I am a moderate on the issues, but yes, I do see a bunch of pile-on, passive-aggressive bullshit in here. I dunno, I guess this forum might be therapeutic for some people… I mean seriously, some of you have some anger issues, even if this is the Pit.
I offer no sage advice or opinion, but I’m sure I’ll be told to fuck off quite soon. = )
Just because people on the left think that Bush is evil and incompetent doesn’t make it not so. Nor does the right’s dismissal of all criticism of Bush make it that Bush cannot be criticised, or that he is successful at what he does. Bush is a failure as a leader on every level: 9/11 was the result of Bush’s insistence on focusing on Iraq since Feb 01 per Clarke and O’Neil. He “refocused” terrorism efforts to conform with his predetermined view, which had nothing to do with reality, and the nation paid the price. He has run up deficits faster and further in real dollars than any previous administration and continues to do so, he has lied us into a war and exposed our own counter WMD team to punish one person who was complaining of those lies. I suppose that if one owns Halliburton and/or Bechtel stocks (and a few other small ones) that one would be estatic with that part of the past five years. But his increase the military powers to tackle the avain flu is like a Saturday Night Live parody of George W. Bush: “heh, heh, we gotta beef up the air force to shoot down birds, heh, heh, cause avain means bird, heh, heh, I’m really heh, smart!”
But if Bush’s defenders demand substance, how about I’m demanding substance from them: explain why, in detail, reducing the posse commitatus act will slow the spread or treat the avain flu. Don’t just give me the one sentence quarrantine argument, but point to the studies that show that any kind of flu can be controlled using quarrantine.
It’s one thing to mock a quote of a private citizen. Here are some actual quotes from the hero of the fascist right, a supposedly mature and responsible politician:
``Lucky me. I hit the trifecta,’’ Bush told Daniels shortly after the Sept. 11 attacks, according to the budget director.
Quotes from the George W. Bush: ( from Bob Woodward’s book) BUSH: “Look, our strategy is to create chaos, to create a vacuum.”
“I told all four that there are going to be some times where we don’t agree with each other, but that’s OK. If this were a dictatorship, it would be a heck of a lot easier, just so long as I’m the dictator,” Bush joked. (12/18/2000 CNN.com)
“I do not need to explain why I say things. — That’s the interesting thing about being the President. — Maybe somebody needs to explain to me why they say something, but I don’t feel like I owe anybody an explanation.” – In private interview with Bob Woodward for his book Bush at War
“There ought to be limits to freedom”
–at a Press conference at the Texas State House, May 21, 1999, referring to GWBush.com
Of course, one could come up with at least a dozen more ultra-arrogant Bush quotes.
Again, I want to emphasize that in a public debate, it is not the job of either side to convince the other, but rather to meet a burden of proof that would convince a neutral judge. I am well aware that there is a hardcore bunch of W lovers that will always think that their man is, as Harriet Miers says, “the most brilliant man I have ever met” and they will be sincere. Crazy, but sincere. But the public at large has caught on that the agenda of Bush is a disaster. November 06 cannot come soon enough for us.
Insofar as one can claim that a political center even exists, I think it’s safe to say he’s further to the right of it than I am to the left of it. And at least I’ll admit that I’m not a “moderate” (which is usually defined as “whatever the speakers’ views are” 
).
[QUOTE=Harborwolf]
The responses to his posts have showed no willingness to discuss the issue intelligently
[quote]
That’s because Weirddave’s reputation precedes him, and people prefer to save time. 
Why? You didn’t mock me or insult me personally, nor anyone else.
You evaluated the quality of the debate of your opponents. And for what it is worth, telling a person to “f*** off” isn’t passive-aggressive, it’s aggressive. Weirdave deserved it by personally mocking and insulting me. If he can’t take it, he shouldn’t dish it out. Today’s liberals aren’t going to be pushed around physically or verbally without a fight, and we promise a good fight.
From your lips to the Ears…
Bob Loblaw, big ass post so I ain’t gonna quote it. Save the hamsters and all.
I’m pretty far from a Bush supporter. Overall I agree with his stance on just about everything. I do think that calling him a tyrant or referring to the right as fascists is a bit silly. Apparently that makes me a moderate these days.
