I’m in the dark, here! Why doesn’t the red light expose the film during the development process?
“They’re coming to take me away ha-ha, ho-ho, hee-hee, to the funny farm where life is beautiful all the time… :)” - Napoleon IV
I’m sure red light didn’t bother the old black and white developing of most papers.
But does it still hold for developing Ektachrome or Kodachrome?
Are you developing prints at home? college?
Are you driving with your eyes open or are you using The Force? - A. Foley
Black and white photography is not very sensitive the red part of the spectrum. At worst a red light would create an all-over grayish cast which can be easily corrected.
Color photography, however, is as sensitive to red as black and white is to a 100 watt light bulb. Color film is processed and prints are made in a completely black chamber.
I understand all the words, they just don’t make sense together like that.
Now, mind you, it’s black and white photo paper that doesn’t mind red light so much. Undeveloped film is sensitive to red light, and you have to handle it in complete darkness.
Kunilou, then how does the photographer see what the heck he’s doing? I know some amateurs who used to undertake the burden of developing color film, but I never thought to ask them. They’d tell me of the painstaking effort to get the shade or tint correct, etc.
“They’re coming to take me away ha-ha, ho-ho, hee-hee, to the funny farm where life is beautiful all the time… :)” - Napoleon IV
Now, mind you, it’s black and white photo paper that doesn’t mind red light so much. Undeveloped film is sensitive to red light, and you have to handle it in complete darkness.
Black and white film is orthochromatic, it is not sensitive to the red spectrum. (Or green and some browns.)
Color film is panchromatic, it is sensitive to the entire spectrum of color, else it wouldn’t be color film.
Actually, black and white negative film is panchromatic; it’s the paper it’s printed on that’s orhto. But if the paper is left out in the red light for too long, or is too close to the red light source, it will “fog”.
Koda-and Ektachrome films are panchromatic, they are only handled in total darkness.
Did you know that “Chrome” comes from the Greek for 'color"?
If it jams, force it; if it breaks, it needed replacing anyway.
Black and white film is orthochromatic, it is not sensitive to the red spectrum. (Or green and some browns.)
Color film is panchromatic, it is sensitive to the entire spectrum of color, else it wouldn’t be color film.
Actually, black and white negative film is panchromatic; it’s the paper it’s printed on that’s orhto. But if the paper is left out in the red light for too long, or is too close to the red light source, it will “fog”.
Koda-and Ektachrome films are panchromatic, they are only handled in total darkness.
Did you know that “Chrome” comes from the Greek for 'color"?
If it jams, force it; if it breaks, it needed replacing anyway.
Now, mind you, it’s black and white photo paper that doesn’t mind red light so much. Undeveloped film is sensitive to red light, and you have to handle it in complete darkness.
Black and white film is orthochromatic, it is not sensitive to the red spectrum. (Or green and some browns.)
Color film is panchromatic, it is sensitive to the entire spectrum of color, else it wouldn’t be color film.
Actually, black and white negative film is panchromatic; it’s the paper it’s printed on that’s orhto. But if the paper is left out in the red light for too long, or is too close to the red light source, it will “fog”.
Koda-and Ektachrome films are panchromatic, they are only handled in total darkness.
Did you know that “Chrome” comes from the Greek for 'color"?
Now, if someone already answered this, forgive the repetition. I tried posting this at about 4:00PM (eastern) when the GQ board locked up. Now that it’s back, I see eight replies on the contents page, but only three on the page itself.
So I have my fingers crossed for this to post.
If it jams, force it; if it breaks, it needed replacing anyway.
I’m a professional photographer that does lots and lots of b&w darkroom work.
Quote:
“Black and white film is orthochromatic, it is not sensitive to the red spectrum. (Or green and some browns.)”
That is not correct. Black and white film is PANchromatic. That is why you have to load the film into the developing tank in complete darkness. If it were orthochromatic, you could load it under safelight conditions; but you can’t. If you shoot a b&w photo of a red apple, it will expose the film and you will get an image. What confuses alot of people is the fact that
red and green look very similar in b&w due to the fact that they reflect very similar amounts of light. Black and white film only records the intensity of light, and not the color saturation, so red and green look the same shade of gray.
It used to be in the old days that b&w film WAS orthochromatic. That made for some strange looking photos. (Imagine people with white lips) Chemicals were added to the emulsion to make it more sensitive to all colors of the spectrum
There was definitly something wrong with the GQ board this afternoon. I never meant to triple post, and I’m sure phouka didn’t either. I kept trying to post and the damn thing kept timing out, and then I lost the board (thought the hackers were back), you can read all about in the “Slow Servers” thread over at ATMB.
Now, back to the OP:
As for how the photographer handles panchromatic film in the dark? Practice. In my days as a process photographer in the graphic arts, I’d use pan film a lot, when shooting color copy for b/w reproduction, and always when making color seperations. Working with pan film was simple:
You learned your darkroom well, and kept everything where you knew you could find it, and always put it back in the same place.
