Cities with two major-league football/baseball teams... how do you cope?

I’ve got a baseball team I follow (Texas Rangers) and a football team I am a devoted fan to (Dallas Cowboys)… AL and NFC, respectively, so I’m mostly concerned with these conferences and pay less attention to the NL and AFC (although I’d count the Astros as my “second” choice–and the Oilers in the days of old; MWM seeking AFC team to root for, but I digress…). When I was a kid, I envied those of you in dual-team markets (Chicago and New York, especially, and LA off-and-on) because y’all have an AL and NL team (NYC, Chicago and LA) and an AFC and NFC team (New York and sometimes LA). [Note that that’s where my envy both began and ended.]

But–I learned–that’s not so! Cubs fans ain’t White Sox fans, Mets fans ain’t Yankee fans, etc… I think…

Questions:

  1. Is this true? If you like one do you shun the other? If you like both, is it considered aberrant behavior?
  2. How are these cities polarized with respect to the teams? How would you–if you can–generalize a fan of one versus the other?
  3. Assuming that maybe everybody’s actually okay with both teams, how would these cities be divided if the Giants met the Jets in the Superbowl (God Forbid!), or if the Mets met the Yankees or the Cubs met the White Sox or the A’s met the Dodgers (well… 'burbs versus the city–I can see that division) in the World Series?

Intense, passionate Yankees fans will never root for the Mets (and vice versa), and intense, passionate Cub fans will never root for the White Sox (and vice versa). Casual baseball fans, on the other hand, will root for either/both.

You have to remember that, back in the 1950s, Brooklyn Dodger fans HATED the Yankees with an undescribable venom. When the DOdgers abandoned their fans to get rich in L.A., those DOdger fans were NOT about to become Yankee fans! THAT’s why they pushed so hard to get a National League expansion team- the Mets (and why the early Mets filled their roster with former Brooklyn Dodger stars). The Mets were to be “the new Dodgers.”

Of course, YOUNGER baseball fans in New York don’t know that and don’t care. But the core Mets fan base still hates the Yankees the way the used to hate the Dodgers. What’s maddening to MEts fans is, Yankees fans DON’T hate the Mets. THey do something worse: they completely IGNORe the MEts, just as they ignored the old BRooklyn DOdgers.!

  1. It is true. I’ve always been a Yankee fan, my brother a Met fan. Liking both is kinda wishy-washy. However, if the Yankees don’t get in the World Series, the Mets do, and they’re facing the Red Sox, it’s acceptable to root for the Mets (see 1986). I also know that alot of Yankee fans were rooting for the Mets during last season’s playoffs, so that we could kick their asses in the world series.
  2. The stereotype is that the Yankee fans are upper-middle class from Westchester and Jersey, Met fans are more inner city, and Long Island. Which is baloney. Both teams have a cross-section of fans.
  3. When the Yankees and Mets meet in the 2000 World Series, New York will be “divided” into about a million little pieces. I can’t wait!

Hmmm. Was there a class distinction when it was Yanks/Giants/Dodgers?

A question that I always intended to post to the SDMB, but found too ridiculous to post:

RASTAHOMIE: “Chicago has two major league baseball teams. So does New York. Are there any cities with two minor league ball teams?”

CECIL: “Sometimes I think Chicago has two minor league ball teams.”

hee hee hee

Seriously, though. I read somewhere that if you’re in Chicago and someone says they’re a fan of both the Cubs and the Sox, check your wallet.

As for me, I’m an intense Cubs fan. I’ve never had any animosity toward the Sox or their fans, but that may be related to the fact that I’m not from Chicago but from Springfield. Most of the Cubs fans there direct their anger toward the St. Louis Cardinals, as did I. Then I went and married a Cards fan, and my life got all complicated.

Oakland A’s, Los Angeles Dodgers. I don’t see the connection. Oakland is a suburb of San Francisco.
As for that situation, I’m a rabid Giants fan (I know, I know, you’re all shocked) and I hate the A’s with a skewering passion.
It’s a great rivalry. I went to a Giants/A’s game at the Coliseum, and, man o man, that was a crowd. Yelling, swearing, fighting. And the two teams aren’t even in the same leagues! We got some great crowds for OAK/SF games. Even though the A’s fans are all losers. :wink:


JMcC, San Francisco, JJM’s page from the Bay
If I were beaned with a fastball, fling my limp, lifeless body to first, cause, dammit, I earned it!

