Glad to hear you’re keeping up with your cat’s maintenance. You are right in saying not all cats tolerate trimming with ease. But as I’ve often heard, if it’s done regularly, and started early, then odds are more in your favor.
DeskMonkey,
I have to edit my last post. Forget the penguin, chicken, or turkey. Just go for the jugular and get the Ostrich. Smart, FAST, and cunning. Plus, he’ll kick anyone’s ass that comes into the backyard. Now there’s a bird that works FOR you, forget all that slavery YOU have to endure with lesser birds.
NOTE: I live 10 miles from an actual Ostrich farm. It’s smack dead center in a neighborhood, which looks rather odd (Blade Runner-esque). I hear ostrich eggs, and meat, are pretty good eating. No need to clip their wings, and it can live outdoors easily.
My cat is declawed. Like Kinsey, we went the laser route when declawing Athena. She was home the same day and as far as I could tell suffered no ill effects of the surgery. There was no blood, no stitches, and except for giving her antibiotics to make sure she didn’t get an infection, I couldn’t tell she’d be declawed. It’s been almost two years since she’s been declawed and she’s the same sweet kittie I got from the SPCA. She still uses the scratching post even though she has no front claws and she still scratches the couch and sofa.
Do I worry about her getting out? No. She is strictly an indoor cat and shows no desire to go outside. Ever. Even if I’m in the backyard (it’s fenced) she won’t come outside. She won’t even go into the garage. She stays in the house all the time except for the yearly visit to the vet or when we go on vacation.
The simple fact is if cats were not ever declawed, or it was illegal to declaw them, then there would be an enormous number of unwanted kitties going to be euthanized.
Don’t assume that because someone has their cat declawed that they have not tried scratching posts, water bottles, scents, trimming, etc. Sometimes it just doesn’t work. In fact, a lot of the time.
I’ve adopted a lot of kitties in my time - I will hazard more than the OP has. They have all been given enormous amounts of love, the best food, attention, medical care, and comfort. The OP is insulting to me in that she implies that by having declawing done I was only interested in maiming, mutilating, and being cruel to my cats to save my “precious furnishings”. I don’t know if the OP is old enough to have spent hard-earned money on actual furnishings, let alone owns her own house. Those things do make a difference. But I do not feel that I am being cruel ro my kitties in the grand scheme of life, when 100% of the cats I adopt have been strays - sometimes sick strays - that were headed for euthanasia without a doubt.
Re birds in cages: Our cockatiels prefer their cage to the outside world. They seem to think of it as their den. The door has been accidentally left open and they did not leave the cage. We used to clip them, but we don’t anymore.
Re docking dogs’ tails as aesthetic: Not always. Many sporting breeds are docked so that their tails don’t become caught in brush. The poodle clip was also originally functional (I forget why; a little research should dig it up).
Re declawing: FWIW, our vet does not declaw cats that are more than a year old. (None of our cats are declawed, as they’re all outdoor cats.)
By the way, gadgetgirl, I assume that you are a vegan? Can’t have any cruelty to animals.
Is anyone else channeling that Bloom County strip where the guys are all hanging from a tree by their ankles and holding their breaths to avoid trampling insects or killing microbes?
What, now that I’m at a point in my life where I can afford nice furniture, I have to choose between my cats and my furniture? I spent too many years with cheap-ass furniture. I still have some, but my clawer preferred the good stuff. Solid walnut is apparently much more satisfying to scratch up than cheap pressboard and veneer.
Obviously, I’ve failed as a cat owner. :rolleyes:
The fact that all three were adopted from a shelter (not a no-kill shelter, either) and that they are well-fed, have regular vet care, have free run of the house, are extremely well-loved, have lots of sunny windows to relax in, and a screened-in porch for their bird-and-squirrel watching isn’t enough.
Should I take them back to the shelter or just let them out to run free? :rolleyes:
Just to be very clear: The flat-headed, bug-eating, chubb-faced, vicious little heat vampire that lives with me is not my friend, she is my pet. Ours is not an equal partnership; I am her owner.
So far as claw trimming: I’ll give 100 USD to anyway who can trim my cats claws without using tranquilizers or needing minor surgery afterwards. She is a mean little brute and has been since she was very, very young. She despises all other carbon-based life forms and tolerates me because I’m: a) controlling the food supply, b) a good source of radiant heat, and c) outmassing her by a factor of 10. It took me 12 years to get her to accept semi-regular grooming from me and she still won’t allow anyone to groom her stomach. So claw trimming is not a viable option.