As far as the effectiveness of the military in a quarantine situation goes, I’m gonna bet there ain’t been no such study. Pandemics are a rare thing thankfully. I’d be willing to guess that they aren’t going to be effective given how quickly these sorts of bugs spread. I do support having all ideas on the table though. It reeks of practicality. I’d like to think that for once the administration is putting some advance thought into something beyond bombing the fuck outta someone.
Lastly, I don’t think that this is some sort of desperate power grab or rush to tyranny on the part of the right. Maybe it’s my boyish optimism. Maybe it’s an allergy to tinfoil.
I hope that covers most everything.
Maybe it isn’t a grab for royal powers. Maybe it’s the same old gross incompetence and stupidity instead. I still can’t believe people actually re-elected him.
Well, I’d certainly prefer to think that than what I do think.
As for the charge of fascist, I’d prefer that the Bush-bots not be fascists, but really, they are. Yes, it sounds silly and trite, but they are ultra-national corporatists, and that’s the very definition of fascism. And yes, it sounds hippy long haired to call someone a fascist, but these guys start wars on lies and torture people, they are fascists. And all the Democrats except Barbara Lee went merrily along with it.
If you and your fellow travellers felt so strongly about it, why didn’t you do anything in November '04 when it really mattered?
Oh, wait, you probably did, but you lost. Oh, well.
Actually, as I stated earlier, that’s how I read her remarks. And, as I stated earlier, I hope that I am wrong. It certainly wasn’t my intent to deceive.
Zev Steinhardt
It’s time for Huffington to cut the cord on that loon. She goes take everyone down with her.
For what it’s worth, it was you who told me to fuck off. No adressing the issue at hand, just “Fuck you, clown”. It’s late, and tomorrow I can address the issues, but for now I’d just like to point out again that it was you that started the baseless name calling, not I.
you’re invoking the ‘you started it’ defense? really? and just what issue was this post addressing (vs. simple insult)?
I think you could be a bit more appreciative of such expert advice.
Ehhh, fair enough, you have a point, although that post by me was directed at the (lack of) content in that post. I had thought that was a response to Boblibdem, not Bob Lablah, I got my morons confused.
You’d be wrong, but just for shits and giggles, why don’t you outline exactly why you feel that way? What positions do I hold, what beliefs do I have, that put me so far to the extreme right? (further to the right than you are to the left) Go on, rjung, the floor is yours, you have over 7,000 posts going back more than five years to use to make your case, make it. I await patiently.
So, you see my name, your knee jerks into your brain, and you respond without bothering to read what I’ve actually said? That actually goes a long way towards explaining why your posts tend to lack content. Thanks for clearing that up.
Oh and by the way, did anyone else notice that since Harborwolf pointed out that nobody was bothering to talk about the actual issue at hand, there have been any number of posts from people who profess to be to the left of the political spectrum…and not one of them has addressed the issue of the military, quarantine, the flu, etc? Just a bunch of nattering and gromishing about how much they hate Bush, no substance at all.
Sorry, Weirddave, but I have better (and more profitable ) things to do on a Sunday morning than to go sifting through your posting history and pluck out examples of your craziness. I’ll just point out that your repeated insistences that you aren’t a conservative loony doesn’t make it so, but I’m sure it won’t stop you from trying to pretend otherwise…
In other words, no, you can’t back up your claim, you’re just talking out of your ass.
Hey, I thought you were going to pull up a chair inside your cage and wait for the people the play with feces? You decided to come back, uh-huh.
Okay, if you actually read the posts, people have pretty well disposed of the idea that the military can combat the avain flu, quarantine it and have even offered support for the fact that Bush uses everything to try to grab more power.
Again, it is the not the burden of proof of your debating opponents to convince you, but rather to the standard of a neutral judge. All you’ve done is call some names, including the aggrieved mother, you’ve offered no new arguments since your original posts. The debate has been over from your side for quite some time. So why do you keep posting insults? Are you paid to do that? Is it obsessive/compulsive? Are you under the impression your insults are going to convince anyone watching?
The Bush administration is hated/disliked/opposed because they are incomptent, venal and dishonest like the ocean is wet. The remaining Bush supporters can pretend to be in high dudgeon about it all they want, but Bush and his minions are so thoroughly failures that they are not qualified to be an evil version of Barney Fife on the Andy Griffith Show. I wish I coined it, but somebody else already called them the Mayberry Machiavellis, and for good reason: they are stupid and evil.
