Classic rock; timeless goodness or evidence that you are hopeless?

Posts like these are hilarious to me, because the underlying sentiment is exactly the same as that spouted by “old people” of your own generation - you know, the ones who were unimpressed by Elvis in the '50s, the Beatles in the '60s, or Pink Floyd in the '70s. “I’ve only heard the five or ten songs they always play on <whatever equivalent of Top 40 radio floats your boat> and they all sounded the same after one listen. Music today sucks!”

:smack:

Here’s the real deal.

Popular music has never, never been more varied than it is today.

RealityChuck: You like prog-ish rock with lots of noodling? There’s tons of bands out there for you - Mars Volta, Muse, Coheed and Cambria. Hell, Rush and Dream Theater are both still around and making music right now.

JohnDiFool: You want listenable, something that hits the right spot down at a visceral level and kicks ass? I give you Passion Pit and The New Pornographers, two bands that produce music of such exuberant, uninhibited joyfulness that you can’t help but sing along.

MTCicero: You’re sick of ironic navel-gazing and a lack of “real emotion”? Give The Hold Steady or Mountain Goats a try. I see you’ve already mentioned The White Stripes, which aren’t exactly a band only loved by classic rock fans. If being “cool and relevant” requires one to sound like Stephen Malkmus (who, incidentally, has written some pretty fucking earnest songs), then Jack White wouldn’t be anywhere near the top of the charts. Instead, he’s one of the most successful musicians of the past fifteen years.

Part of the problem in this thread is that at no point has “classic rock” been defined. We’re seeing people say that “classic rock” is 80s rock, or than “classic rock” is the prog rock of the 70s, or that “classic rock” is the Beatles. Does that mean that anything older than X years is “classic rock”? Because I hate to break it to you, but that means that the day is rapidly approaching when 90s rock and even 00s rock will be “classic rock.”

It’s human nature to be particularly enamored of the style of music being made during one’s formative years. Not just the genre, but also the production style, the common beats, the time signatures, the prevalent chord progressions, the vocal styles, the instruments used, etc. It’s natural because those are the years when we are first discovering what we like, and when we have both the time and energy to really delve into the music of the time. Once people grow up, though, and no longer have the time to endlessly browse through the record store/ radio stations/ iTunes store/ Pandora, as well as run into the growing difficulty of staying abreast of modern technology. Eventually, it’s just not feasible for most people to stay as “plugged in” as they did in their teenage years. And sadly, as evidenced by this thread, many such adults, rather than recognizing and accepting their own obsolescence (NOT intended as a slight, to be clear), they instead reach the conclusion that the limited modern music they remain exposed to is representative of ALL modern music. And therefore modern music sucks.

Fifty years ago, this meant that adults who grew up on Elvis sneered at these pretty boys from Britain who sang in three-part harmony and wore their hair long in the front. Thirty years ago, this meant that fans of those same pretty boys sneered at heavy metal in all its overwrought hypermasculinity and pretension. Ten years ago, the adults who had been metalheads in their youth sneered at hip hop, calling it “nonmusical” and “unartistic,” despite the fact that rappers like Public Enemy or OutKast wove lyrical tapestries that spoke of their generation’s deepest values and issues with a sophistication that made the best words Ozzy Osbourne ever wrote look like a five year old’s first attempt at rhyming.

I’m not saying that modern music fans are better than “classic rock” fans, whomever they may be. I hope to hell that my generation doesn’t some day sit around grousing about how music was so much better when Pearl Jam and Nirvana ruled the airwaves, or when Radiohead crashed the file sharing services with “Kid A,” or when the Decemberists released their seminal prog-folk records… but I know we will. Because it’s human nature. But I do hope that we’ll have finally learned not to be so damned obnoxious about our Old Person Elitism.