On the other hand, I will not have her declawed. I prefer my pet able to defend herself, if necessary, and she only claws up the kitchen carpet. (Which is an unsightly horror and therefore can only be improved by being shredded.) I prefer a pet who can tag back in a fight, even if it means keeping a large supply of isopropyl alcohol in the house for cleansing the occasional gaping wound. Also, my pet was formerly an outdoor cat and I’d like her to regain that status some day soon. (If she’s out slaughtering pigeons, she’s not in the house scratching me. Win-win situation.)
Finally, I know of several cats whose owners reluctantly decided on declawing; none of the animals appeared to suffer any bad side-effects. None of them became deranged, none of them were in pain, none of them died young or started huffing crack or listening to Brittney Spears or selling Amway. I think that perhaps individual cats have (surprise!) individual reactions, some which reactions may depend on the competency, or lack thereof, of the surgeon.
In my experience, the “girls’” cat (wife & daughter–cat & I don’t get along so well) seems to claw stuff up more after a trimming in order to sharpen its claws. AFAIK, that’s a large part of why cats claw. YMMV.
But as to the analogy of trimming fingernails, can I get some clippers and cut the claws back behind the flesh? Or will that cause some damage. That’s as false as comparing claws to the first joint of human fingers. Cats don’t use their claws as grasping/poking/whatever tools like humans do. If you were to cut off my fingers, I’d have trouble going about my daily routines in such areas as typing, playing musical instruments, and eating. A cat has not such troubles without its claws. It can still eat, it can still sit in your lap (when it wants to); it can still do everything but defend itself against small dogs (big dogs will win anyhow) and kill birds.
The wife wants a new couch soon. Before I’ll whip out the credit card for a $1000 piece of furniture, she’s going to have to agree to $100 to get laser removal of the claws on the cat we got for free. Basic economics: nobody else wants to take our full-grown cat and I’m not about to buy it an expensive scratching post.
Disclaimer: we all love animals in this house. At the moment, we have a dog that we recently rescued from a shelter, a cat that we rescued from a vet’s office, and a hamster. We have had dogs and cats together for the last 14 years, and have added such things as snakes, fish, and turtles on and off over the years. Generally, I describe us as owning a dog, cat, hamster, and a 6-year old girl.
ISTR reading somewhere that, because poodles were originally used for water retrieval, most of the fur was clipped off to prevent the dogs from getting waterlogged, but fur was left longer around the chest for warmth in cold water.
BTW, my Shan-cat is declawed (he was declawed when I first got him) and I’d like to point out that some of us can guarantee that the likelihood of our indoor cats getting out is practically zero. In the first place, in order to get outside, he’d have to get through three doors and down a flight of stairs. Additionally, he’s never even tried to get out, even on the three occasions that the door was left wide open and unwatched for several minutes.
Would it surprise you to know that I think you’re 100% wrong here, Coldfire? I guess you think I’m either a heartless bitch or unfit to have a cat, since Mewkitty is declawed, huh?
I think it is you who is completely missing the point. If it doesn’t hurt the cat (and I have seen no factual evidence to prove to me that it does), then there is NO wellbeing of the home over that of the cat TO consider - the cat isn’t hurt by it. So yes, it IS relevant that it doesn’t “alter the cat’s life.”
I am probably the most humane-hearted person you will every encounter. I rescued dozens of animals off the streets of Mexico when I lived there, including a puppy that had NO fur left because his entire body (including inside his ears, nose and eye sockets) was covered in a blanket of thousands of fleas, a kitten that had part of his intestines OUTSIDE his body, a dog who’d been blinded by someone throwing something caustic in his eyes, and many, many more in various states of health and found homes for all of the most sick and injured. I worked with local vets and got them to provide spay and neuter services for the equivalent of about $6US (at the time) so that I could at least get the cats who roamed the resorts fixed, even if they had to be put back on the resort property because there just weren’t enough homes for all of them. But at least they wouldn’t be creating MORE unwanted cats! And I organized a grass-roots movement that lobbied the Mexican government and finally got permits (and land donated!) to build a shelter for the street animals.
And you know what I’ve just been through with the stray I took in off the street, and all the wounds I have from him scratching me to near shreds - IN SPITE of having his nails trimmed as bluntly as possible every time they started getting sharp again. (And don’t think that just because he had claws, that he was safe from predators outdoors. You know why I had to bring him inside in the first place… because he’d had his throat ripped open in a fight with another cat!)
But I declawed my indoor only cat, so I should never be allowed to own one.
Right.
Seems to me that you could use a liiiiittle bit of ignorance erradication on this issue, hon. If it’s a personal matter of choice for you, and you wouldn’t have one of your cats declawed, fine. But please don’t pass judgement on those of us who find that it’s perfectly within humane boundries to have our indoor cats’ claws removed so that we don’t end up looking like the contents of a paper shredder at the end of the day.
