Comey Indictment for Seashell Post -- Anything to Worry About?

Politics & Elections
21

Anything to worry about? Yes, the sorry state of our Justice Dept. This is such a gobstoppingly stupid meritless indictment. Clearly only meant to attack and harass.

Where was the trump indictment when, as a candidate, he posted a video of a pickup truck with a photrealistic image of a hog-tied Biden on the tailgate? The hypocrisy is just jaw-dropping.

Oh but, Comey posts an image of seashells spelling out 8647 – oh, dear me, how threatening :weary_cat:

ETA: that link may be paywalled, so here’s a direct link to a clip from the video that candidate trump posted:

22

The idea that it’s a threat to the president is a complete fabrication to rationalize crushing free speech and frighten potential adversaries into silence. Every attorney involved in this should be disbarred.

23

Blanche said there had been an ongoing investigation. What is there to investigate? Seriously! Did they consult a marine biologist to ID the shells?

24

It’s more of a political, than a legal, problem. So you want a team of high clout lawyers.

On another note, seashells huh. That’s a threat…really. It’s cute, right. I’m wondering what is the level of “cuteness” that can be used to convey a threat to kill the President to be charged for a crime. Like, a bunch of puppies arranged to form 86 47. Kittens playing with balls of yarn. I wish the internet would just be flooded with this stuff right now.

It’s a shame DOJ is debasing itself in this way. But to equate the charge to any kind of real legal jeopardy for Comey is just not a thing I can envision. I mentioned the on one of the previous indictments, the problem, even with these “charges”, is when they get to people who cannot afford to pay for clout/good lawyers. Even with junk charges, without proper fighting, you can get steamrolled.

25

You forget that the judiciary is in the process of being suborned too.

Put a crooked prosecution in front of a crooked judge and you get 100% conviction rates. Just like in e.g. Russia.

26

Nail on the head.

Yes, there’s a lot to worry about. Selective and malicious prosecution of anyone is an appalling abuse of power.

27

My worry is that Comey is convicted, creating a terrible first amendment precedent.

Selective prosecution? No need to worry about that. it’s already here.

The safety of a president who has been repeatedly targeted for assassination is an extremely emotional issue for Trump voters. And by taking down the post, Comey effectively admitted there was something wrong with it. And the jury pool would come from a Trumpy area.

I’m NOT the type who says Trump voters are evil bastards who will always do what Donald wants. But it seems to me that when it comes to interpreting something as a physical threat against their leader, they will defer to the government.

So, if it gets that far, hung jury? Maybe, but in a jury room, it is hard to stand up against the majority.

If the judge was a Democratic appointee, I would expect it. A Bush-appointee judge? There’s still a high chance of dismissal. But any dismissal will be appealed. Comey’s best chance may be for SCOTUS to slow walk its ruling.

That would require incredible physical courage on the part of the judge.

The judge is a GOP political appointee. For most cases, that probably doesn’t matter. But when it comes to an AFAIK typical Republican, standing up to the government when it comes to an alleged presidential safety issue, I don’t see it. If judge Louise Flanagan is no longer much of a Republican, sure, but there is no way to know that.

Might the case be dismissed with SCOTUS allowing the dismissal to stand? Sure. Very possible. And it is also very possible the case goes to trial. And it is even more possible that Comey makes a deal to avoid prison, just like the great majority of other federal defendants. Comey has disappointed progressives before.

What’s confusing me is why all of a sudden there is trust in the restraint and wisdom of James Comey, and of voters and judges in a place like New Bern NC. I think they face a moral test the outcome of which none here can predict.

28

ICE is taking notes. Or is it the other way around?

In a just world (HAHAHAH) impeachment should just take an hour or two. Then they can go out for lunch.

29

No he didn’t.

This is never making it in front of a jury.

30

It’s not an admission that he crossed a line. After posting, Comey admitted that he did not think there was anything wrong/bad with seashells forming 86 47, but that after posting, he later came to understand some people might view it differently. So he took the post down.

With that, the indictment is likely factually and legally fatally flawed. Factually no threat because Comey would have needed to appreciate forming seashells into 86 47 was a threat. He did not. Legally, the indictment says the standard to determine whether forming seashells into 86 47 is a threat or not is determined by a “reasonable recipient” of the Instagram post. That is a legally incorrect (objective) standard in this instance; it should be a subjective standard, one that Comey would have had to understand as a threat when he posted. Which he immediately admitted he did not have that understanding.

Late: Having said that, this is a reason lawyer’s tell people not to talk. If Comey says nothing, then there’s nothing. I supposed it’s hard to know when to do that when the crime is made up.

31

I would say the same of an indictment. I’m not a Comey fan, but this banana republic shit is disgraceful to what was once a better country.

32

It was better just 2 years ago.

33

Same. When has it gone too far at DOJ where it can’t be undone and go back to normal with proper leadership. The DOJ lesson is if don’t go after Trump’s enemies you’re fired. If you want to keep your job/Trump’s good graces, bring any kind of made up charge. The types of DOJ lawyers, which used to be a tiny handful that would do that, are becoming much more the norm with every passing month. Filter out good ethical lawyers, replace with garbage.

Fortunately, the Judges don’t filter that fast.

34

But are you really surprised? Trump uses people like tissues, discarding them when they are of no longer use.

How about photos of addresses at 8647 this or that street.

35

That’s good. 8647 Dedman Street is apparently not far from me.

God forbid a phone number ends in 8647. Actively typing out a Presidential “threat” across State lines every time you call. Get ready 86 48, you’re next…

36

Shame on the grand jury. They always said a grand jury would indict a ham sandwich, but this is a ham sandwich minus the ham and minus the bread. Every single grand juror should hang his head in shame and the whole DOJ needs to be replaced on 1-20-29.

37

This bears repeating.

In Watts, the protester said

And the court said that was political hyperbole.

Even if Comey understood “86” to be a reference to executing Trump, he still has the defense that it was just political talk.

38

If I understand correctly, it was an 8 - 1 decision.

I expect it would be closer if revisited.

39

Whose properties? Trump doesn’t own any properties.

40

The term here is chilling effect.

Everyone in the Trump administration, probably even Trump himself in his more lucid moments, knows that there’s zero chance of winning this case. But winning isn’t the point.

By filing this case, the Trump administration is forcing Comey to hire a lawyer and spend time and money. The Trump administration, on the other hand, is spending tax payer money, so they don’t care if they’re wasting it.

Even after Comey wins, other people will see the problems he went through and decide that they don’t want to face similar harassment. So they’ll start tailoring what they say and do in order not to become a potential target.