? People don’t talk about it, but the athletes know about PE drugs and are using.
We reward athletes for their success, not hard work.
Rob Grant and Doug Naylor touched on this issue(well, one very much like it) in one of the Red Dwarf novels; genetically engineered lifeforms were banned from taking part in sports because football(soccer) teams were genetically engineering their goalkeepers so that they would just be large rectangular blocks of flesh and bone, occupying the entire goalmouth.
Yeah, the book was Better than Life. There was a joke about how Scotland feilded a goalkeeper that was an 8’ by 16’ rectangle of human flesh and they still didn’t make the second round of the world cup.
Anyway, back to the OP. Just because some athletes are already taking PE drugs is no justification to legalise/allow it. If PE drugs were allowed, where would it stop? What sort of message does that send to chldren whose role models are athletes? How would age limits (if any) be determined in sports such as gymnastics which routinely have would-class competitors in their early teens?
And just for the record, sport isn’t always about the spectators.
It seems to me the biggest objection is that athletes should compete only with what nature gave them, but we don’t do this. We change all kinds of things for athletes. Would you really want to prevent someone from competing in baseball who had eye surgery? Well, this surgury (or corrective lenses) will have a greater effect on his playing than PE drugs ever could.
Yes, but the drugs are destructive. Say it with me now. Destructive. Training at high altitudes is constructive. Running with weights in one’s shoes (if done correctly) is constructive. All of these things are designed to push one’s body to the limits. Eye surgery is available to the general public, and is constructive, therefore it’s allowed. Knee surgery is available to the general public and is constructive, therefore it’s allowed. PE drugs are not allowed to the general public, and are destructive, therefore they are not allowed. I don’t care how much you’d like to see atheletes so muscular that their tendons snap. It’s destructive and it’s not allowed to the general public. Atheletes aren’t exceptions to the rule.
I just really want to do this.
Cite?
Twice above you have used the same short-sighted response to a point by asking for a cite when one likely can’t be provided, which in your mind apparently bolsters your argument.
I have learned a valuable lesson in this thread. No matter how off base or poorly thought out an idea is, if the originator has blinders on no amount of logical debate or factual counter evidence can change that persons mind.
I choose to use this exact thread for my cite for the above statement.
I hate to do this, but to be fair, intensive training and competition can be quite destructive too, particularly to knee joints and the like, which can often wear out long before their time after a brief career in athletics or gymnastics.
I defer to Mangetout. However, the fact remains that it is legal for a non-athelete to wear out their knee joints as well. There is no sense in making any ol’ kind of steroids legal for the sole reason of making your personal sports-watching more entertaining.
Ah, I see you found the John Madden thread.
I have a friend who’s father played for the Packers in the late 60’s early 70’s. Gigantic man. Trained specifically to be a lineman. Now, he can hardly walk.
When I did roids in the early 80’s, I damaged my body to point that I wouldn’t have been able to compete in the sports I loved. What point is it to be able to lift up a man and throw him a few feet, if can’t even run after them to get them 'cause your knees hurt too bad?
Even with out PED’s, I think many people are needlessly damaging themselves and setting themselves up for a painful old age by sport specific training.
PED’s? Bad Idea.
I’m not a sports fan, and I never thought of athletes as my role models. I realize I am in the minority, at least for males.
BZ00000’s scenario is the extreme of what has, to a certain degree, already happened. I don’t have a cite, but recently there was that big flap about steroid use in major league baseball, right? Someone estimated that close to half of the players used. And coaches looked the other way because they got results.
Hypothetically, if there were such drugs and surgical procedures scientifically engineered to enhance performance without harming the human body, would you support their use in professional sports? I have an answer: It doesn’t matter. It’s sick, but as long as people will pay to see chemically enhanced freaks there’s no way to stop it from happening. Whether you and I like it or not, money talks and bullshit walks.
I wonder what Japanese dopers who are familiar with Sumo culture would have to say about this. Supposedly these sumo guys are worshipped as heroes, get all the women they want, eat to excess, and do lots of partying. The only catch is that they have to weigh 800 lbs and die of heart failure at 34. At least that’s what I’ve read. Does anyone know if this is an accurate picture I’m painting? I’d love to find out I’ve been misled. The whole thing just seems so morbid.
There is a Drug-Free Bodybuilders Association (the Not Arnold League). One of the more famous members is Nora Greenwald, who wrestles as Molly holly in the WWE.
Oh, btw, steroids are allowed for recuperation, rehabilitation and rebuilding worn or torn muscles. Just not for competition purposes.
Which leads to another problem. It makes all athletes suspect that each of them use 'roids.
You are right, capacitor. And that is why (well, one reason, anyways) many sports leagues have the injured reserve status. Protects them from being dumped while not producing, and prohibits them from playing while undergoing whatever therapies they need, which therapies sometimes involve the use of drugs.
What BOZO seems to be asking is for GameCube and Sega! to be true in real life.
It may yet happen, but that doesn’t mean it’s a good thing. I don’t want my sports dominated by freaks. I just want humans who are very good at what they do. And I secretly wish they don’t have to wake up in pain everyday once they retire.
I’d like to know why you think you deserve entertainment ? And why your view of “the best” is the one that should be catered to ? Several other people have expressed their desire to see drug-free athletes, implying that that is their opinion of what “the best” is, why should your view rule ?
Part of the enjoyment of sports, for intelligent fans at least, is comparing athletes of different eras. PE drugs make a mockery of this.
The ideal of sports is to push the human body to levels of excellence. PE drugs again make a mockery of this.
Since the drugs don’t work equally well for everyone (and some may still have morals/health concerns/etc.), encouraging their use makes the field less level for those who simply wish to train hard.
At some point, why not allow boxers to have steel plates inserted into their hands and heads, graft Wolverine’s claws into power forwards, and arm cornerbacks with shotguns?
The BEST is what the person develops him or her self, without PE drugs.
All the more reason to end each athletic competition with a fight to the death.
Sorry, that’s the booze talking.