To conclude otherwise is to demonstrate that one does not understand the philosophy behind Communism.
Moreover, many of these people were killed *for worshipping God. Just read Aleksandr I. Solzhenitsyn’s works, if you don’t believeme. These people were killed because they refused to embrace atheism.
Atheism was one of the most basic tenets of these Communist regimes, so while it was not the sole cause of this suffering, it was most certainly one of the causes.
BTW, contrary to your statement, nobody said atheism was the cause of their deaths. Rather, it was one of the causes. Atheism was one of the causes of communism, insofar as it was a vital tenet thereo, and communism directly caused these peoples’ deaths.
Moreover, if we are to apply your logic consistently, then one should not blame Christian teaching for, say, the Crusades. One would have to blame the earthly governments for these atrocities, rather than Christianity itself. In fact, one would have a much stronger basis for shifting this blame, since Christian teachings run directly counter to the actions of the Crusaders.
It is heartily disingenuous to blame the Christian Church for those atrocities, yet absolve atheism of the atrocities that came about from its worldview. In fact, it is obvious that the “Christian” atrocities were committed in direct disobedience to God’s Word. In contrast, while many atheists would lament the communist death toll, there is nothing in atheism per se which condemns these murders.
Once again, I feel I must emphasize that this is not meant as a condemnation of atheism itself. Rather, it is merely meant to emphasize that the aforementioned argument for rejecting Christianity is ultimately self-defeating. I know I’ve said this before, but experience has shown that careless readers are bound to pounce upon such material and misconstrue it, without properly understanding its purpose.
First off, it is inaccurate to say that atheism is merely a lack of belief. Some atheists would certainly say that, but others would say that it’s an explicit belief that there is NO God. Still others would say that it’s the belief that there’s not enough evidence to warrant God’s existence.
And second, your very posting substantiates what I said. You are correct in pointing out that atheism does NOT, and can NOT, take a stand on communism. This is entirely consistent with what I said before – that Christian teaching condemns the atrocities committed in its name, whereas atheism does not. I’m not saying that atheism should, because it clearly can not. I’m merely pointing out that if someone says, “Christian teaching should be rejected because of the horros committed in its name,” Christians can certainly use this argument in its own defense. In contrast, atheism can not, which further demonstrates that such an argument is self-defeating.
(Note that I say that Christian teaching condemns the atrocities, BTW. This is not dependent on any “organization and appointed spokes persons [sic],” to use your wording. Rather, the fundamental teachings themselves are in direct opposition to those actions.
See, Christ is not Jesus’ last name. He was Jesus of Nazareth. Christ means, the Savior. He was Jesus THE Christ. He meant, that other people would claim to be Christ or savior and not be believe them because they are blasphemers.
What you are referring to is commonly called the “Great Commission,” (a term which troubles me). However, it needs to be followed in a healthy way, in conjunction with Matt. 6. All too often, people seek their own praise or condemn others, which brings us to fundies…
Look up “Pharisee” in your concordance and you’ll find the answer to that. I saw the 700 Club when Falwell’s famous quote was originally stated and he would have been okay if he had said “WE” are to blame for this, but with the word “they” he made himself an accuser with no humility, which made him nothing more than a snob. Fundies want to force their attitudes and beliefs onto others. Jesus didn’t work this way. He was friendly to the most sinful peple and kept company with them. When they left he said “Go and sin no more,” but he never ried to force them to do anything. They saw he was good and wanted to be like him, that is letting your light shine, not telling people they are wrong or frightening them to believe as you. The people responsible for making me want to be a Christian have no idea of the influence they have. I want to give them praise, but their very nature is not to edify themselves. A fundie cannot be truly humble and still be a fundie. Someone once asked a thought-provoking question (and I wish I knew the source), “Are people seeing that you are a Christian, or are they seeing Christ in you?” That’s what it’s all about. My gay, pagan, witch friends are friends of mine because they respect my ability to mutually respect them. I never condemn them, I respect them and learn from them just as they learn from me. Do I hope they become Christians? Sure, but they probably think the same of me when they ask “How can you stand being a Christian when you have to hang out with those people?”
In your first two definitions, you are stating the same thing. In the last definition you are explaining the reason. I think most atheists would agree to all three except for one minor point. Atheists donft believe there is no God, they know there is no God as there is no evidence to prove otherwise. If for some miraculous reason some evidence were to present itself, then in light of evidence an atheist would then have to believe there is no God and a Christian (assuming God is a Christian God) in face of evidence would then be able to claim that they know therefs a God. Until that evidence presents itself, you have to believe in God, whereas I know there is no God.
For atheism to be able to condemn or in general have an opinion about an issue, there necessarily must be organization with some sort of manifesto or scripture. Atheism is none of that for it can not by its very nature be so. As an individual and an atheist, I do condemn all atrocities committed by communists and religious fanatics alike. However, I can not speak for all atheists.
Now in regards to communism, Karl Marx and Fredrick Engels were the founders of communism, and they produced a manifesto. In principle this manifesto did replace the bible in the Soviet Union. However, atheism was far from the corner stone of communist philosophy.
In this thread, Fredrick Engels has written a sort of Q and A, which might be helpful for you to understand what communism was all about.
In the Communist Manifesto written by Marx and Engels they identify the bourgeoisie and the proletariat as follows:
Atheism is rarely mentioned if at all. However, the two founders clearly lump the Pope with the Tsar and other bourgeoisie as the oppressors of the proletariat.
The flaw in Marx and Engelfs system was that it allowed the elevation to power of despots such as Stalin, something I am sure they would have been devastated by.
I have now presented you with the facts. I would recommend that you take a moment to read through the basic ideas of communism. You should find that atheism in communism was a very minor point and the whole picture was the liberation of the oppressed. Itfs ironic that it just replaced one set of oppressors with another, but that is a different story.
If after you have studied what communism is about and come back with another claim that atheism = communism, then you have selectively decided to ignore the facts.
Just keep in mind, atheism has yet to produce a suicidal fanatic.