I always get amused when a new professional team is added someplace down in the Sun Belt, like the state of Florida. God forbid that fans there travel 100 miles to root for a professional sports team (or just support them by watching them on TV).

Growing up in Northern Michigan, you rooted for the Lions, Red Wings, Tigers, Pistons, despite the fact they were about 4 hours’ drive away (and despite the fact they generally sucked).

The fact that the woosies in the Sun Belt can’t seem to do the same is dramatically diluting the talent pool in every sport, and is lessening the quality of each.


“I am a news-paper man, damn it! Come to the point with me, sir, or take your business elsewhere!” - T. Herman Zweibel, Publisher, The Onion

Rasthomie, it is always nice to see another Cubs fan on the boards. Like you, I live outside of Chicago (Orlando right now), so I don’t necessarily hate the ChiSox, but I definitely don’t want them winning anything before the Cubs do.

As for living in a state with a continually multiplying number of pro teams, most people seem to really like one team, kinda like another, and despise a third (which usually ends up being the Miami Dolphins).

Of course, all the NFL teams I like are sitting at home for the playoffs, so I’ll just root for the Rams and the Colts.


Well, shut my mouth. It’s also illegal to put squirrels down your pants for the purposes of gambling.

Oops… I meant to say “Angels met the Dodgers”–Anaheim versus LA. I was thinking about the A’s and Giants while I was typing the OP, but left them out… Well, obviously I didn’t leave them totally out, so please substitute “Angels” for “A’s” in all references to the Athletics in the OP!

D’oh!

Anybody have any insight on the NYGiants versus the NYJets? I’d always assumed that the Jets are more “New York”, thanks to Joe Namath… and of course I prefer them to the hated Giants! But, not being a NYer, my opinion on this matchup doesn’t count (at least towards answering my own OP).

As far as football is concerned, the Giants rule New York (I say this as a committed Jets fan). The only time when the Jets seemed to get more interest was when they won the Superbowl.

Right now, the Yankees are more popular than the Mets (I’m a Mets fan). That fluctuates more, though. The Mets ruled in the 80s, the Yankees in the 90s.

In hockey, the Rangers always seem to be tops, even when the Islanders were winning all those Stanley Cups (I’m a Rangers fan). The Devils don’t seem to interest NYC people.

In basketball, it’s the Knicks, except for the short time when the Nets had Julius Erving.

No one roots for two NY teams in a sport. If there is another subway series, it would be just as if two different cities were playing. Worse, actually, because you want to show that your team is the best in the city.

“East is east and west is west and if you take cranberries and stew them like applesauce they taste much more like prunes than rhubarb does.” – Marx

Read “Sundials” in the new issue of Aboriginal Science Fiction. www.sff.net/people/rothman

We have the opposite problem in DC: only one baseball team for two cities, Baltimore & Washington.

It’s really strange being at an Orioles game when they play Oakland: The O’s vs. the A’s. :slight_smile:


Everybody got to elevate from the norm - Rush

Rastahomie:

First of all, there are some cities in Florida which play host to more than one Gulf Coast League team, at the lowest minor league level.

In the mid-90’s, Nashville had the AAA-level Sounds and the and the AA-level XPress. I’m not sure exactly how long that situation lasted.

Back in the old, old days, the Pacific Coast League had two San Francisco teams (the Seals and the Missions), and the Hollywood Stars could have been said, with some justification, to be a second LA team (the LA Angels being the first).


Chaim Mattis Keller
cmkeller@compuserve.com

“Sherlock Holmes once said that once you have eliminated the
impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be
the answer. I, however, do not like to eliminate the impossible.
The impossible often has a kind of integrity to it that the merely improbable lacks.”
– Douglas Adams’s Dirk Gently, Holistic Detective

The Hollywood Stars and the LA Angels were bitter rivals and different parts of the city backed each team.

The American League Angels shared Dodger Stadium from 1962-1965, but they were always poor cousins to the Dodgers.

Now that the Angels play in Anaheim they are slightly richer cousins, but still the “other” team.

This isn’t that hard. I follow both the Yankees and the Mets. My heart is with the Mets always, but you simply can’t ignore nor help but admire the Yankees under Joe Torre. Besides, I just want good baseball. I don’t have that tough a time rooting for both teams, although any time interleague play has them face off, I root wholeheartedly for the Metsies.

