I know very little about Sen.-elect Brown, save that he has a wife and two daughters, so he has either two or more bathrooms or he pees on a tree when at home. I do know that his candidacy is viewed with enthusiastic approval by the financial and corporate world, and that is quite enough to give me pause.
The people elected a Democrat to that office. :dubious: Did you forget that part?
Did you also forget the part about Kennedy’s death meaning the difference between the GOP having filibuster power and not, had the problem of leaving the seat unfilled been left unaddressed?
So the part about the interests of democracy went right over your head, did it?
A claim of “incredible spin” indeed, and followed by a long partisan rant. Sheesh. :rolleyes:
Elvis1Lives, I know we’ve argued this before, but I’m feeling expansive and generous. I’ll grant you, that even though it was mainly for partisan reasons, the change in law in 2004 to allow a special election served democracy. But why did the change in 2009 to reinstate a temporary Senator serve democracy? Strictly because of the then current 60-40 numbers? You keep on talking about a Republican governor making a partisan move - if a Republican governor is elected again, would it serve democracy to repeal the 2009 law, and go back to no Senator at all until the special election?
Yes. Let’s wait until he’s in office for 3 days before nominating him for a Nobel Peace Prize.
Ran out of editing time.
The Louisiana Purchase did not go to a Republican.
The Nebraska Blackmail was not threatened against a Republican.
Are you really serious about not knowing how to do math or did you just make up the number 80%?
60 Democrats do not have to put up with a filibuster or make consessions.
You Dems had your chance and blew it.
Then who should pay for it? The point of my question was if it is fair to go to Blue Cross and say, “I’m sick and my medical bills will be thousands a month. I didn’t pay for insurance when I was healthy but I want coverage now.” How much of your monthly pay are you willing to give up? How much do you expect me to give?
The people elected a Republican governor with the knowledge that he could appoint a replacement (presumably a Republican) in case a seat became vacant.
They elected a Democrat with the knowledge that he would not be able to appoint a replacement in case a seat became vacant.
In each case the legislature acted to change the rules in the middle of the game.
This is bad news for the Democratic party, if people like me are accused of (presumably Republican) partisan rants. We are exactly the reason that Coakley lost. It is the same thing in reverse microcosm as happened to the pubs in Congress in 2006. Having total control they behaved very badly and were punished at the polls, and then smacked down some more in 2008. In Mass we just got tired of the same thing at the state level, and Coakley was at least in the wrong place at the wrong time, and she positively exuded the arrogance of a party who believes the real elections are the primaries and the general is merely a coronation. Right now it is hard to find anyone who will admit to having voted for Coakley, but even harder to find someone who knows anything about Brown’s positions. He was the ultimate empty suit candiate. That should tell you something about the race. Even the blue collar union rank-and-file came out for Brown, more or less because he was not Coakley.
If I have issues with UHC bills they are largely because they do not go far enough. The problem with not getting this passed is that some of the democrats seem to be in the pocket of the business interests as well. I would rather they just went hard left, brave the filibuster and wage the war of ideas in public.
Essentially, yes. If Kennedy’s seat had been left vacant, the GOP would have regained (and, of course, used) a filibuster power that they had not earned or been granted by We the People.
Additionally, the people of MA would have had less effective constituent service during the period of vacancy. That matters too - it’s a major part of a Congressmember’s job.
Of course not. Why would you think so? Having elected representatives elected rather than appointed is the very basis democracy. Did that really require an explanation? Or does democracy just not matter all that much to some folks?
But with exactly zero expectation that the ancient rule from the horse-and-buggy days would come into play.
When would a change not have been in the middle of the game?
Perhaps you can enlighten us with your own understanding of the nature and value of democracy. It might advance the discussion a bit. Can you, in fact, differentiate between politics and policy, between partisanship and statecraft? Show us some evidence you took Civics class seriously, would you?
That’s all you did, scream about how corrupt the MA Democrats are, but with exactly zero connection to the discussion. It is “bad news” not only for the parties but for the nation if no higher principle than partisanship can even be recognized to exist. Your own screed is just the latest example of many we’ve seen of that, on this very board.
Then you shouldn’t have voted for the guy who promised to stop them altogether, should you? Or did party automatically come first?
Well, that wouldn’t, by itself, be less than legitimate. If a candidate seems more or less trustworthy, but you disagree on one particular subject, I can see voting for that candidate. Better that than voting for someone untrustworthy, however much they may claim to embrace our views. You have to give a pass on that.
I didn’t say repeal the 2004 law and eliminate the special election. I said repeal the 2009 law and go with 1 Senator until the special election. So we’d wouldn’t have an appointed representative, we’d have no representative until we could elect one. Either that’s good for democracy or it isn’t. So which is it? Was the 2009 law giving the governor power to appoint a Senator for 5 months good for democracy or not?
Isn’t he a Lieutenant Colonel vs. a full Colonel?
Is there a treatment or cure for his nervous affliction of sticking his tongue out of the left side of his mouth every few sentences, a la the erstwhile Senator John Edwards?
What make is his pickup truck?
And Cerberus, they also elected other Republic Party governors recently.
Mercedes-Benz.
Um… where the fuck is the debate here?
It was originally in MPSIMS. Got moved because political impacts were discussed. Debate whatever you wish, friend RNATB:
- Is he the male Palin?
- Is this the beginning of the end for Obama?
- Are his daughter’s actually hot?
- Should Republicans drive pick-up trucks? Does his dog ride in the back or the cab?
- What does his wife drive?
- Should “family values” politicians pose nude?
- Does Shagnasty have a point, or just a man-crush?
- Add your own here.
- How long before he totally, publicly steps on his dick. (He has already shown symptopms of Biden’s Syndrome.)
I opened it figuring it was a debate on whether one has to actually serve a couple of minutes as a Senator before one’s greatness can be determined.
- No - no Chanel eyeglasses.
- No, that’ll be the Middling Patriotic War of 2014. Don’t ask.
- Daddy is loaded, so they’re automatically bangable.
- Well, they’re not really qualified to carry passengers. One dog goes in the cab, one in the bed.
- A Nissan Murano.
- I can’t imagine any better tool for preventing sex than images of middle aged Republicans in the news.
- Syphilis, actually.
- If Republicans who offend Rush Limbaugh are required to make a pilgrimage to EIB Studios to perform penitence, do the ones who offend Glenn Beck also have to go… wherever it is that Glenn Beck broadcasts from?
Who in America awarded that? What does that have to do with anything?
Well, it’s increasingly looking like House Dems are going to scuttle the health care bill. Yay, I’ll still be unable to get insurance!
At least there’s still the emergency room to go to.
Just before the election, I saw a report on the news about how he went to great pains to downplay his party affiliation. He was never introduced as a Republican at rallies and speeches. His touring vehicles, including a big bus with his name on it, didn’t have the word “Republican” on them anywhere. His campaign signs didn’t say “Republican”. It’s as though he was ashamed of it.