The film came in sheets, with a set of notches in one corner, as it is important to know the emulsion side of the film. (The emulsion side is a bit more sensitive, and always faces the subject of the picture. It’s also the side of any negative that scratches. With the notches in the upper right hand corner, the emulsion was facing you.
The types of notches also are a code for the type of film. There will be one or two short notches, a long one, a single short one , and so forth, the combinations having to do with film speed and whether it was daylight or tungsten film.
Okay, now you know a bit more than you probably wanted, but be grateful: By next week you’ll have forgotten this, but me, tortured soul that I am, I’ll still remember.
:eek:
If it jams, force it; if it breaks, it needed replacing anyway.
As a Photo lab tech myself, I agree in principle to everything Larson said. I will add, however; that not all darkroom lights are red–our are amber. Needless to say, aerial photography that is used for mapping doesn’t need to be in color.
It matters not whether you win or lose; what matters is whether I win or lose.
When making color prints, you can work in the light up to the point where you get the paper out of the ‘safe’ (a light tight box or envelope).
So, you rack the neg (or slide) in the carrier, put the carrier in the enlarger, frame and focus your enlargement under dim light on the white (or light colored) surface of the enlarger base or your paper holder.
Once everything is lined up, you kill the lights, and by feel, open the safe, get your paper out and into position on the enlarger base, then hit the timer to turn on the enlarger light.
After exposing the paper, you (again by feel) take the paper off the enlarger base, and either put it in the tray with the 1st developer, or for most home developers, put the paper in a developing tank, which is light tight, but allows you pour in and out the chemicals needed to develop the image.
Once the paper is in the tank, or is far enough along in the development that it is no longer light sensitive, you turn the lights back on and finish up.
If the print is too light, too dark, needs a color correction, or you messed up the crop, you repeat the whole thing, but with the needed corrections.
Once I get the color dialed in for a film & paper batch, I usually get a good print in two tries (or one if there isn’t a bunch of exposure variation from frame to frame). But I’ve gone as many as five when for some reason I just can’t get the color right. Pro’s or advanced amateurs probably do better.
Ugly
Go ahead, be frank with me.
In fact, be anyone you’d like.
joemill sorry, I should have indicated that I was talking about graphic arts films (line and halftone)which are ortho, as well as b/w paper. (I do fine art printing, myself.) I did say b/w neg film (and color) are pan; in fact, I said it three times. I was so flustered with the behavoir of the board that I wasn’t making myself clear, or proofreading to well (I’ve got to remember to close parenthisis.
And Bosda, yes, brown is recommended for lots of paper, I know Ilford wants you to use it. I use all Ilford paper and films, but my light are red neons that I got from my old job. (When they started getting more digital they closed a lot of darkrooms.)
But they’re all five feet in the air, well removed, and I’ve never had a problem. Plus, they’ll probably last forever.
Good shooting to you.
If it jams, force it; if it breaks, it needed replacing anyway.
One thing I’ve noticed among fellow film developers: most close their eyes while loading film into the developing tanks. Why? The light is off and there is nothing to look at anyway. I do it myself.
An amusing story (now; not at the time): an old photographer friend of mine once shot a wedding (back in the 40’s or 50’s when most things were shot in b&w) on b&w film. He did his own darkroom work and went to develop the film. He completely loaded all the film in the developing takns and opened his eyes to turn the light on; only to find that he never turned the light off, he just closed his eyes! The entire wedding was exposed! OUCH!
I used to do film inside of a dustproof (tough to do) lightproof (also tough) cloth bag with hand openings on each end. It was big enough so I could slide a single tank inside, a roll of film, the tank’s plastic strip on which the roll of film was to be wrapped, a weight (to keep the film in solution once it was added), that tank’s top and with lights still on put the tank and film together inside the lightproof bag.
Once the tank is loaded it is lightproof on its own and can be removed from the bag along with other leftovers. I could then just continue in the regular light.
Printing is quite different-one or the other or both descriptions of printing above seem exactly right - not sure of which since there are duplicates of duplicates of posts.
Are you driving with your eyes open or are you using The Force? - A. Foley
I heard a similar story about a darkroom trainee; he was learning how to load tanks by loading outdated film with his eyes closed. He’d gotten quite good at it, so the boss gave him an important rush job. Well the kid goes into the darkroom, loads the tank, and has heart failure when he opens his eyes.
I noticed about myself: Working in a pan darkroom, I always tended to keep my eyes closed during everything I did, it seemed to helpme keep my balance better that way in the dark. I always felt off-kilter with my eyes open, maybe it’s more natural to the brain, if it’s not seeing anything, to be more comfortable with the eyes closed.
If it jams, force it; if it breaks, it needed replacing anyway.