In football, it’s easier. I root for Buffalo, which, BTW, is the only professional football team New York has, seeing as how both the Gimps and the Jerks play in New Jersey. In fact, the dog-ass Jets are so lamoid they play their home games at Giants Stadium. Sheesh!

My biggest problem is that my son professes to be a Miami Dolphins fan.

where did I go wrong?


The Dave-Guy
“since my daughter’s only half-Jewish, can she go in up to her knees?” J.H. Marx

I’m from Philadelphia. Growing up, we watched ABC’s “Wide World of Sports”. It was the safest option. :slight_smile:

Cartooniverse

" If you want to kiss the sky, you’d better learn how to kneel. "

Apologies if this question was solely directed at American football/baseball, and not about cities with divided sporting loyalties generally…but I’m bored and I feel like posting, and there’s not much else I’m remotely qualified to comment on. Sorry.

In the rest of the world it’s not unusual for every major city to have more than one team in whatever the major national sport is (e.g. Australian rules football teams in Sydney, football - soccer - teams in most of Europe and South America, rugby teams in some places).

Regarding the specific questions (edited slightly by me)…

  1. Yes to both. Fans of English football (soccer) teams often have a near-pathological hatred of their neighbours - Liverpool and Everton, Manchester City and Manchester United, Celtic and Rangers (Glasgow), although that one has a fairly nasty basis in religious bigotry, Tottenham Hotspur and Arsenal (London). Don’t bring out the tired cliches about riots and football hooligans, though - apart from a tiny minority of idiots there isn’t really much trouble these days.

  2. Depends on you as an individual. Most fans stereotype their opposition, though, or play on past humiliations (e.g. “A burglar broke into Manchester City’s trophy room today and stole the entire contents. Police are on the lookout for a man with a roll of light blue carpet.”)

  3. Completely and utterly. Derby matches are always the big draws for fans and the associated minority of nutters.


I never touched him, ref, honest!

The division of baseball fans in Chicago runs like this, in my experience growing up here:

Most people on the north side of town are Cubs fans. Everyone on the south side of town is a Sox fan. People on the west side are split between the two pro teams and any one of several minor league teams that play in the area.

Sox fans like to think of themselves as ‘blue collar,’ and they think of Cub fans as ‘white collar’ (the difference being that, in their opinion, they work for a living).

Cubs fans like to think of themselves as ‘true fans’ (since they always show up, no matter what place the cubs are in – sometimes I think they actually sell more tickets when they’re in last place). They think of Sox fans as ‘fair-weather fans, who don’t really appreciate the game’ since it always seems like Comisky Park doesn’t sell out unless it’s the first week of the season, the Sox are in 1st place with a 10 game lead, or it’s Beanie Baby day.

The really funny thing is that in the day before interleague play, when the outcome of games played by the team across town could not possibly have any effect whatsoever on one’s own team, people still rooted to see the team across town lose. I’ll admit that, growing up on the north side of Chicago, there were more than a few occasions when news of a Sox loss brought a smile to my face.

I’ve never met a Dodgers fan who hated the Angels (that’s what the Giants are for) nor an Angels fan who hated the Dodgers.

Perhaps, it’s because the two teams aren’t technically in the same city, either geographically or in name (now that Disney is selling, I hope they go back to being the California Angels.)

The real reason is probably that Angelinos just aren’t very passionate about spectator sports. We tend to leave during the 7th inning because we plan on going surfing or hiking or sailing, early the next morning. Most of us couldn’t care less if we ever get another NFL team. I don’t think I’m alone in thinking that we have one too many basketball teams (Kalamazoo Clippers has a nice ring to it). I don’t know how the hell we ended up with so many Hockey teams.

I’ve yet to see a Cubs game at Dodger Stadium where the Chicago fans didn’t outnumber the LA fans.

You gotta see the “This is the Meadowlands” series of ads Nike shows up here. Basically involves various Jets and Giants players playing sick practical jokes on each other. I love the angry dog in Curtis Martin’s locker.

Of course, the Adidas Yankee ads reign supreme.


If I wanted smoke blown up my ass, I’d be at home with a pack of cigarettes and a short length of hose.

Dodger fans will outnumber Cub fans at a game at Dodger Stadium. However, the Dodger fans just don’t make much noise.
The other factor is that all the fans root for Sammy Sosa.

The Dodgers sell a lot of season tickets (more than the Cubs) and those fans are not known for their passion.