I pretty much said my bit in this GD thread, I’m basically with the OP. But I don’t think it’s totally black and white. Like Cranky’s example. In a truly extreme case, it’s much better than getting rid of the cat (which for most adults means sooner or later being euthanized, either by the owner or the animal shelter).
Much like I understand and support cats being indoor only. But my parents had a cat who simply couldn’t be housetrained. So the lesser evil was to make him an outdoor cat. It did shorten his life.
For those who are making blanket statements that it’s no problem, the cat doesn’t care, we don’t know that the cat feels pain, etc. It’s equally valid to say that we don’t know that the cat doesn’t mind, we don’t know how much pain he feels, etc. You’re taking the easy way out, rather than decide with each situation.
I feel the same way about other creatures in general (including people), that they shouldn’t be interfered with lightly. Just because you get to live your life in your head doesn’t mean your wishes are particularly more important than any other creatures. They’re living their lives too, and they also get only one. Get over yourself.
I have a 17 1/2 year old cat who’s suffering from degenerative renal failure. I have to give her subcutaneous fluids every 36 hours and 1/4 of an antacid pill twice a day because her weakened kidney function causes a buildup of acid in her stomach. If she’s in any discomfort at all, believe me, she lets me know in no uncertain terms. The wailing would wake the dead.
And SHE IS NOT IN ANY PAIN OR DISCOMFORT WHATSOEVER FROM BEING WITHOUT HER CLAWS!
For heaven’s sake, people, stop spewing crap you apparently know absolutely nothing at all about.
I KNOW when and if my cat is in any pain. YOU cannot tell me that she MIGHT be in pain but I just don’t know it. That’s just Bullshit.
I have had two kitties in my life since I moved out of my parents home 15 years ago. Both kitties were indoor kitties and niether one were declawed.
Instead of a fine leather couch, I have futons. I would rather have a leather couch but I would much rather have a soft kitty (or kitties) to grace my home and my heart. Until I am completely disheartened to the plight of what is normally natural (except that which is spaying or nuetering) I will have animals in my home and not have my cats declawed or my dogs debarked.
It has been said that declawing a cat is much like removing the fingers on a human on up to the first knuckle. Whether or not this is true is not my concern. I would rather have my kitties live with their claws than yank out parts of their beautiful paws. My female (and my maile may he rest in peace) has beautiful paws and I couldn’t imagine ripping out a part of them like that.
My brother and si-in-law did it to a kitty I found. While I didn’t hate them for it, I was sad they did it.
If you can’t live with a cat unless it’s declawed, then get a gerbil or fish. Imagine if your finger nails were ripped out, at least yours might grow back.
Maybe I’m the fucked up one here, but this is my take:
If, when I was extremely young, there was a procedure done to me that was painless (or I couldn’t remember any pain, and it had no lasting effects) to remove the first digit of my fingers, and there was no reduced functionality, and it assured me a place in a loving home where I’d be safe, I wouldn’t regret it.
Yeah, I know, that was a run-on. I love animals and am for animal rights as much as the next person (or maybe more), but I really can’t see anything to get worked up about. Yeah, if it was painful, I’d oppose it, but it obviously doesn’t have to be.
Cats aren’t human. Attempting to vocalize their feelings for them doesn’t seem advisable. And as I said before, I’m no hypocrite: if the circumstances were similar, I’d have no problem with it being done to humans, too.
It is NOT like removing human fingers. And it damn well SHOULD be your concern IF YOU ARE MISINFORMED. This board is about fighting ignorance and spewing hateful cruelty accusations at people here and claiming not to give a crap about the facts is ignorance at its worst.
Yeah! What Shanya said! (Except for that part about Mexico)
The issue to me is wether or not the cat is harmed during the process. So far, I haven’t seen it shown that it is (And Coldfire, gadgetgirlis proclaiming that it’s cruel and unusual punishment for a cat… the process part, that is).
The why a person has a cat declawed is less important to me than the how they have it done.
Is it humane and as painless as possible? No problem from me then.
That’s why I was asking for cites, sites, or whatever the hell that is. If it’s shown that it’s detrimental to the cat, or is somehow inhumane to the cat, or that it’s needlessly painfull for the cat, then hell, I’ll reconsider my position.
Until then, a couple people telling me that there’s a major problem with it and I should somehow feel guilty or wrong about doing it, I’m going to dismiss it as much as I did this OP.
Show me-- the OP’er of whoever-- where it’s as bad as claim that it is, and I’ll reconsider.
