Deasil vs. Kerosene vs. Home Heating Oil vs. Jet Fuel

Factual Questions
1

I figure these are very close chemically to each other as the terms are sometimes interchanged as well as the actual fuel in some cases. So what is the difference between them?

In our home in the mountains we use kerosene in our ‘home heating oil’ furnace - it works fine as far as I know even though it was designed for HHO. The reason as I was told was that HHO will gell at low temps while Kero won’t. I would think the gelling would stop the flow into the furnace. I was told that HHO is not as refined as kero - kind of the sudge of the family.

I have also been told that deasil fuel could be used in a kero heater and kero could be used in a DF engine. Is there any dis/advantages to using an alternative fuel (other then price, fear of the taxman, or availability).

Also how does jet fuel fit into this?

2

Here are a few of the answers:

http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=31703&highlight=kerosene+heating

They are all extremely similar and largely interchangeable as far as I know. Jet fuel is basically just kerosene.

3

I know that a few years ago here in the UK the price of diesel used to go up slightly in the winter. I was told that this was because the raw material was diverted to make heating oil and so hiked up the price of diesel. I don’t think that happens so much now.

4

I’ll second that jet fuel is basically just fancy kerosene. And diesel and kerosene ain’t much different.

However, aside from the “road tax” issue (and "aviation fuel tax issue in aircraft), keep in mind that these fuels are often intended for different applications. Jet fuel has additives and conditioners to allow the fuel to flow under extremely low temperatures, prevent condensation, and so forth that your kerosene-for-the-space-heater doesn’t And those additives probably are really unhealthy for humans to breathe, as are their combustion products.

And while jets will run on diesel fuel, the stuff at the pump is not formulated for maximum performance in a high-horsepower jet turbine. For that matter, there are different grades of jet fuel, some with extremely narrow applications.

So while it’s possible to interchange some of this stuff to a limited degree you’re probably better off not doing so unless, for example, you are in iminent danger of freezing to death.

5

I prefer widdershins to deasil.

Sorry, I just had to say that.

6

There’s also diesel fuel #1, diesel fuel #2, etc. My guess is they are not the same thing. While they may work interchangeably for certain uses or applications, they may not work right in others.

7

My grandpa used to work for a TWA subsidiary that did repair work on private planes. He was the electrical engineer, and he and other would have to drain the fuel out of the jets. He, when it was still allowed, would take the fuel home and run it through his home furnace. Just thought id pass it on.

8

I’m so glad I’m not the only one. First thing that popped into my head.

9

Iv’e heard people using jet fuel that they cound get their hands on in cars too psychomonkey

10

Anyone else use kerosene on a ‘home heating oil’ furnace - or was I just sold a higher price fuel that I really don’t need?

If it matters winter temps could range from 0F to -40 F (apx -20C to -40C) for an extended time at an extream.

11

Well now I confess that I’m truly perplexed. Around here yacht owners will pays 10’s of thousands of dollars more for a yacht with diesel power as opposed to gasoline power. The principal reason is that diesel is much less volatile than gasoline, and thus the problem of explosions in engine compartments with leaking fuel systems is avoided.

I always thought that the fuel in jet engines was highly volatile.

12

Nope. If you’re quick (and stupid) enough, you can put out matches in a bucket of Jet A. I wouldn’t recommend it, though.
(note: I’ve never personally tried it, but I’ve talked to several people who have)

13

The formulation we used in the navy had a minimum flash point of 140 degF this included JP5 jet fuel and F76 for use in the propulsion boilers. They were the same grade of fuel but had different additives. We frequently burned JP5 in our boilers but never to my knowledge was F76 used in aircraft.

In comparison, the flashpoint of gasoline is about -45 degF.

14

I’m gonna guess you got ripped off. I used to live in a heating oil house. You can use kerosene in place of home heating oil, but you don’t need it. This was in the cold Mid-West. There didn’t seem to be any difference between the oil and the kerosene, although I think kerosene burns at a bit higher temp. than the oil.

When we ran out of fuel oil, we’d replace it with kerosene until we could get the oil guys to come out. We could get the kerosene at the local gas station. Don’t ask me how many times we had to fill the gas can though.:rolleyes:

I was so happy when my parent’s landlord bought a new furnace and we could go back to natural gas. That was what we had at the previous house. We actually had to heat the house with propane for a winter during the switch over. That was really expensive.

15

Kerosene has more BTUs to it than home heating oil (which is little more than undyed diesel). IAC, it shouldn’t gell at all. The reason being that it’s a fairly simple matter to put additives into the fuel to keep it from gelling, and one would think that the refiner would do this at the plant (since they do that with gasolene). (You could always buy the stuff truckers dump in their tanks and add it to yours.) Sounds to me like ya got ripped.

16

Kerosene actually has less energy value than diesel or heating fuels. Refining takes out waxes and other combustibles that provide add’l btu’s. Gas is lowest right on thru bunker fuels they use for large ships being highest/gal. They are also safer because of higher flashpoints. They do tend to “gel” at low temps. The waxes solidify.

