El Kabong may I ask if you have had regular blood tests for liver function, cholesterol and prostate etc? I ask as I have an abdominal ultra scan next week and reading this thread has me packing death!
Let us know what’s up man.
Thanks. Hopefully nothing- it will be the week later when I get the results.
Nobody has mentioned Tylenol as a causative factor!
If you have had chronic aches and pains throughout your life, self-medicating with Tylenol could do great damage. And far too many combo OTC drugs contain acetaminophen for the additional “aches and pains.”
I’ve suffered from migraines always, and my go-to pillbottle was ibuprofen. Until the day my doctor said, “Your kidney function isn’t so hot.”
~VOW
I’ve suspected Tylenol myself but I wouldn’t be so bold as to suggest it to other people. My thoughts are if it is bad for the liver in less than an order of magnitude higher dosage than usual, it’s probably bad in the normal dose.
The “normal” dose taken 3x daily for 25-30 years, yup.
~VOW
And don’t forget, until 2011 the maximum dose was 4,000 mg/day. That’s when they lowered it to 3,000 mg. A 25% reduction in maximum daily dosage is pretty significant.
Ibuprofen isn’t acetaminophen. Not that anything taken daily over a great length of time can’t be hurtful.
StG
Acetaminophen can and does cause acute hepatitis, and overdoses of it cause a lot of deaths due to liver failure regularly. Particularly when mixed with alcohol.
However, I’m not aware of any association with the chronic use of acetaminophen causing liver disease. The literature is pretty clear that even daily doses of up to 4 grams, taken regularly for years and year, are well tolerated and don’t cause chronic liver issues for well over 99% of patients. And that even includes patients with chronic Hepatitis C infections. However, the standard recommendation for them at present is to not exceed 2 grams a day, as all too often, people can end up consuming acetaminophen unknowingly as it’s added into so many other ‘shotgun’ pills including OTC products for cold symptoms, headache preparations, alka-seltzer, midol, etc. etc.
Also, if cirrhosis is involved, then acetaminophen usage needs to be restricted significantly, depending on how advanced the cirrhosis is.
So I have no concerns about recommending its chronic use in proper dosage for my patients, and for most patients in general.
I know the difference.
At one point I was indeed taking ibuprofen daily, because my head hurt…constantly.
I had all the stupid tests, and neuro consults, and I’d be given pain pills reluctantly. However, I had a home, a family, bills, and a job, and I HAD to function.
I was in my forties when the blessing of sumatriptan finally reached the market.
~VOW
Sorry, just saw this.
No regular test for liver function. It was the first one I had done that turned up my condition. Cholesterol is fine. Underwent treatment for Prostate cancer several years ago, no big issues there at the moment.
The endoscopy didn’t turn up any signs of portal hypertension. There were a couple of relatively minor, non-liver-related issues. I’ve not yet had a formal sit-down with my GE yet to discuss he results, but will be arranging that this week.
And I am fine.
Great news!! Now, stay that way.
Thank you although I was a bit mystified why I was sent for one in the first place. I had pains in the “guts” but as I had been on holidays for six weeks and drinking far more than I should at my age, I can understand. My liver bloos tests came back as dine but the GGT tests were way higher than they should have been- so if I didn’t have the ultra sound I would have been concerned anyway.
I do have genuine sympathy for El Kabong and FGIE. It is not that difficult (for most people) to abstain but not having the option of a cold beer on a hot day is challenge.
(My doctor told me after the good news that I should have 2 beers instead of 22, and I said “Well I’m still going to the local football club to celebrate this afternoon but I’ll stop at 21” He laughed and said he would arrange an Uber for me to get home. I have been seeing him for 20 years so he knows my lifestyle).
One last thing- it is probably a wake up call I needed. Not so much for myself. as I don’t really care if I make 90, but when you think of what you do for others- as in organising the bills etc I owe it to others to be more accountable.
I’m new. I came across your post and thought I’d give you my 2 cents.
My mom was diagnosed with cirrhosis over a year ago. She had Fatty Liver disease for years and now cirrhosis secondary to NASH. Couple things I have learned through this and forgive me if anyone has already mentioned these.
There are 2 types of cirrhosis. Compensated and Decompensated. Compensated cirrhosis can be managed. Lifestyle/diet changes, regular appointments, etc. It has a way better prognosis than Decompensated. However, all Compensated cirrhosis will eventually go to Decompansated. It just about slowing it down.
READ YOUR LABS! Most places have patient portals. I suggest you get access to them if you haven’t already done so. Pay attention to your ALP (alkaline phosphatase), AST, ALT, INR, Protime, ALbumin, Sodium, Bilirubin and GFR. The first 3 are mostly liver enzymes. They will rise as cirrhosis gets worse. Your INR/Protime tells you about how your blood coagulates. Very important if you have portal hypertension. Albumin will go down and Sodium will rise as your liver gets worse. Bilirubin can rise also (this is what makes jaundice) and finally GFR. GFR is a measurement of your kidney function. Liver, kidneys and heart issues can all go hand and hand. The worse your liver is, the lower your GFR can go. Renal impairment is a classic complication. GFR should be 60+ in healthy individuals.
MELD and CP score-If the doctors don’t give you these you can find them yourself if you are armed with the above lab information. They are prognosis markers. They are not 100% so don’t read too much into them as cirrhosis has a very uneven trajectory.
Liver cancer-Very common in cirrhosis. Make sure you are being screened for possible tumors. Another lab value called CEA can detect cancer however I believe it is more common in colon cancer screenings than liver.
I’m sure I have more information in my brain and if you have questions, I may be able to answer them. My mom is getting worse each day and I’ve done extensive research into her conditions. She has colon cancer, diabetes, cirrhosis, CKD, heart failure, MS…the list is extensive however it looks like the liver is what will give out first.