Thoughts and opinions can change. That’s one obvious lesson of human history. Christians also give themselves an undue central perspective.
IF you’re interested in a small subset of the population from 2000 years ago, sure - but recall a couple of key points -
a) lots of other texts - even written purportedly by eye witnesses to jesus adventures - was specifically left out of the canon
b) the text you look at today is translated/transliterated and is done so from versions compiled hundreds of years after said events -
So - its a very limited insight and demonstrably false in many aspects - at best its an insight into early ‘christian’ belief and history - and thats debatable as well.
I don’t need further insight into the divinity of Jesus or anyone else. The insight I’m referring to is the more or less timeless insight into the more mundane stuff so to speak. Da people, abstractly. After all, religious belief is relevant to this day for a reason.
My point is that ‘holy texts’ only reflect the values and opinions of that subset of people and is not representative of the population as a whole - and may not include ALL of the texts that are related to the founding of the religion itself
And my point is that if they only reflect the values and opinions of a subset of a subset of people at some long past relatively short period of time then we wouldn’t be bothering with them as much.
Okay, you’ve made your opinion clear in here…let’s not turn this IMHO thread into a debate either.
Agreed. However, the two of you have touched on a topic that interests me. Is the Bible relevant for young parents. Let’s say for those that are in their late 20’s to early 40’s because these young couples seem to be disappearing from the local churches in Fremont, CA.
Idle Thoughts… what was that about? We can’t have debates here? :dubious: No wonder my thread got locked for no discernible purpose.
Debates are welcome here, which is why we have a forum called Great Debates. Oftentimes IMHO topics are just looking for opinions and hijacking one to start a debate in can be frowned upon.
To further avoid hijacking this one over rules discussion, feel free to open a thread in ATMB if you have any other further questions.
What’s the point of opinions if they can’t be debated? And stop using words like “hijack” because you’re making yourself look bad.
Open an ATMB topic if you wish to further discuss things.
The power of Christ compels you to exercise better judgment!
What do you know- it worked!
I notice that some posters have used the Nicene Creed and other such passages to indicate their beliefs. This is all very well and good that you believe these things, but I don’t think the question was “What do all Christians have in common?”, but more along the lines of “What do you, as a Christian, believe in?” Such responses put forth the idea that your beliefs match exactly those of other posters who post the same thing. I think that I would better understand what you as a person believes if you use your own words.
Just my opinion, of course.
Fair enough Czasrcasm, but I’m honestly more interested in focusing on the beliefs that Christians agree on than those we disagree on. Maybe because I’ve seen enough dissention in the church over issues that are completely peripheral. Christians used to fight over the proper way to baptize, or whether to stand or kneel at prayer, or whether there should be candles on the altar - denominations have split over these kinds of things. Today we fight over homosexuality, economic justice, the role of women in the church, or evolution. I have opinions on all these things but none of them make me a Chrstian - it’s because Friar Ted and gigi and I all subscribe to the ancient creeds that I know we have a lot more in common than those petty things we disagree on.
Fair enough, but I could get that same info from a pamphlet in any Christian foyer. Y’all may be Christians, but you are also individuals, otherwise your posts might as well consist of the word “Ditto”.
I’m not sure this is question about belief. 
My congregation seems to have an even age distribution. Uniform across all age groups, except for a lack of active members in their 20s. But they come back when they’re settled down in their 30s and have kids of their own.
We have separate programs for different life stages: elementary, teenage, families with young kids, adults without kids at home, retirees. It’s almost too segregated for my tastes, but it seems to work for this church.
Going to church is not simply about worshipping God. It’s about being in a community of Christians. Culture is important. Even if the theology is the same among several churches, the cultural imprint of the message is important.
I live in the greater Los Angeles area. Everyone is a minority here, so many people seek out others with the same identities. (For context, my congregation is Korean.) Church is an important part of that. Although the ministers don’t like to admit it, many members join for the culture rather than the religion. Of course, getting non-believers in the pews is worthy goal in itself.
In the end, churches must serve their communities or perish.
Okay, well, if it helps, personally I am a liberal mainline (Episcopalian) Christian. So on issues that divide Christians, I typically land of the more liberal or less restrictive side. I belive in evolution and in the scientific method when it comes to the natural world. I don’t interpret everything in the Bible literally. I accept most academic biblical scholarship concerning the authorship and evolution of the Bible. The rector (priest) of my church is a woman.
I prefer traditional hymns over contemporary praise songs. I prefer prayers from the prayer book over extemporaneous prayers. I don’t believe that anyone will spend eternity in Hell, but I might be wrong about that.
I believe in the two greatest commandments (“love God with all your heart, all your soul, and all your mind; and love your neighbor as yourself.”) Everthing else needs to be measured against these.
I also know that I don’t always live up to my own standards of what I think God expects of me. And when I don’t, I repent, resolve to do better, and ask for God’s help to do it.
Because 1) there is no Hell, 2) there is a Hell but nobody goes there, or 3) people go there but not for eternity?
Well, they’re certainly showing up at my local Assembly of God!