17

I’ve always been curious when I see zombies revived–How did you find this thread, did you notice that it was 11 years old when posting, and what compelled you to create an account and post an answer?

18

What is the difference between these fuels and charcoal lighter fluid? I have often dumped my excess lighter fluid in the kerosene tank at the start of winter.

19

Maybe I can clear this up as I put 15 years in Cincinnati’s Gulf Oil Refinery.

The easiest was I’ve found to teach this to the guys I trained on the stills was to relate it to a deck of cards: The lightest ends in the crude oil are propane, butane, methane, ethane,and other anes and enes that make up that end of the spectrum would relate to the 1’s, 2’s, and 3’s, in the deck. The other end of the spectrum would be asphalt and reduced crude would be Kings and Aces in the deck. All the other hydrocarbons like diesel, jet A, etc fall between those two extremes.

Someone mentioned Jet A being Kerosene and that’s correct. It’s taken from the Atmospheric tower of the Crude unit, as all of these products will be, and this one is sent to a ‘Gulfiner’ unit, run thru a reactor to separate the sulphur from the kerosene then run into another tower where a slight bit of lighter end, about a 3, is removed, and the Jet A, a 4 is sent to its own tank to wait for a truck or barge to pick it up.
The reason the lighter end (3) was removed earlier was to control what is called the “flash temperature”. You want that to be high enough that the jet will light slowly and you can see it spread away from you, as if you were lighting a charcoal fire. NOT! like if you were trying to light a bit of gasoline and it flashes so suddenly on you that you are startled.

Diesel fuel (5) can be made two ways: The easiest way is it can be taken off the Atmospheric tower just a little below where the kerosene is drawn off. It is sent thru a large heat exchanger where it is cooled before it goes to the field to wait to be shipped or barged out.

The second way to make diesel is a little more involved: We take a cut from a different still called the “Catalytic Cracking Recovery Unit” (this was my still most of the time) from the tower called the ‘fractionator’ at the at the Light Catalytic Gasoil level and this goes to the Gulfiner when it’s not making JetA and the process is exactly the same except the temperatures are different.

As far as home heating oil goes, that’s diesel oil(5). Winterized diesel has kerosene added to it to keep it from jelling up. We do not do either of these things in the refinery, I guess they do them in the bulk plant. You don’t want any more kerosene put in your diesel than necessary as kero has less BTUs. But on the other hand, you don’t want your line to the furnace pump jelling up either.

Grit, 140F is dead on for kero and JetA.

Hope this was of some help and wasn’t too wordy.

Phu Cat

20

Maybe I can clear this up as I put 15 years in Cincinnati’s Gulf Oil Refinery.

The easiest was I’ve found to teach this to the guys I trained on the stills was to relate it to a deck of cards: The lightest ends in the crude oil are propane, butane, methane, ethane,and other anes and enes that make up that end of the spectrum would relate to the 1’s, 2’s, and 3’s, in the deck. The other end of the spectrum would be asphalt and reduced crude would be Kings and Aces in the deck. All the other hydrocarbons like diesel, jet A, etc fall between those two extremes.

Someone mentioned Jet A being Kerosene and that’s correct. It’s taken from the Atmospheric tower of the Crude unit, as all of these products will be, and this one is sent to a ‘Gulfiner’ unit, run thru a reactor to separate the sulphur from the kerosene then run into another tower where a slight bit of lighter end, about a 3, is removed, and the Jet A, a 4 is sent to its own tank to wait for a truck or barge to pick it up.
The reason the lighter end (3) was removed earlier was to control what is called the “flash temperature”. You want that to be high enough that the jet will light slowly and you can see it spread away from you, as if you were lighting a charcoal fire. NOT! like if you were trying to light a bit of gasoline and it flashes so suddenly on you that you are startled.

Diesel fuel (5) can be made two ways: The easiest way is it can be taken off the Atmospheric tower just a little below where the kerosene is drawn off. It is sent thru a large heat exchanger where it is cooled before it goes to the field to wait to be trucked or barged out.

The second way to make diesel is a little more involved: We take a cut from a different still called the “Catalytic Cracking Recovery Unit” (this was my still most of the time) from the tower called the ‘fractionator’ at the at the Light Catalytic Gasoil level and this goes to the Gulfiner when it’s not making JetA and the process is exactly the same except the temperatures are different.

As far as home heating oil goes, that’s diesel oil(5). Winterized diesel has kerosene added to it to keep it from jelling up. We do not do either of these things in the refinery, I guess they do them in the bulk plant. You don’t want any more kerosene put in your diesel than necessary as kero has less BTUs. But on the other hand, you don’t want your line to the furnace pump jelling up either.

Grit, 140F is dead on for kero and JetA.

Hope this was of some help and wasn’t too wordy.