A side note to address the inevitable reply of “But I was born in the 80s and I love 70s rock!” Some of us might veer out of our “birth” decades, but inevitably this means looking backwards, because obviously it’s impossible for someone to spend time absorbing the music of the future, which hasn’t even been written yet. So you get 90s kids who love 70s prog, 00s kids who love 60s guitar rock, and we will surely have some 2020s kids who rediscover the dour pleasure of grunge. But the important bit is that you’re still internalizing the tropes and standard practices of your chosen style/ decade/ etc - and once you’ve reached that “old person” plateau, you’re (probably) just as cooked as everyone else.

And here’s the inevitable “here’s my playlist; see, even though I love classic rock I am not an old fogey” post.

I mentioned in the OP that I’m a big fan of both Stolen Babies and Sleepytime Gorilla Museum. I once drove 17 freakin’ hours and crossed the border into Canada to see a show with Stolen Babies, Within Temptation, and The Gathering (which may be in my top three of all-time favorite bands). The Gathering (last link is a song about Mozart) caught my ear after listening to a sampler CD. I looked for them in Best Buy and found Sleepy Buildings, their semi-acoustic live album, and I was absolutely hooked from there, and secretly in love with Anneke van Giersbergen (We’re the same age AND we have the exact same birthdate! When I first met her after a concert I felt like a little kid meeting a superhero; I nearly passed out when she gave me a hug!)

Also in my current top three bands of all time, joining The Gathering:
Opeth. Are they prog? Are they black metal? Are they _________? Who knows? All I know is, they’re an amazing band. Listen to Ghost of Perdition and then Face of Melinda and tell me that you’re not at least appreciative of their musicianship, even if you’re not a fan of the style. And please let the songs develop; I know Ghost of Perdition starts off pretty hard, but stick with it…the song is like a shapeshifter, every few minutes it’s a completely different sound.

The third band in my top three? INXS. Woah! Probably didn’t see that coming. For some reason I always feel like I need to justify being a fan of INXS, like it’s a guilty pleasure. But really, I’ve just enjoyed their music, from their humble roots as a kind of quirky punk band to their more mature work like Full Moons, Dirty Hearts. Michael Hutchence was, for my money, one of the most charismatic and entertaining front men in popular music and at least when I was growing up, nearly everybody was enthralled by him; girls wanted to do all sorts of naughty things to him and even guys admitted that this guy had it going on, whatever “it” was.

I just checked my iPod playlist; I’ve got a few older bands/artists on there:
Kansas
CSNY
Heart
Hall and Oates
Aerosmith
Bad Company (they might actually be fourth on my all-time list)
Anne Murray (!)
AC/DC
Parliament
LL Cool J

For the most part, though, I’ve got more modern music:
Obviously, The Gathering, Opeth and INXS are on there.
Green Carnation (seriously, listen to this)
Stolen Babies
Sleepytime Gorilla Museum
Circus of Dead Squirrels (this will either make you smile or reach for holy water)
Wolfmother
Arctic Monkeys
Rilo Kiley (OK, maybe THEY are number 4)
Ani Difranco
Sublime
Incubus
Metallica
Shadows Fall
Devildriver
Dream Evil (FIRE! BATTLE! IN METAL!) (over the top, but if you love metal, you can’t NOT love this stuff)
Citizen Cope
Minus the Bear (These guys are gonna be the classic rock of the future, if there is any justice)
Mandagora Scream
White Stripes
Jet
Aghora
Agalloch
Nightwish
Otep
Pure Reason Revolution
Porcupine Tree
UneXpect
Giant Squid
Agua de Annique (because I’ll always love Anneke!)

Agree with Tanbarkie and whoever it was upthread who said the quality of pop/rock music has been consistent across the decades. People who say all “indie” rock sounds the same (and is therefore not as good as classic rock) are just as hopeless as people who disregard all classic rock. It’s closed-minded and reactionary.

Since I like music, not just a particular genre or sub-genre, there’s plenty of classic rock I like (and a shit-ton I don’t like, just like indie or anything else you could name). Dismissing an entire type of music as “for ironic hipsters” or “for old fogeys” only means you’re missing out on a lot of excellent stuff (I know better than to even bother bringing up hip-hop on this board; there’s a definite old fogey strain with regards to that genre), and it’s just as elitist as what you accuse the “other side” of being. In the end, there are people who like music and people who really only like the pose, which they’ve gotten inextricably linked with the actual music.

Whatever the hell you are listening to, TURN IT THE FUCK DOWN! I’m trying to watch Jeopardy!.

And here’s your inevitable reply of “I was born in the 70s and I prefer 2000’s rock to everything else!” post. I “get” the various varieties of emo much more than grunge, goth, or other 80s and 90s alternative music. Of course, I got turned on to it in the beginning because a lot of it sounded like early 90s indie/hardcore, so there you go. I’ve internalized the music of my 30s much moreso than of my teens or twenties (of course, I"ve internalized the music of the 70s moreso than of my youth, so I count for your former category as well.)

Yeah - I don’t mean to imply that what I wrote above applies to everyone. There are outliers in every generation. Many of these are “music fans” rather than "X-style-of-rock fans, like woodstockbirdybird. These are people who consider music such an important part of their lives that they put in a fair amount of effort to seek out new music well after most of their contemporaries, and who are open-minded enough not to instinctively recoil from something that sounds alien to their established sensibilities.

Other outliers include those like yourself, who find commonalities between older styles of music and more recent styles (often skipping a decade or two in the middle). I fit this category as well - I grew up loving bands like They Might Be Giants, R.E.M., Sublime, and the Pixies, and find that their distinctive characteristics (oddball/enigmatic lyrics, “song-based” structures rather than noodling, use of atonal noise as a musical tool) remain a big part of what I enjoy in today’s music. That’s why bands like The New Pornographers, Radiohead, Ted Leo and the Pharmacists, and Spoon tend to top my list of “best 00s bands.” Similarly, when it comes to the older stuff, I’m drawn more to bands like the Beatles or the Clash than, say, Genesis.

The important thing is that, just because I’m not terribly enamored of metal or prog, doesn’t mean I don’t recognize its artistic value. I have enormous respect for the guys in Rush as musicians, and it’s undeniable that the godfathers of metal, in addition to Rawking Hard, also wrote damn good songs. And for those areas of music that I know little, like disco - well, I would not be so presumptuous as to claim that they somehow lack substance. After all, what the hell do I know? I’ve only ever heard “Stayin’ Alive.” I’m not about to judge the accumulated work of thousands of musicians based on one shitty song.

I think some classic rock is timeless goodness. I love Pink Floyd and Led Zeppelin and Bob Dylan, for example, and there are countless other bands I have on my list of artists-I-need-to-discover-properly. But the complete Beatles discography sits comfortably on my shelves somewhere between the complete ABBA and the complete Britney Spears.

That’s where I think it can fall into “hopeless” territory. It’s all well and good to have classic rock as the only genre you like - hey, some people only connect with one type of music, and I definitely don’t think everyone should be forced to like ABBA and Britney for the sake of diversity. But you simply say “I do not like that” and move on. People who go on crusades of music snobbery - “I ONLY LIKE CLASSIC ROCK AND EVERYTHING ELSE IS AWFUL, IT’S NOT EVEN MUSIC, REAL MUSIC DIED LONG AGO” - that’s when you’ve (general you) got problems.

And it goes for any genre, hip-hop, metal, classical - I’ve even known mainstream pop fans who have the same snobby attitude mostly associated with the “get off my lawn” crowd. If a genre of music you don’t like sends you into such fits of rage that somebody else dare find enjoyment in it, that’s just… ridiculous.

PS I’m not saying anyone is this thread has reacted that way, I’m just saying that type of attitude is when I would apply the word “hopeless” to the situation.